Family of victim suing US government after son killed from explosion - Polidicks

[QUOTE]A FAMILY is suing the US federal government claiming the explosion that killed their son was caused by a border patrol agent firing a taser gun through the passenger side window of his car. A dashboard video being used in the trial emerged on the internet last week and shows some horrifying images of the incident that resulted in the death of 25-year-old Alex Martin. As the plain clothed patrol agents approach the car, they appear to do little to engage the driver and smash the passenger side window with a torch. The agent then draws his taser gun and shoots in the direction of the driver which appears to spark a huge explosion, throwing the agents backwards.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/family-of-victim-suing-us-government-after-son-killed-from-explosion/story-fnh81jut-1227286811356[/url]

Question for science-y people: Is this a thing which can happen in a car normally, or was there something inside it?

[QUOTE]After the agents fires the taser gun, the car immediately explodes and bursts into flames. [B]Despite the border patrol vehicles reportedly containing fire extinguishers, the agents make no attempt to save the driver and quickly move their own vehicles away from the scene.[/B][/QUOTE] That's sad. I guess they were afraid it was going to explode?

[QUOTE=Jamsponge;47428654]Question for science-y people: Is this a thing which can happen in a car normally, or was there something inside it?[/QUOTE] No idea, but every time I've seen burning cars they never exploded violently blockbuster-style, it was more like a slow-burn.

[QUOTE=Jamsponge;47428654]Question for science-y people: Is this a thing which can happen in a car normally, or was there something inside it?[/QUOTE] Probably, you're talking about a car with a metal frame and highly combustible fuel held in it, seems pretty reasonable that zapping the car could cause an explosion. The cops a fucking retard.

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428667]Probably, you're talking about a car with a metal frame and highly combustible fuel held in it, seems pretty reasonable that zapping the car could cause an explosion. The cops a fucking retard.[/QUOTE]Considering cars normally don't explode even if struck by lightning, there was no reason for them to suspect the tazer would set it on fire. Unless they could actually smell gas fumes, in which case they are morons; but we'll have to wait for the full details to come out.

[QUOTE=RichyZ;47428676]how was the cop supposed to know there was a leaking container outside of plain view?[/QUOTE] I dunno man, but to me it just seems sensible to not tase the electrically conductive object of volatile fuel.

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428693]I dunno man, but to me it just seems sensible to not tase the electrically conductive object of volatile fuel.[/QUOTE] The point is fuel isn't usually supposed to leak out inside the car.

[QUOTE=Swebonny;47428659]That's sad. I guess they were afraid it was going to explode?[/QUOTE] Well it kinda did, and considering a blast like that would've killed anyone inside instantly, it makes sense that their priority would be getting anyone else away from it in case it spread. Also the source on the video here is infowars so take the narrative of it with a couple kilos of salt.

I don't think anybody can blame them for accidentally setting off an explosion using a tazer, but they should have definitely tried to use a fire extinguisher if they had them.

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428667]Probably, you're talking about a car with a metal frame and highly combustible fuel held in it, seems pretty reasonable that zapping the car could cause an explosion. The cops a fucking retard.[/QUOTE] The only retard here is you How the fuck should he have known there was a gas leak? [editline]31st March 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428693]I dunno man, but to me it just seems sensible to not tase the electrically conductive object of volatile fuel.[/QUOTE] Its fine, really [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Flaming" - OvB))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428693]I dunno man, but to me it just seems sensible to not tase the electrically conductive object of volatile fuel.[/QUOTE] you take a lightning strike in a car and be just fine if you're not touching metal components

I really doubt that if the cop was trying to defend himself he wasn't getting his panties in a bunch over zapping the car. Think about how many people probably get tased in their vehicle everyday :v:

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;47428728]I don't think anybody can blame them for accidentally setting off an explosion using a tazer, but they should have definitely tried to use a fire extinguisher if they had them.[/QUOTE] Nah. Explosion clearly killed the driver plus good chance of secondary explosions from the gas tank or something else in the car (remember they didn't know what caused the first explosion). No point risking more lives for someone who is already dead.

They couldn't have known but are still at cause for the explosion so their insurance probably covers this?

I'm not sure protocol after a high speed chase is to smash windows and tase the driver.

[QUOTE=Archonos 2;47428906]I'm not sure protocol after a high speed chase is to smash windows and tase the driver.[/QUOTE] Yes this is the real concern here.

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428667]Probably, you're talking about a car with a metal frame and highly combustible fuel held in it, seems pretty reasonable that zapping the car could cause an explosion. The cops a fucking retard.[/QUOTE] Thats not how electricity, gas, or cars work at all [editline]31st March 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=AlexConnor;47428788]Nah. Explosion clearly killed the driver plus good chance of secondary explosions from the gas tank or something else in the car (remember they didn't know what caused the first explosion). No point risking more lives for someone who is already dead.[/QUOTE] Ya, they did nothing wrong after the fact, car on fire, you get away from it and wait for the fire department, but it should have never happened in the first place

[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;47428691]Considering cars normally don't explode even if struck by lightning, there was no reason for them to suspect the tazer would set it on fire. Unless they could actually smell gas fumes, in which case they are morons; but we'll have to wait for the full details to come out.[/QUOTE] Doubt full details will ever come out, if they didn't do anything to try and save that guy that's criminal negligence especially since they had fire extinguishers, that would have at the very least let them pull him out. On top of that they did not even give warning

[quote]Court documents state border patrol agents tried to pull him over for driving the wrong way on an interstate highway. However as they were in unmarked cars, Mr. Martin failed to pull over. A resulting high speed chase came to an end when the victim drove over road spikes which led to the events that unfold in the video.[/quote] So he ran, glad the article put an excuse in for him. Regardless police did a felony stop, if the guy isn't gonna open his doors or leave them locked they're gonna break them and subdue the driver. [quote]After the agents fires the taser gun, the car immediately explodes and bursts into flames. Despite the border patrol vehicles reportedly containing fire extinguishers, the agents make no attempt to save the driver and quickly move their own vehicles away from the scene.[/quote] The car was completely engulfed in flames, the heat was likely intense and fire extinguishers would have not helped. Plus with some type of accelerant in the car it makes the situation even more dangerous. Fire extinguishers are pretty shitty and only good for small fires/contained fires. [img]http://resources0.news.com.au/images/2015/03/31/1227286/811328-3dcb8e88-d759-11e4-91d8-f0bc1d307f16.jpg[/img] [quote]Mr. Iredale believes a container of gas had leaked in the car, which provided the flammable material ignited by the taser gun. He alleges the agent should have smelled the gas fumes wafting out of the car and restrained from firing the electric weapon.[/quote] Again cops should be super heroes with super senses. What about the man that died, he is ultimately responsible for what happened. Maybe he shouldn't have ran from the police, Maybe he shouldn't have stored gasoline inside his car let alone in a compromised container. His death is sad and ultimately a accident. However, if he just pulled over he would have not died. Instead his pursuit triggered a unfortunate series of events.

looking at that picture of the car fire i can understand why they wouldn't have moved to save him, that doesn't look like something anyone can survive

Their lawyer is stupid. [quote]“This was a senseless act in a senseless way for somebody who had violated no law and who lost their life needlessly,” he said.[/quote] I mean, I understand he's trying to win the case, but you would think he would stick to things which aren't factually incorrect instead of making some blanket statement that the "victim" violated no laws. Or did being the subject of a high speed pursuit become perfectly legal. Though, I couldn't agree more that they needlessly lost their life as a result of several poor decisions on their own part, including: driving for 22 hours straight, carrying gas inside an enclosed space in a leaky container, driving on the wrong side of the road, and fleeing from police at high rates of speed. Also [quote]As the plain clothed patrol agents approach the car, they appear to do little to engage the driver and smash the passenger side window with a torch.[/quote] Ah yes, it's so shocking the police don't want to have a chat after you've fled from them for however long.

If you see flames like that. One that seems to come from a canister. RUN LIKE FUCK. wanna know why? Liquid gas canisters heat up, vent more and more until they can't vent... then explode, the few liters of liquid gas expand in relation to LPG's expansion ratio. 270 : 1 Meaning for every m^3 of liquid you get 270m^3 of gas... if you want to see what that looks like, look here: I WANT TO BLEVE (Boiling Liquid Expanding Vapor Explosion) [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gI0qU4EZbS8[/media] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFFDLk1fXcU[/media] Shit's scary. Now take into account most of those explosions were from the tanks about the size of a lorry... infact the exact same one transporting LPG gas on the back of a lorry... It's like carrying a small nuclear warhead primed through a city without any proper guards.

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428693]I dunno man, but to me it just seems sensible to not tase the electrically conductive object of volatile fuel.[/QUOTE] Cars are essentially faraday cages, they protect everything inside them. There is even a Top Gear video about it. [video=youtube;ve6XGKZxYxA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ve6XGKZxYxA[/video] [editline]31st March 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=MR-X;47429788]So he ran, glad the article put an excuse in for him. Regardless police did a felony stop, if the guy isn't gonna open his doors or leave them locked they're gonna break them and subdue the driver. The car was completely engulfed in flames, the heat was likely intense and fire extinguishers would have not helped. Plus with some type of accelerant in the car it makes the situation even more dangerous. Fire extinguishers are pretty shitty and only good for small fires/contained fires. [img]http://resources0.news.com.au/images/2015/03/31/1227286/811328-3dcb8e88-d759-11e4-91d8-f0bc1d307f16.jpg[/img] Again cops should be super heroes with super senses. What about the man that died, he is ultimately responsible for what happened. Maybe he shouldn't have ran from the police, Maybe he shouldn't have stored gasoline inside his car let alone in a compromised container. His death is sad and ultimately a accident. However, if he just pulled over he would have not died. Instead his pursuit triggered a unfortunate series of events.[/QUOTE] Not to mention the fire extinguisher might not have been rated for that kind of fire.

The real question is why did they try to pull someone over in an unmarked car? If I were being followed pretty closely at night by a weird car with no police lights or anything i'd be freaked out.

[QUOTE=V1ro;47431415]The real question is why did they try to pull someone over in an unmarked car? If I were being followed pretty closely at night by a weird car with no police lights or anything i'd be freaked out.[/QUOTE] Unmarked cars still have lights and sirens, just not visible when deactivated.

Holy shit what was this guy doing in the driver seat to deserve death by incineration?

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428667]Probably, you're talking about a car with a metal frame and highly combustible fuel held in it, seems pretty reasonable that zapping the car could cause an explosion. The cops a fucking retard.[/QUOTE] Wow. [editline]31st March 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=zeroXSBK;47431675]Holy shit what was this guy doing in the driver seat to deserve death by incineration?[/QUOTE] Well if he wasnt covered in fuel, it probably would have ended differently. No one wanted him dead, especially in this way.

[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47428667]Probably, you're talking about a car with a metal frame and highly combustible fuel held in it, seems pretty reasonable that zapping the car could cause an explosion[/QUOTE] Wait, are you saying you think shooting a car with a taser would cause it to explode? And you're calling the cop a retard?

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;47431457]Unmarked cars still have lights and sirens, just not visible when deactivated.[/QUOTE] being an unmarked car in the dark is still a paranoia generator. Any old schmuck can rig up a bunch of flashy lights and hide them in their generic car to get people to pull over for a robbery or whatever. I've heard the advice pretty regularly around here that if you have doubts, you can call 911 to ask the dispatcher for confirmation that you're being pulled over by an actual officer, driving at a safe speed with your hazards blinking or whatever to let the officer know you're aware of him but not necessarily running. If no confirmation, they can send someone out to intercept the fraud car or give you directions to lead him to a station or whatever. If you ask me that sounds like a recipe to make a legit officer lose his temper with you, but if it's as common as some people make it sound I'm sure an unmarked driver would come to expect and understand the concern