US threatens India's access to medicine in response to India's attempt to make cancer medication aff - Polidicks

[quote]NEW DELHI/NEW YORK, SEPTEMBER 25, 2013—On the eve of a meeting between US president Barack Obama and Indian prime minister Manmohan Singh at the White House, the international medical humanitarian organization Doctors Without Borders/Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF) today warned that India faces retaliatory political pressure from the US government and pharmaceutical industry for its efforts to legally limit abusive patenting practices and to increase access to affordable generic medicines.[/quote] [URL]http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/press/release.cfm?id=7077&cat=press-release[/URL]

Well how else would the medical company CEOs be able to afford their $10m+ houses if they can't charge obscene amounts for inexpensively made life-saving drugs?

Cool, so Obama can basically be disregarded at this point, nice to know.

If the US does decide to cave into pressure from pharmaceutical companies, and thereby threaten the lives of many thousands just because they're poor, i'd be totally alright with India simply engaging in industrial espionage to get new drug designs instead.

Title is misleading. It has to do with their patent laws and not cancer treatment specifically

[QUOTE=bravehat;42313828]Cool, so Obama can basically be disregarded at this point, nice to know.[/QUOTE] Did you even read the article?

I just don't understand society and humanity at times. So many people seem to suffer from head up their arse disorder.

Fuck evergreening (changing a medicine slightly in order to regain 20 year patent monopoly and prevent generics being made)

India needs to tell them to fuck off.

Medicine patents should be fucking outlawed. A scientist that invents a new medicine should be allegible to a massive cash grant relating to how many lives his medicine will potentially save, Multinational corporations shouldnt see a fucking cent of profit from medicinal breakthroughs. [editline]26th September 2013[/editline] fucking

[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42314363]Medicine patents should be fucking outlawed. A scientist that invents a new medicine should be allegible to a massive cash grant relating to how many lives his medicine will potentially save, Multinational corporations shouldnt see a fucking cent of profit from medicinal breakthroughs. [editline]26th September 2013[/editline] fucking[/QUOTE] except most medicines suck and you need to do MASSIVE testing to order to prove a specific medicine is safe. see: Thalidomide. the reason multi-national corps own all these medical patents is because it costs millions upon millions to create one effective medicine, and now think of all the thousands that fail. [editline]26th September 2013[/editline] scientists are fucking poor and cant afford to bankroll all the testing required.

All patents should be outlawed. If you make a better product, people will buy it. Patents are much like monopolization in my opinion. Which is 'illegal' here in the US, so they say. (But Oligarchies aren't!). Intellectual property is the bane of human existence. If someone else can take your idea and better it, what is the problem? Yeah, folks might try and take your ideas and call them their own, but if you made a successful product people will know who created it. Corporations are just too damn greedy. *cough*Pharma*cough* *cough*apple*cough*. But of course, many would disagree because there's this whole idea of personal ownership [sp]As if it even mattered in the long run[/sp]

[QUOTE=Keys;42314384] Yeah, folks might try and take your ideas and call them their own, but if you made a successful product people will know who created it. [/QUOTE] this is dumb, see walmart. people don't give a shit if you invented it, they just don't want to pay anything. people are cheap assholes.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;42314393]this is dumb, see walmart. people don't give a shit if you invented it, they just don't want to pay anything. people are cheap assholes.[/QUOTE] Or Edison.

That's because of how glutinous places like Walmart are. They mass produce cheap shit to provide the most material to folks back at home. From a business standpoint, it is a successful model. Unfortunate it degrades the quality of goods on this end, and people- being used to Walmarts and Targets, do not know any better. We're well past the time of mom-pop shops who brought in custom work and goods. Goods that were hand crafted or bought from a legitimate source. Walmart outsources all its production/cargo to places like China because it is dirt cheap. More money into their pockets. It's not the people, it's the system we live in. Unfortunately. My pinch is that most of this could be changed, and the quality of goods and services could slingshot through the roof. But the price would go up and people are still trying to 'save every dollar', or so they think. Plus its much easier to sit at home in front of the TV and be absorbed into that rather than being into what is really going on in the real world. Walmart only enforces that meantality/lifestyle. Not necessarily intentionally (but without it, they would not be successful).

[QUOTE=Keys;42314384]All patents should be outlawed. If you make a better product, people will buy it. Patents are much like monopolization in my opinion. Which is 'illegal' here in the US, so they say. (But Oligarchies aren't!). Intellectual property is the bane of human existence. If someone else can take your idea and better it, what is the problem? Yeah, folks might try and take your ideas and call them their own, but if you made a successful product people will know who created it. Corporations are just too damn greedy. *cough*Pharma*cough* *cough*apple*cough*. But of course, many would disagree because there's this whole idea of personal ownership [sp]As if it even mattered in the long run[/sp][/QUOTE] Because without any protection you would utterly get swept over by richer companies. If there's nothing to block them from just taking your products, funneling in more cash and into a bigger market, they would. You really need to realise at the sheer size and scale bigger corporations can possible have and unless you already have a trojan horse of some kind in, you will never get to be large enough to have an impact of any kind before someone whips it from under you. There's also a reason why author rights are different from inventor rights in that inventor ones are directly applicable. as to mom and pop stores + hand made goods - we're behind that system because the system is slow and not effective. Most of all because the speed and scale in which we transmit information has massive increased due to the radio, tv and lastly the internet. The situation today is completely different from the situation 50 years ago, let alone a hundred or more.

As already stated the title is seriously misleading, this is about India's recent statements regarding reducing the strength of copyrights. Which might be great for poor people for a couple of years as drug prices drop, followed by the end of new drug development as it becomes no longer financially viable. [QUOTE=Sprockethead;42314363]Medicine patents should be fucking outlawed. A scientist that invents a new medicine should be allegible to a massive cash grant relating to how many lives his medicine will potentially save, Multinational corporations shouldnt see a fucking cent of profit from medicinal breakthroughs.[/QUOTE] 1. Corporations exist to provide the funding required to develop and test drugs, which is outrageously expensive. 2. Who is paying for this grant? The government? Okay, so now instead of paying large sums to buy medicine directly, you're paying the same amount through taxes so the creator can be compensated. Either way you're still paying money to reward someone for making an effective product, and if that cash grant is large enough to offset the R&D costs then you're not saving any money in the end. I think most people don't realize just how expensive drug development is. A company can spend tens of millions of dollars over the course of a decade and wind up with a product that doesn't work or isn't safe for humans. With those kinds of risks they simply can't afford to sell for production cost + 10% markup like a Chinese electronics manufacturer. There are people at the top who have made a lot of money off it, but like it or not, drug-making is a capitalistic endeavour and profit is the motive. If you want to change that I'd be all for it (fully government-subsidized research, for example), but eliminating patents is not the solution.

[QUOTE=Ishwoo;42313824]Well how else would the medical company CEOs be able to afford their $10m+ houses if they can't charge obscene amounts for inexpensively made life-saving drugs?[/QUOTE] 10m+ doesn't even scratch it actually. There's a lot of money in pharmacy.

[QUOTE=Keys;42314384]All patents should be outlawed. If you make a better product, people will buy it. Patents are much like monopolization in my opinion. Which is 'illegal' here in the US, so they say. (But Oligarchies aren't!). Intellectual property is the bane of human existence. If someone else can take your idea and better it, what is the problem? Yeah, folks might try and take your ideas and call them their own, but if you made a successful product people will know who created it.[/QUOTE] Hey, have you ever read about a guy named Nikola Tesla? The guy whose achievements were stolen by Edison, and who died penniless while Edison is credited with inventing the modern electrical infrastructure? If a big business can take your idea and produce it at half the cost they'll be the ones with a successful product, not you.

[QUOTE=Ishwoo;42313824]Well how else would the medical company CEOs be able to afford their $10m+ houses if they can't charge obscene amounts for inexpensively made life-saving drugs?[/QUOTE] [img]http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/999ktdy.com/files/2012/10/sample-cup.jpg[/img] $23 [img]https://www.mountainside-medical.com/product_images/uploaded_images/dextrose-5-injection-iv-bag.jpg[/img] $1.40 to make. $400 on your bill. Water, with 5% sugar, basically. Asthma medicine, anywhere between $15 and $40 or there abouts... Half a dollar in Cuba This is what happens in a country where health care is a commodity

[QUOTE=TheTalon;42315055][img]http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/999ktdy.com/files/2012/10/sample-cup.jpg[/img] $23 [img]https://www.mountainside-medical.com/product_images/uploaded_images/dextrose-5-injection-iv-bag.jpg[/img] $1.40 to make. $400 on your bill. Water, with 5% sugar, basically.[/QUOTE] What? Are we talking about pharmaceutical companies or hospitals now?

[QUOTE=catbarf;42315095]What? Are we talking about pharmaceutical companies or hospitals now?[/QUOTE] Healthcare in general in the US and their evil ways to get every dime they can

I nearly flipped my bowl of spicy pasta after reading the title.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;42314372]except most medicines suck and you need to do MASSIVE testing to order to prove a specific medicine is safe. see: Thalidomide. the reason multi-national corps own all these medical patents is because it costs millions upon millions to create one effective medicine, and now think of all the thousands that fail. [editline]26th September 2013[/editline] scientists are fucking poor and cant afford to bankroll all the testing required.[/QUOTE] Bear in mind that around 80% of R&D for new drugs is paid for out of public money, not the corporations that produce them (see below). So really they shouldn't have such a large time period of monopolistic entitlement to profit as they claim to be deserving of. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/iujOEPf.png[/IMG] (from this article [URL]http://imgur.com/a/LtFqy#2HrI2Us[/URL] pretty good read about medicine patents)

[QUOTE=The golden;42315712]The heads of pharmaceutical companies need to be thrown in prison for the rest of their lives and never be allowed to see sunlight again. Such extreme profiting off of human suffering and illness is irredeemable.[/QUOTE] Should be a crime against humanity, imo. Good quality healthcare should be a fundamental human right.

Here is an article that gives a little more detail regarding Novartis and evergreening: [url]http://newint.org/blog/2013/04/02/novartis-supreme-court-ruling/[/url]

[QUOTE=Keys;42314437] But the price would go up and people are still trying to 'save every dollar'.[/QUOTE] If saving every cent they can means keeping a roof over their head can you really blame them? The economy is still absolutely terrible and there's still many people who are living paycheck to paycheck and only barely avoiding foreclosure. You can't sit there and straightfacedly expect them to pay quite a bit more for the things they need every day.

[QUOTE=TheTalon;42315055][img]http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/999ktdy.com/files/2012/10/sample-cup.jpg[/img] $23 [img]https://www.mountainside-medical.com/product_images/uploaded_images/dextrose-5-injection-iv-bag.jpg[/img] $1.40 to make. $400 on your bill. Water, with 5% sugar, basically. Asthma medicine, anywhere between $15 and $40 or there abouts... Half a dollar in Cuba This is what happens in a country where health care is a commodity[/QUOTE] This is what happens when healthcare is run in an open market. It would be fine and dandy if there was actually a way to compete, but since health is such an exact science once someone found the cure and own the patent there's pretty much no way to compete. Not to mention everyone with a chronic illness has been a cash cow for the pharmaceutical industry.

lets throw this on the pile of broken stuff we need to fix, turn off the lights, and call it a day. nothing is going to change, healthcare in general has been so hands-off for decades that billing is outrageous, insurance is crazy, drug costs are astronomical, production costs fall, regulations fall, drug precursers have been outsorced to crappy hellholes where workers die due to very poor training and handling of dangerous chemicals. its a big broken machine, and its not going to get any better just by political pressure from india, whos patent system and goverment is even more broken than ours

[QUOTE=Sableye;42319936]lets throw this on the pile of broken stuff we need to fix, turn off the lights, and call it a day. nothing is going to change, healthcare in general has been so hands-off for decades that billing is outrageous, insurance is crazy, drug costs are astronomical, production costs fall, regulations fall, drug precursers have been outsorced to crappy hellholes where workers die due to very poor training and handling of dangerous chemicals. its a big broken machine, and its not going to get any better just by political pressure from india, whos patent system and goverment is even more broken than ours[/QUOTE] Pigs get better healthcare than Americans due to food standards, the sick are culled. Mandus was right all along!