• Vladimir Putin: Nothing Wrong With Molotov-Von Ribbentrop Pact
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Original Article: [url]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/vladimir-putin/11213255/Vladimir-Putin-says-there-was-nothing-wrong-with-Soviet-Unions-pact-with-Adolf-Hitlers-Nazi-Germany.html[/url] [img]http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/03097/Hitler-and-Putin_3097896b.jpg[/img] [I]"Oh, you!"[/I] [quote]Vladimir Putin has said there was nothing bad about the Nazi-Soviet Pact, the non-aggression treaty which led to the carve-up of Poland at the outset of the Second World War, suggesting Britain and France were to blame for Adolf Hitler's march into Europe. The Russian president made the comments at a meeting with young historians in Moscow, during which he urged them to examine the lead-up to the war, among other subjects. The comments are likely to cause dismay in eastern Europe, amid wider debate in Russia about growing attempts to use history as a means of shoring up Mr Putin's rule. ... "Serious research must show that those were the foreign policy methods then," he said, adding: "The Soviet Union signed a non-aggression treaty with Germany. People say: 'Ach, that's bad.' But [B]what's bad about that if the Soviet Union didn't want to fight[/B], what's bad about it?" [/quote] Ah, Putin. A man who arms neofascist rebels in a country under the guise of fighting fascism, who somehow manages to say even more stupid shit about actual historical instances of his own country's collusion with the worst excesses of actual fascism.
[quote=putin]what's bad about that if the Soviet Union didn't want to fight[/quote] To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.
Ah yes, the Molotov-Von Ribbentrop pact that divided Poland and was a stalling mechanism for both countries as they raced to get their military ready for war against each other. As if the Soviets wouldn't have attacked Germany if they had been given the chance sooner. [editline]7th November 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Not representative of the UK as a whole but Chamberlain... :v:
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Switzerland? America up until Pearl Harbour?
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Switzerland. Edit - fucking ninja.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Nobody wanted another great war, and at the time most countries apart from France didn't see much issue with Hitler's retaking of German lands since a lot of people felt that the Treaty of Versailles was too harsh because the French were being dicks.
Devil's Advocate here: The part that was made public was not bad, just not something people wanted to see. The Red Army was nowhere NEAR a capable fighting force and Stalin knew it - hence why he agreed to it. The secret parts regarding splitting up Poland etc, yeah, those [b]were[/b] bad.
[QUOTE=BuffaloBill;46430672]Devil's Advocate here: The part that was made public was not bad, just not something people wanted to see. The Red Army was nowhere NEAR a capable fighting force and Stalin knew it - hence why he agreed to it. The secret parts regarding splitting up Poland etc, yeah, those [b]were[/b] bad.[/QUOTE] They were bad but the nazis would have taken poland anyway. If you're going to make a deal with the devil you might as well make as much out of it as possible. Regarding the pact itself, weren't the Nazis and the soviets working together before this anyway as a means for the nazis to secretly research tanks which they had been banned from dabbling in?
What's wrong with a non-aggression pact?
Putin sees nothing wrong with the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, but still wants to give Western Ukraine to Poland. I find that amazing
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Poland.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] The Axis allies?
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Spain? France? Portugal? Denmark? Norway? Sweden? Finland? Hungary? Romania? Italy? Belgium? Holland? Luxembourg? The UK?
Does he go on and say everything out publicly? He doesn't have some kind of public speech guy?
[QUOTE=Deng;46430868]Poland.[/QUOTE] What
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;46430883]Spain? France? Portugal? Denmark? Norway? Sweden? Finland? Hungary? Romania? Italy? Belgium? Holland? Luxembourg? The UK?[/QUOTE] You're forgetting the countries that really matter you know Liechtenstein, san marino, and the vatican city. Let's throw in lesotho for good measure.
[QUOTE=LVL FACTORY;46430706]What's wrong with a non-aggression pact?[/QUOTE] Other than having a secret protocol that divided up Eastern Europe without the consent of those countries? Not much.
[QUOTE=proch;46430932]What[/QUOTE] I don't think the Polish were too happy with the Germans and USSR invading it.
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;46430883]Spain? France? Portugal? Denmark? Norway? Sweden? Finland? Hungary? Romania? Italy? Belgium? Holland? Luxembourg? The UK?[/QUOTE] In the UK especially at the start of the war anti-war protesters and pro-war protesters clashed, the first world war was still fresh in the mind.
[I]totally not wrong...[/I] stop taking acid you fucktard
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] OH, LOOK ! The PACT that caused the occupation of my country and my Baltic neighbors. What could be so bad about this pact ?
[QUOTE=proch;46430932]What[/QUOTE] Pretty sure the Poles weren't keen on getting into a war with a country they knew very well would obliterate them off the face of the Earth.
Look, the fascists are shaking hands and smiling with the Russians ? [img]https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3325/5791187729_a185b867ca.jpg[/img] [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/99/Spotkanie_Sojusznik%C3%B3w.jpg[/img] [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-1984-1206-523%2C_Berlin%2C_Verabschiedung_Molotows.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.studiolum.com/wang/brest/brest-1939-german-soviet-fraternizing-04.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46430627]To critics of this - Go ahead and name me another country which didn't want to fight the nazis.[/QUOTE] Finland, to a certain point.. :v:
[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;46430995]Look, the fascists are shaking hands and smiling with the Russians ? [IMG]https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3325/5791187729_a185b867ca.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/99/Spotkanie_Sojusznik%C3%B3w.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-1984-1206-523%2C_Berlin%2C_Verabschiedung_Molotows.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.studiolum.com/wang/brest/brest-1939-german-soviet-fraternizing-04.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE] The pictures that made 60% of the world's population poop themselves, because that would be like if mongooses and cobras or wasps and tarantulas teamed up :v:
[QUOTE=LVL FACTORY;46430706]What's wrong with a non-aggression pact?[/QUOTE] Because the pact also gave the soviets "right" to Finland and many eastern european countries. As a result the soviet union attacked Finland with deadly consequences. "Non-aggression pact" really doesn't describe it well.
[QUOTE=Uberpro;46431032]Because the pact also gave the soviets "right" to Finland and many eastern european countries. As a result the soviet union attacked Finland with deadly consequences. "Non-aggression pact" really doesn't describe it well.[/QUOTE] Nazis would have taken them anyway. The soviets would rather have it themselves than have Nazis on their doorstep. It was shitty for the people in those countries but the soviets did what they did for a reason.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46431051]Nazis would have taken them anyway. The soviets would rather have it themselves than have Nazis on their doorstep. It was shitty for the people in those countries but the soviets did what they did for a reason.[/QUOTE] You mean rebuilding the Russian Empire?
Stalin expected Hitler to attack. He'd written about it in goddamn [I]Mein Kampf[/I] and Stalin was well aware of it. Stalin expected the Molotov-Von Ribbentrop Pact to last for two years, so he was focusing on industralizing his war machine and moving troops towards the future Russian-German front, but they were generally on a peacetime footing when the Germans attacked. Russian aircraft were expressly forbidden from firing on German surveillance planes even as the Germans ran hundreds of incursions a month for a short period leading up to the attack. Stalin believed it was a bluff. Stalin knew exactly what he was doing -- placating Hitler and encouraging him to take care of weakening the West, which would benefit Russia without the diplomatic cost of a single infantry leaving Russian soil. He was busy building tanks. Hitler, on the other hand, drastically underestimated the Red Army, and made the same mistake as Napoleon -- don't try and capture Moscow in Winter. I guess we're going to be back in a cold war until Putin's out of office, and then only maybe. The prime years of my life were spent in the window of optimism and hope, so I guess that's good enough for me...
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;46431051]Nazis would have taken them anyway. The soviets would rather have it themselves than have Nazis on their doorstep. It was shitty for the people in those countries but the soviets did what they did for a reason.[/QUOTE] So you're saying that the soviets tried to invade Finland because the poor souls were just trying to defend themselves? Right.
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