• Judge Allows SC Church Shooter Dylann Roof to Represent Himself
    31 replies, posted
[quote]A federal judge on Monday granted Dylann Roof's motion to represent himself, according to CNN affiliates WIS, WCBD and WCSC. Roof, who is accused of killing nine people at a black church in Charleston, South Carolina, in June 2015, was deemed competent to stand trial last week. Jury selection had been under way when US District Judge Richard Mark Gergel halted the process to allow Roof to undergo a competency evaluation. Gergel ruled Roof was competent, but he sealed a document containing the reasons for his finding. Disclosing the document would jeopardize Roof's right to a fair trial, the judge said. The process of selecting a jury of Roof's peers resumed Monday. [/quote] [url=http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/28/us/dylann-roof-to-represent-self-charleston-trial/]CNN[/url]
good fucking luck
Might as well be suicide if this guy's facing the death penalty.
Tbh If I was genuinely guilty of something like he did, I'd prefer death penalty to rotting away forever.
[QUOTE=GordonZombie;51440159]Might as well be suicide if this guy's facing the death penalty.[/QUOTE] Even if he is handed the death penalty, it will be a long time before the sentence is carried out, if at all. The death penalty is on its way out on the US, especially since the company that makes the lethal injection fluids is making so little every year. And things like the firing squad won't hold up in 2016, let alone 10 years from now when this guy's head is finally next in line for the choppimg block.
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51443145]Even if he is handed the death penalty, it will be a long time before the sentence is carried out, if at all. The death penalty is on its way out on the US, especially since the company that makes the lethal injection fluids is making so little every year. And things like the firing squad won't hold up in 2016, let alone 10 years from now when this guy's head is finally next in line for the choppimg block.[/QUOTE] If we absolutely must have the death penalty, I think a firing squad is the MOST humane way to go about it. Drug em up so they aren't shitting their pants with fear and anxiety, shoot them in the face once. Instant and humane (as humane as execution can be, rather).
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51443145]Even if he is handed the death penalty, it will be a long time before the sentence is carried out, if at all. The death penalty is on its way out on the US, especially since the company that makes the lethal injection fluids is making so little every year. And things like the firing squad won't hold up in 2016, let alone 10 years from now when this guy's head is finally next in line for the choppimg block.[/QUOTE] i'm sure rope is still in business, but iirc the last person we hung was saddam, so they might just save that stuff for war-related things.
[QUOTE=Pops;51443169]i'm sure rope is still in business, but iirc the last person we hung was saddam, so they might just save that stuff for war-related things.[/QUOTE] US didn't hang Saddam, the Iraqi government did
[QUOTE=Svinnik;51443173]US didn't hang Saddam, the Iraqi government did[/QUOTE] well shit, we can export hangings then. also, what about the electric chair?
[QUOTE=Pops;51443176]well shit, we can export hangings then.[/QUOTE] God bless globalization
Chances of Jury Nullification happening?
[QUOTE=Pops;51443176]well shit, we can export hangings then. also, what about the electric chair?[/QUOTE] Electric chair is horrifying torture. As far as I'm aware, it's not used anywhere in the U.S.
[QUOTE=certified;51443334]Chances of Jury Nullification happening?[/QUOTE] Only an idiot would bet on it.
[QUOTE=certified;51443334]Chances of Jury Nullification happening?[/QUOTE] Depends on the individual people. Article states a few have already been kicked out for having one-way answers.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51440015]TIL you cant waive your right to counsel unless you are deemed competent enough to represent yourself, which is a higher bar than competence to stand trial. So there is a place where you are sane enough to stand trial but not capable enough to represent yourself, even with a side attorney.[/QUOTE] That's not that surprising or odd, imo. Being declared competent to stand trial (IE- sane and of sound mind) is not necessarily the same thing as being competent to defend yourself (IE- being of sound [I]enough[/I] mind to mount a reasonable defense). It's for the good of the defendants, really. Unless you are a personally a lawyer, or somehow an expert in law without being a lawyer, you are almost guaranteed to botch your case. A court of law is not merely about presenting a reasonable argument, but soundly analyzing evidence, selecting a favorable jury, knowing all the different legal statutes to reference, determining that proper legal procedures were followed in regards to the collection and analyses of evidence, etc, etc. The case could be made that being competent enough to stand trial means you should also be competent enough to defend yourself, and I understand the reasoning there, but in terms of being able to mount an [I]effective[/I] defense? Totally not the same thing. It's best for the defendant to simply trust a good lawyer. [editline]28th November 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=certified;51443334]Chances of Jury Nullification happening?[/QUOTE] Unlikely as hell, but I guess not completely impossible. Good luck convincing a jury that shooting up a church full of innocent parishioners is somehow a morally justifiable position lol.
I hear some judges will demand and possibly even force people to use a lawyer
[QUOTE=Pops;51443176]also, what about the electric chair?[/QUOTE] The electric chair's pretty fucked, and I'm not even against the death penalty. Think "overcooked hotdog".
[QUOTE=Radical_ed;51443166]If we absolutely must have the death penalty, I think a firing squad is the MOST humane way to go about it. Drug em up so they aren't shitting their pants with fear and anxiety, shoot them in the face once. Instant and humane (as humane as execution can be, rather).[/QUOTE] Firing squads arent really humane. Some poor group of guys has to live with the guilt of killing an unarmed, non threatening, incapacitated, and restrained individual. Theres also issued with the guys doing the shooting purposefully missing for the reason I just stated. Even still, being shot isn't a garunteed instant death unless you do it via point blank headshot (Ie: Nazi style) but you run into the same problems. Theres really no way to do a purely humane execution. It needs to be done away with.
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51443145]Even if he is handed the death penalty, it will be a long time before the sentence is carried out, if at all. The death penalty is on its way out on the US, especially since the company that makes the lethal injection fluids is making so little every year. And things like the firing squad won't hold up in 2016, let alone 10 years from now when this guy's head is finally next in line for the choppimg block.[/QUOTE] Something like a quarter of people on death row abandon the appeals process and ask the state to expedite their sentence. He may be going for that. [editline]29th November 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51443724]Firing squads arent really humane. Some poor group of guys has to live with the guilt of killing an unarmed, non threatening, incapacitated, and restrained individual. Theres also issued with the guys doing the shooting purposefully missing for the reason I just stated. Even still, being shot isn't a garunteed instant death unless you do it via point blank headshot (Ie: Nazi style) but you run into the same problems. Theres really no way to do a purely humane execution. It needs to be done away with.[/QUOTE] Pretty certain the guys in the last firing squad in the US volunteered. [editline]29th November 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Radical_ed;51443343]Electric chair is horrifying torture. As far as I'm aware, it's not used anywhere in the U.S.[/QUOTE] It's the secondary method in many US states. If you're on death row cross your fingers the drug supply doesn't run out.
[QUOTE=Radical_ed;51443166]If we absolutely must have the death penalty, I think a firing squad is the MOST humane way to go about it. Drug em up so they aren't shitting their pants with fear and anxiety, shoot them in the face once. Instant and humane (as humane as execution can be, rather).[/QUOTE] There are significantly more reliable ways of quickly and painlessly killing someone with a gun than how firing squads do it. The squad is only there to make the experience less traumatic for the gunmen.
Im against the death penalty simply because it is an escape for the criminal. It would be much better to force them to live a life of extreme nothingness. That and werent there a few cases of death row prisoners being found innocent of their crimes?
The controversy surrounding the death penalty is not in deciding the most efficient way to kill somebody, so can we not let this thread devolve into a series of increasingly ridiculous strategies for ending human life? It always starts at "firing squad" and ends somewhere past "gigantic blender."
If he pulls this off he's got a good legal career ahead of him.
[QUOTE=Aredbomb;51443936]There are significantly more reliable ways of quickly and painlessly killing someone with a gun than how firing squads do it. The squad is only there to make the experience less traumatic for the gunmen.[/QUOTE] [quote] shoot them in the face once[/quote] What is more quick and painless than that.
[QUOTE=Sims_doc;51444058]If he pulls this off he's got a good legal career ahead of him.[/QUOTE] Except not really because there's a greater statistical chance that the apollo missions were actually secret government operations to clean up the nazi moonbases and while they were there Lance Armstrong, Louis Armstrong and Neil Armstrong teamed up and assassinated Hitler who escaped to the moon via ancient alien technology that was reverse engineered by German scientists who found it while searching for the holy grail, which they found, than there is with this guy being able to win this trial.
[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;51443955]The controversy surrounding the death penalty is not in deciding the most efficient way to kill somebody, so can we not let this thread devolve into a series of increasingly ridiculous strategies for ending human life? It always starts at "firing squad" and ends somewhere past "gigantic blender."[/QUOTE] [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hyph_DZa_GQ[/media]
Why do they even bother with "life in prison" charges? They have no chance of being productive and no chance of reintroduction to society. We could use the tax money to better feed and give shelter to the homeless. What is the point of that anyway? I never understood that. Because it's wrong to kill? They broke that rule first, they should expect to be treated how they treat others. If an active shooter gets killed on scene, nobody gives a shit, but if you jail him for 18 months and then decide to kill him then it's morally wrong? I could understand life in prison if the case could be contested and there was a possibility of innocence. This guy will either get life without parole or death. This guy murdered innocent people for no reason and I don't see how it is productive to keep him alive. (ASSUMING THEY ARE CONFIRMED 100% GUILTY) Then the death penalty is at worst a cull, and at best it could do some good because we could use the funds elsewhere. If you disagree and would like to have a debate PM me.
[QUOTE=Blind Lulu;51449873]Do you even realize how incredibly expensive it would be to put everyone who's currently facing life-in-prison on deathrow? And that's not even including the cost of the actual method of execution cause that's just a drop in the ocean compared to all the legal costs.[/QUOTE] Probably not as expensive as feeding them for 45 years.
[QUOTE=Smoovedawg1;51452073]Probably not as expensive as feeding them for 45 years.[/QUOTE] Much more, actually. The trials and appeal processes themselves take 10+ years, cost several times more than a trial for the same crime without the death penalty, and the prisoners cost an average of $90k+ more per year because of the extra security measures, transport, etc. Start to finish, the death penalty costs much more than simply putting somebody in prison for the rest of their lives.
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