Bernie Sanders Slams Israel After Skipping AIPAC Convention - Polidicks

[URL]http://www.thewrap.com/bernie-sanders-slams-bad-israel-after-skipping-aipac-convention/#.dpuf[/URL] [quote]Just hours after skipping the annual American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC) meeting on Monday, [B]Bernie Sanders — the only Jewish presidential candidate in the race for the White House — said the U.S. government consistently turns a blind eye whenever Israel does “bad things.”[/B] Speaking to CNN’s Anderson Cooper Monday evening, [B]Sanders said there could be no real peace in the Middle East until the U.S. stops giving the Jewish state a free pass.[/B] “[B]Overwhelmingly the United States time and time again has looked aside when Israel has done some bad things[/B],” Sanders said, calling Israel’s settlements expansion in Palestinian territories “unacceptable.” [B]Sanders also criticized Israel for its response to Gaza’s rocket attacks[/B] in 2014, which led to Operation Protective Edge, a two-month long bloody war. “The kind of destruction that was wrecked on Gaza during that war was way above what needed to be done for military purposes,” Sanders said.[/quote] How neat that the only Jewish candidate is the only candidate that has the audacity to stand up to Israel. I think Bernie Sanders is the "change" we expected from Obama in '08—where we instead—got a continuation of failed policies and a half-assed health care bill instead. Bernie Sanders is the only candidate who's truly liberal— in comparison to center-left [URL="http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/walterellis/100142115/there-is-no-proper-left-in-american-politics-even-obama-is-more-right-wing-than-cameron/"]Obama who's more conservative than David Cameron. [/URL] Watch this neat video: [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BjGGOGPGwk[/media] "Bernie sanders is the worst type of Jew" "This is a deal breaker for me" Some of the stuff said is straight-up antisemitic, if it weren't said by fellow Jews. The guy lost half of his extended family to the holocaust yet is considered as not "Jewish enough" — what constitutes being "Jewish enough"?

What a shock, you find die hard pro-israeli voters at a pro-israeli convention...

[QUOTE=Starpluck;49981583]what constitutes being "Jewish enough"?[/QUOTE] "If you aren't pushing our agenda, then you're aren't a real Jew"

[QUOTE=Sableye;49981600]What a shock, you find die hard pro-israeli voters at a pro-israeli convention...[/QUOTE] Some if it just idiocy. Interviewer: "Bernie said he wants to pursue a leveled-playing field on Israel and Palestine and he is not big on taking special-interest money or being beholden to special interests— so— do you see his absence here as being consistent with that message?" Citizen: "No." How is that a 'no'? The ultimate litmus test of one truly not being beholden to special interest groups is if they do not pander to the powerful pro-Israel lobby—AIPAC— that bipartisanly has it's grip on both parties—Democrat or Republican— and yet Sanders seemed to have been the only candidate that passed the litmus test of not being "sold" No matter how many times a candidate says they will not controlled by lobbyists or special interest groups (see Obama, or Trump) they never fail to surrender themselves in front of the one special interest group that is rated as the most powerful one—AIPAC He is the only one who is not a lackey to AIPAC. Yet she replies—no? You can hate the man for not being a rabid pro-Israeli but he still is consistent with his message to not be enslaved by special interests by virtue of not attending.

[QUOTE=Starpluck;49981624]He is the only one who is not a lackey to AIPAC. Yet she replies—no?[/QUOTE] I guarantee that this is what was going on in her head: [QUOTE]Interviewer: "Bernie blah blah blah blah blah Israel Palestine blah blah blah blah blah do you see blah blah blah consistent with blah blah message?" Citizen: "I'm voting Clinton anyway."[/QUOTE]

This is why he is never getting the nomination. Because the US cares more about Israeli interests than their own people.

[QUOTE=Dissolution;49981603]"If you aren't pushing our agenda, then you're aren't a real Jew"[/QUOTE] Christians have said similar things about the pope after he has denounced their behaviour. Pathetic how people will subtly admit they're using religion as a tool for influence and leverage.

I welcome this change of pace in his campaign. My main complaint with Bernie was his relaxed stance on Israel.

[QUOTE=Talishmar;49982103]Christians have said similar things about the pope after he has denounced their behaviour. Pathetic how people will subtly admit they're using religion as a tool for influence and leverage.[/QUOTE] You call that subtle?

[QUOTE=Sokrates;49982064]This is why he is never getting the nomination. Because the US cares more about Israeli interests than their own people.[/QUOTE] [IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/su16ewmF24zyTruknc04mcI49QFHmyqhvnViltfUGWEXBAJ7TcsDg6Uz7EZJTGHpoPzsGWbm9MSPxDjhs6il8HFoXGn7nRT0WK9NveTkUoctS03tsuhxgK1nrqGJNlfvnh6RG8kuI1OUAdYt[/IMG] [QUOTE]From 1998 through July 2010, pro-Israel groups have spent $25,248,057 on lobbying activities, and from 1990 through October 2010, pro-Israel contributions from groups and individuals have totaled $93,878,940. Yet, there is actually a reverse correlation over this period of −.47 between lobbying totals and yearly aid to Israel, and reverse correlation of −.68 between contributions and yearly aid to Israel… if the power of the pro-Israel lobby is driving policy, it must be doing so in a way that cannot be measured, since lobbying activities and donations have no correlative, let alone causal, effect on levels of U.S. support.[/QUOTE] [IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/s5ODmOiLjeLA5plbaeknO6Q-lJws1ScuCaLrn8-G9izUyw5KlMLjchf2Oo6EI7kYGa_lzPdjZFeYnp9qI7N1nlOr8BqWzUYSzlxS7k2EQSWqdwjglwrzwfK9dO8I7A-YvYkRT33pPZg1Vz8d[/IMG] [QUOTE]Only in four out of twenty-one instances have less than 50 percent of the public indicated holding a very favorable or mostly favorable view of Israel, and those holding an unfavorable view of Israel have never outnumbered those with a favorable view during this time period, with an average gap between the two groups of thirty-one points.[/QUOTE] [editline]22nd March 2016[/editline] But guys, whatever, AIPAC is a secret conspiratorial cabal controlling US foreign policy with all of its members puppeteering top US politicians at the illuminati table. There surely CAN'T be ANY other reason for US support of Israel.

I can see /pol/ being really confused right now, seeing how their beloved Donald showed up on AIPAC and gave nice, reassuring speech.

[QUOTE=FlashMarsh;49982590] But guys, whatever, AIPAC is a secret conspiratorial cabal controlling US foreign policy with all of its members puppeteering top US politicians at the illuminati table. There surely CAN'T be ANY other reason for US support of Israel.[/QUOTE] i wasn't implying a conspiracy, its a special interest conference. you're going to find on a whole the people there have a vested interest in israel-US relations, otherwise they wouldn't be making the time to go there. Its like expecting to find teachers at a teaching convention. in any case, yes US support for israel isn't simply a case of money in money out, there are very real reasons to support israel, HOWEVER, we shouldn't ignore the blatant apartheid shit Netanyahu has been shoveling in the recent years to appease his country's far right, which has only inflamed tensions in the region.

[QUOTE=FlashMarsh;49982590][IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/su16ewmF24zyTruknc04mcI49QFHmyqhvnViltfUGWEXBAJ7TcsDg6Uz7EZJTGHpoPzsGWbm9MSPxDjhs6il8HFoXGn7nRT0WK9NveTkUoctS03tsuhxgK1nrqGJNlfvnh6RG8kuI1OUAdYt[/IMG] [IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/s5ODmOiLjeLA5plbaeknO6Q-lJws1ScuCaLrn8-G9izUyw5KlMLjchf2Oo6EI7kYGa_lzPdjZFeYnp9qI7N1nlOr8BqWzUYSzlxS7k2EQSWqdwjglwrzwfK9dO8I7A-YvYkRT33pPZg1Vz8d[/IMG] [editline]22nd March 2016[/editline] But guys, whatever, AIPAC is a secret conspiratorial cabal controlling US foreign policy with all of its members puppeteering top US politicians at the illuminati table. There surely CAN'T be ANY other reason for US support of Israel.[/QUOTE] Does it not strike you as a conflict of interest that US politicians are accepting huge sums of money from Israeli interests before voting on relevant policy?

It is, but it isn't unusual in US politics, and isn't the primary cause of US support of Israel, as the negative correlation in that chart shows. I personally think the effects of money in US politics are overblown, but the effect of AIPAC in particular is overstated because pro-Palestine individuals simply cannot accept that people support Israel for legitimate reasons rather than being paid off by some mysterious pro-Israel lobby.

Can't be surprised when even some jews who survived the holocaust would mention in their memoirs that one of the unforeseen problems was how other jews, specifically ones in Israel, would give them cold shoulders for not fighting or "truly" being part of the tribe/religion/whatever social construct they came up with.

[QUOTE=Tudd;49983954]Can't be surprised when even some jews who survived the holocaust would mention in their memoirs that one of the unforeseen problems was how other jews, specifically ones in Israel, would give them cold shoulders for not fighting or "truly" being part of the tribe/religion/whatever social construct they came up with.[/QUOTE] Source? That sounds like bullshit tbh. No one in Israel would do that, esp considering how well holocaust survivors are treated there

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49983994]Source? That sounds like bullshit tbh. No one in Israel would do that, esp considering how well holocaust survivors are treated there[/QUOTE] Huh? [URL="http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/holocaust-remembrance-day/.premium-1.651572"]Hahahaha[/URL]. Seriously though, Jews being dicks to other Jews isn't any different than, say, Christians being dicks to other Christians. There are Israeli Jews that are dicks. There are non-Israeli Jews who are dicks. Despite the Holocaust, Jews are a normal group of humans with an assortment of nationalities and opinions. There's nothing special or significant about some people disagreeing with other people on politics just because they both belong to the same ethnic group.

[QUOTE=FlashMarsh;49983819]It is, but it isn't unusual in US politics, and isn't the primary cause of US support of Israel, as the negative correlation in that chart shows. I personally think the effects of money in US politics are overblown, but the effect of AIPAC in particular is overstated because pro-Palestine individuals simply cannot accept that people support Israel for legitimate reasons rather than being paid off by some mysterious pro-Israel lobby.[/QUOTE] its not a binary issue though, palistine and israel have both done stupid, provacative, and aparthidey shit. the problem is that you can call out palistinians on it, but you can't do anything to stop israel from using slave labor, building illegal settlements, and doing w/e they want to the palistinians without being anti-israel. The US has condemmed their actions for decades, but we, their bestest buddy, haven't gotten any results from that.

[QUOTE=ScumBunny;49984027]Huh? [URL="http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/holocaust-remembrance-day/.premium-1.651572"]Hahahaha[/URL]. Seriously though, Jews being dicks to other Jews isn't any different than, say, Christians being dicks to other Christians. There are Israeli Jews that are dicks. There are non-Israeli Jews who are dicks. Despite the Holocaust, Jews are a normal group of humans with an assortment of nationalities and opinions. There's nothing special or significant about some people disagreeing with other people on politics just because they both belong to the same ethnic group.[/QUOTE] My bad, I thought they were treated better than they actually were.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49984191]My bad, I thought they were treated better than they actually were.[/QUOTE] Yah it's one of the more shocking things I found out when reading about post-holocaust survivor tales. I think the tribalism Jewish people sometime implement on their own is pretty unique since you usually have different motives then just differing sects of belief.

[QUOTE=ScumBunny;49984027]Huh? [URL="http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/holocaust-remembrance-day/.premium-1.651572"]Hahahaha[/URL]. Seriously though, Jews being dicks to other Jews isn't any different than, say, Christians being dicks to other Christians. There are Israeli Jews that are dicks. There are non-Israeli Jews who are dicks. Despite the Holocaust, Jews are a normal group of humans with an assortment of nationalities and opinions. There's nothing special or significant about some people disagreeing with other people on politics just because they both belong to the same ethnic group.[/QUOTE] No, it is different. It's not simply someone of one ethnic group disagreeing with another, the ethnic group is being made the subject of the disagreement.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49983994]Source? That sounds like bullshit tbh. No one in Israel would do that, esp considering how well holocaust survivors are treated there[/QUOTE] Jews being dicks to other jews dates back to ancient times, just look at the Sadducees, Pharisees, and Essenes. It ended in a dude being nailed to a piece of wood if you don't remember

[QUOTE=Tudd;49984260]Yah it's one of the more shocking things I found out when reading about post-holocaust survivor tales. I think the tribalism Jewish people sometime implement on their own is pretty unique since you usually have different motives then just differing sects of belief.[/QUOTE] What the shit are you on about? Tribalism? Different sects of belief? Most Jews are secular. Most of them, like all the other filthy goyim. have their own sets of personal values, politics, nationalities and all the other craps people can disagree with each other on. Just here in Israel there's such a diversity of political views among just the Jews that we put 9 different political parties in the Knesset (not counting the Arab one). The holocaust, like everyone in [URL="https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1511301"]this thread[/URL] are so happy to point out over and over is just a historical event. One that had a significant fucking effect on everyone that lived through it as well as their offspring, sure. But not some magical nexus of human history that transformed all Jews into brethren that will forever more be unable to ever disagree with each other to the point that when a single group of Jews are dicks to another group of Jews its shocking proof that Jews are the worst ever. I mean, seriously.

[QUOTE=RikohZX;49982207]You call that subtle?[/QUOTE] Touché. "Implicit" would've been a more approperiate wording.

[QUOTE=ScumBunny;49984799]What the shit are you on about? Tribalism? Different sects of belief? Most Jews are secular. Most of them, like all the other filthy goyim. have their own sets of personal values, politics, nationalities and all the other craps people can disagree with each other on. Just here in Israel there's such a diversity of political views among just the Jews that we put 9 different political parties in the Knesset (not counting the Arab one). The holocaust, like everyone in [URL="https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1511301"]this thread[/URL] are so happy to point out over and over is just a historical event. One that had a significant fucking effect on everyone that lived through it as well as their offspring, sure. But not some magical nexus of human history that transformed all Jews into brethren that will forever more be unable to ever disagree with each other to the point that when a single group of Jews are dicks to another group of Jews its shocking proof that Jews are the worst ever. I mean, seriously.[/QUOTE] I was mainly pointing out how it shouldn't be surprising that Jews can be dicks to each other. Which we both agree on. The whole different sects thing was just kind of my reply back to the posts of how it's like Christians when they hate on different subsets for slightly different beliefs. I just think in cases like the ones in this article and what I mentioned that the motives of differing opinions are more unique. Stating someone isn't a real jew for whatever reason, even though they are obviously jewish, is a form of tribalism, so yah I used that term. I would use that behavior to describe any other Christian, Muslim, etc group too so calm down.

[QUOTE=Tudd;49984911] Stating someone isn't a real jew for whatever reason, even though they are obviously jewish, is a form of tribalism, so yah I used that term. I would use that behavior to describe any other Christian, Muslim, etc group too so calm down.[/QUOTE] What do you mean by obviously Jewish? The definition of being Jewish is being born to a Jewish mother or going through a conversion and if you're a male, getting circumcised. That's it.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49984932]What do you mean by obviously Jewish? The definition of being Jewish is being born to a Jewish mother or going through a conversion and if you're a male, getting circumcised. That's it.[/QUOTE] Could you not intentionally change the topic? You're asserting as though he said something antisemitic when his point was that some people, some Jewish people in this case, are making use of the No True Scottsman ideology to discount those they politically disagree with.

[QUOTE=bitches;49985019]Could you not intentionally change the topic? You're asserting as though he said something antisemitic when his point was that some people, some Jewish people in this case, are making use of the No True Scottsman ideology to discount those they politically disagree with.[/QUOTE] What I'm saying though is that No True Scotsman doesn't apply here because there are clear guidelines for who is a Jew and who isn't. I'm not asserting that he's anti semitic, I was just wondering what he meant by obviously Jewish

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49985040]What I'm saying though is that No True Scotsman doesn't apply here because there are clear guidelines for who is a Jew and who isn't. I'm not asserting that he's anti semitic, I was just wondering what he meant by obviously Jewish[/QUOTE] The fact that everyone knows he is jewish and he has said he is jewish and the fact that he has said his family went through the holocaust. His lineage is jewish as well, therefore he is "obviously" a jew.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49985040]What I'm saying though is that No True Scotsman doesn't apply here because there are clear guidelines for who is a Jew and who isn't. I'm not asserting that he's anti semitic, I was just wondering what he meant by obviously Jewish[/QUOTE] see the following: [QUOTE=Durandal;49985071]The fact that everyone knows he is jewish and he has said he is jewish and the fact that he has said his family went through the holocaust. His lineage is jewish as well, therefore he is "obviously" a jew.[/QUOTE] And consider that the point is there are literally Jewish people saying that other definite Jewish people are "not real jews" due to differing stance on politics. You are [I]completely[/I] derailing.