76 year old could face 5 years in jail for having unused shotguns in his cellar - Polidicks

[QUOTE]A 76-year-old Aberdeen first offender who left unwanted guns "gathering dust" in his basement has been warned he could face a five-year jail sentence. Police found a corroded sawn-off shotgun, another shotgun in poor condition and an antique pistol at Richard Watt's home. He admitted firearms offences at the High Court in Edinburgh. Watt was warned only exceptional circumstances could prevent a minimum sentence of five years. The court heard the guns were found in the former gun enthusiast's Corthan Crescent in September last year. Defence counsel Jonathan Crowe said that about 20 years ago a work colleague of Watt, who knew of his interest in guns, offered him two shotguns. He took them home to examine than and found the bag also contained the component parts for a sawn-off shotgun. Mr Crowe said Watt returned them to the colleague and said he did not want them - but the colleague also did not want them. The defence counsel said he knew he should have taken them to the police, but thought he might get himself or the colleague into trouble. He said Watt thought he would put them in the gun room in his cellar and "forget about them". He said they lay there gathering dust and added: "There is no suggestion the guns were recently used or fired."[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-28707075[/url]

Jesus, it's like police over here are just looking for a reason to exist half the time.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cun-LZvOTdw[/media]

I think this falls into that "exceptional circumstances" situation listed in the op. This is a little extreme.

[quote]Police found a corroded sawn-off shotgun, another shotgun in poor condition and an antique pistol at Richard Watt's home.[/quote] Oh god not 2 broken shotguns and a pistol, why even lock him away just execute this fiend!

so even if you own a gun, and not fired it or keep it as a decoration... you face prison time in scotland? sounds very stupid... that's like a police searching someone home and arresting the owner for owning a dagger...

[QUOTE=darkedone02;45638600]so even if you own a gun, and not fired it or keep it as a decoration... you face prison time in scotland? sounds very stupid... that's like a police searching someone home and arresting the owner for owning a dagger...[/QUOTE] Yeah, he didn't have it secured or deactivated, over here having a gun is a privilege that comes with the responsibility of making sure no one's going to be able to steal it and use it.

I doubt anyone could use a few old rusted guns for anything other than decoration.

[QUOTE=Rents;45638631]Yeah, he didn't have it secured or deactivated, over here having a gun is a privilege that comes with the responsibility of making sure no one's going to be able to steal it and use it.[/QUOTE] When you put it like that, it does seem less stupid. However, 5 years in jail still does seem a bit too harsh. The article mentions he put them in his "gun room". Don't know how secure that really is, but the article says [QUOTE]He said the guns had been kept in relatively secure conditions and there was little chance of them "falling into the wrong hands".[/QUOTE] Hopefully his plea for exceptional circumstances will be accepted and he'll be able to be let off with not much more than a slap on the wrist.

[QUOTE=Tinter;45638702]When you put it like that, it does seem less stupid. However, 5 years in jail still does seem a bit too harsh. The article mentions he put them in his "gun room". Don't know how secure that really is, but the article says Hopefully his plea for exceptional circumstances will be accepted and he'll be able to be let off with not much more than a slap on the wrist.[/QUOTE] Over here, 'secured' for a gun is in a safe that's bolted into the floor, so I hope he has a good lawyer.

[QUOTE=Rents;45638631]Yeah, he didn't have it secured or deactivated, over here having a gun is a privilege that comes with the responsibility of making sure no one's going to be able to steal it and use it.[/QUOTE] But is prison really an appropriate sentence?

Fucks sake, for having two shotguns tucked away in his basement, this guy could be getting a sentence that is 9 months less than someone who was a prolific paedophile, justice system my fucking arse.

Minimum sentences are dumb, yeah.

They are probably gonna let him off with a warning

[QUOTE=Rents;45638631]Yeah, he didn't have it secured or deactivated, over here having a gun is a privilege that comes with the responsibility of making sure no one's going to be able to steal it and use it.[/QUOTE] They were secured though. They were locked in a secure gun room.

the polis don't do anything if you surrender it, we found shotgun shells at the back of my garage that had been there since we moved in and the polis came and just made us a sign a form saying it was being surrendered and took it away

[QUOTE=codenamecueball;45639099]the polis don't do anything if you surrender it, we found shotgun shells at the back of my garage that had been there since we moved in and the polis came and just made us a sign a form saying it was being surrendered and took it away[/QUOTE] *police Let's hope they're reasonable enough about it in this case also.

Can't you keep old shotguns in Scotland If you register them and get signatures? In Ireland my grandfather has like 2 shotguns, but they're legal. He had to get stuff signed by the police though. I don't know If it's cause he's from a farmer background or If anyone can get them.

he could possibly die before he even leaves jail if he gets 5 years

Literally Hitler.

[QUOTE=download;45639084]They were secured though. They were locked in a secure gun room.[/QUOTE] "Secured" when referring to guns in the UK has a very specific legal requirement which he was not fulfilling. As someone above explained, they have to be kept in a secure gun safe/cabinet that is bolted to the floor - That is the legal requirement if you're going to own a gun. The thing is if he'd turned them over to the Police when he first received them, simply said he'd found them in his cellar due to a previous owner or whatever, then there wouldn't have been a problem. What is getting him into legal hot water is that he stored them, knowing he had them, incorrectly.

5 years for some shotguns that may never work again, and an antique? Damnit UK.

Frankly, he should have known better than this.

[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;45639106]*police Let's hope they're reasonable enough about it in this case also.[/QUOTE] *Scottish polis

Yeah it was wrong, but is it really that bad that he needs to be put in jail for what could be the rest of his life

[QUOTE=BarnacleDrive;45640280]Frankly, he should have known better than this.[/QUOTE] He does have the responsibility to keep them as safe as the law requires, regardless of what he thought of their condition. However, prison is way too harsh for a 'crime' like this, especially at his age. Just ban him from owning firearms.

Everyone keep in mind this is the maximum penalty he could serve. On top of that in a common law systems generally don't have minimum necessary sentences. What he did is against the objective law. Law on the other hand isn't purely positivistic. Which is why courts decide more than merely the guilty or nonguilty but also the punishment or actual societal danger.

[QUOTE=Rents;45638631]Yeah, he didn't have it secured or deactivated, over here having a gun is a privilege that comes with the responsibility of making sure no one's going to be able to steal it and use it.[/QUOTE] sounds like they'd have blown up in the thief's face if they tried though

[QUOTE=Sableye;45644343]sounds like they'd have blown up in the thief's face if they tried though[/QUOTE] how'd you know?

[QUOTE=Craigewan;45639853]"Secured" when referring to guns in the UK has a very specific legal requirement which he was not fulfilling. As someone above explained, they have to be kept in a secure gun safe/cabinet that is bolted to the floor - That is the legal requirement if you're going to own a gun.[/QUOTE] Just wanna add its a bit more than just a safe bolted to the floor, it's gotta have at least 2 locks, have reinforced housing or be a Grade 3 ~ 5 safe, be secured in a place that's going bring the least attention if the house is broken into and lastly you can't store more than 2 firearms per safe. The firearms officer will also have to physically check the safe, it's location and deem it if its acceptable or not, the firearms officer will, at random also visit the property to check up on the firearms and their keeping space every few years (however it has been known that you can get weekly or even monthly visits, it depends where you live and how many firearm officers there are in the area, for us we get something a check every 2~3 years with the odd planned check if we end up storing another gun for someone else). It's a fucking pain in the ass having to get another safe if my family wants to get a rifle to go with the 2 muskets and the cannon we've got.