• Trump questioned who is really behind anti-Semitic threats and vandalism, official says
    75 replies, posted
[URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/02/28/trump-questioned-who-is-really-behind-anti-semitic-threats-and-vandalism-official-says/?utm_term=.e8bd863008bc&tid=a_inl"]Washington Post[/URL] [QUOTE]President Trump questioned who was behind a recent spate of anti-Semitic threats and incidents during a meeting with state attorneys general on Tuesday, one of the people present said after the gathering. When Pennsylvania Attorney General Josh Shapiro (D) asked him about the recent threats against Jewish facilities, the president responded by condemning the statements but then [B]“suggested the ‘reverse’ may be true,”[/B] Shapiro said. “I don’t know what the president meant by that statement,” Shapiro said in a statement. Trump “made this reference that sometimes it’s the reverse” and then “used that word ‘reverse’ several times,” Joe Grace, a spokesman for Shapiro, said in a telephone interview Tuesday afternoon. Grace was relaying what Shapiro had said publicly during a phone call with reporters earlier Tuesday. Shapiro’s account of the meeting with Trump was first reported by [URL="https://billypenn.com/2017/02/28/pa-attorney-general-trump-said-jcc-threats-may-have-come-from-the-reverse/"]Billy Penn[/URL]. According to the Billy Penn report, a reporter asked if Shapiro interpreted Trump’s statements to mean that the president thinks his supporters are being framed, but Shapiro responded by saying he is unsure what Trump was implying. “The attorney general honestly does not know what the president meant by that,” Grace said, adding that Shapiro “hoped that there would be clarity on those remarks” when Trump delivers a speech before Congress on Tuesday evening. Trump did mention the anti-Semitic incidents during his speech to Congress on Tuesday night, although he did not elaborate on who he thinks could be responsible. He [URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2017/live-updates/trump-white-house/real-time-fact-checking-and-analysis-of-trumps-address-to-congress/trump-opens-speech-responding-to-anti-semitism-kansas-shooting/?utm_term=.04099a9141d0"]opened his remarks[/URL] by mentioning both the anti-Semitic threats and vandalism and [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/02/28/fbi-investigating-shooting-of-two-indian-men-in-kansas-as-a-hate-crime/"]the fatal shooting of an Indian man[/URL] in Kansas last week. “Recent threats targeting Jewish Community Centers and vandalism of Jewish cemeteries, as well as last week’s shooting in Kansas City, remind us that while we may be a nation divided on policies, we are a country that stands united in condemning hate and evil in all its forms,” Trump said. (The shooting death of an Indian man in Kansas actually occurred in Olathe, Kan., just outside Kansas City.) Florida Attorney General Pam Bondi (R), a Trump supporter during the campaign, also attended the meeting earlier Tuesday, but declined to comment about what was said. “I know first-hand President Trump cares deeply about our Jewish community and is extremely upset by these attacks,” Bondi said in a statement. “His daughter, son-in-law and three of his grandchildren are Jewish. We pray these attacks, as well as any potential copycat attacks, cease.” Trump’s comments on the issue came after [URL="http://jcca.org/news-and-views/outraged-new-rash-bomb-threats/"]a wave of bomb threats[/URL] at Jewish centers and schools on Monday and the [URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/02/27/philadelphia-police-investigate-reprehensible-toppling-of-100-headstones-at-jewish-cemetery/?utm_term=.ff7d3f381614"]toppling of more than 100 headstones at a Jewish cemetery[/URL] in Philadelphia over the weekend. The bomb threats were the latest in a spate of such incidents nationwide so far this year, while the headstone episode occurred a week after similar vandalism at a cemetery near St. Louis.[/QUOTE]
Basically Trump implied the attacks were a false flag. Interesting. Not that one would expect better from a man who gets all his news from Infowars, but it's hardly a wonder that white nationalists and neo-nazis support him.
I think Trump is losing his mind at this point. The dude talks like he has early stage alzheimers.
[QUOTE=Kyle902;51891681]I think Trump is losing his mind at this point. The dude talks like he has early stage alzheimers.[/QUOTE] Might explain why it seems like he tells the same speech over and over again.
I'm no expert but I believe that the antisemitic attacks may possible have been done by an antisemite.
You have muslim women making false reports about people attacking them and a dude that burned his church down and blamed it on Trump. It's not far-fetched to think the recent vandalism may be false flags aswell.
Nope. Fuck this guy. This is way too far, even for Trump. You do not utterly fail to denounce antisemitism, and then blame anti-Semitic attacks on Jews.
[quote]When Pennsylvania Attorney General Josh Shapiro (D) asked him about the recent threats against Jewish facilities, the president responded by condemning the statements but then “suggested the ‘reverse’ may be true,” Shapiro said. “I don’t know what the president meant by that statement,” Shapiro said in a statement. Trump “made this reference that sometimes it’s the reverse” and then “used that word ‘reverse’ several times,” Joe Grace, a spokesman for Shapiro, said in a telephone interview Tuesday afternoon. Grace was relaying what Shapiro had said publicly during a phone call with reporters earlier Tuesday.[/quote] I wonder what Fox broadcast he heard this line from
[QUOTE=-nesto-;51891785]You have muslim women making false reports about people attacking them and a dude that burned his church down and blamed it on Trump. It's not far-fetched to think the recent vandalism may be false flags aswell.[/QUOTE] And a shitload more attacks that aren't being faked. Interesting you'll only focus on the fake ones, hmm? As you always do. If one is to have a nuanced and realistic view of the world, one must consider the big picture, without ignoring the parts that make your argument fall apart. That goes as well for ignoring the evils Trump has done and focusing only on the good - of which there's barely any at all. The only reason, in fact, that one would studiously ignore all of these things is because one is a white nationalist.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891653]Basically Trump implied the attacks were a false flag. Interesting. Not that one would expect better from a man who gets all his news from Infowars, but it's hardly a wonder that white nationalists and neo-nazis support him.[/QUOTE] Alex Jones and Fox news
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891839]And a shitload more attacks that aren't being faked. Interesting you'll only focus on the fake ones, hmm? As you always do. If one is to have a nuanced and realistic view of the world, one must consider the big picture, without ignoring the parts that make your argument fall apart. That goes as well for ignoring the evils Trump has done and focusing only on the good - of which there's barely any at all. The only reason, in fact, that one would studiously ignore all of these things is because one is a white nationalist.[/QUOTE] Yup, only a nazi would say hey there's been alot of bullshit faking going on so it's entirely possible this could be fake aswell. :hurr:
[QUOTE=-nesto-;51891923]Yup, only a nazi would say hey there's been alot of bullshit faking going on so it's entirely possible this could be fake aswell. :hurr:[/QUOTE] A lot? All right, you're on. I'm sure you can dig up a large number of cases that proved to be false. Let's see how many I can dig up that prove to have been real. Should my number prove larger, you admit you're full of shit. I raise you the Southern Poverty Law Centre's report of [B]1064 incidents[/B] of hate crime since the election, which they update regularly: [url]https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2016/12/16/update-1094-bias-related-incidents-month-following-election[/url] Only 13 of those have been proven to be false. Your turn. Put up, or shut up.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891939]A lot? All right, you're on. I'm sure you can dig up a large number of cases that proved to be false. Let's see how many I can dig up that prove to have been real. Should my number prove larger, you admit you're full of shit. I raise you the Southern Poverty Law Centre's report of 1064 incidents of hate crime since the election, which they update regularly Only 13 of those have been proven to be false. Your turn. Put up, or shut up.[/QUOTE] The SPLC list is absolute crap. Almost all of it is totally unverified. I'm not sure why people seem to think they are some objective think tank. They are an unabashedly biased interest group at this point.
[QUOTE]The SPLC collected reports from news articles, social media, and direct submissions via our #ReportHate intake page. The SPLC made every effort to verify each report, but many included in the count remain anecdotal.[/QUOTE] Get a better source buckaroo. Other than the recent bar shooting, what high profile hate crimes have there been?
[QUOTE=-nesto-;51891785]You have muslim women making false reports about people attacking them and a dude that burned his church down and blamed it on Trump. It's not far-fetched to think the recent vandalism may be false flags aswell.[/QUOTE] There's a popular saying among doctors. When you hear hooves, think horses. If there's nothing to suggest these threats aren't genuine, insisting on alternatives arguendo is pointless and just wastes time.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891943]The SPLC list is absolute crap. Almost all of it is totally unverified. I'm not sure why people seem to think they are some objective think tank. They are an unabashedly biased interest group at this point.[/QUOTE] Sounds to me like they're doing their due diligence to track false claims. [url]https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2016/12/16/update-1094-bias-related-incidents-month-following-election[/url] You're going to have to come up with evidence supporting your claim that the list is crap. I did some digging into the SLPC, and while they're considered left-leaning, their research, particularly on their Hatewatch reports, has no legitimate criticism against it that I could find. [editline]1st March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=-nesto-;51891950]Get a better source buckaroo. Other than the recent bar shooting, what high profile hate crimes have there been?[/QUOTE] High profile? [url]http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/28/us/bomb-threats-jewish-centers-jcc/[/url] Where's your proof that "many" people are faking hate crime reports, boyo? I'm the only one here dropping evidence so far. [I]Surely[/I] you've got something. Again, put up or shut up.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891962]Sounds to me like they're doing their due diligence to track false claims. [URL]https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2016/12/16/update-1094-bias-related-incidents-month-following-election[/URL] You're going to have to come up with evidence supporting your claim that the list is crap. I did some digging into the SLPC, and while they're considered left-leaning, their research, particularly on their Hatewatch reports, has no criticism against it that I could find.[/QUOTE] The very first paragraph of your link says: "The SPLC made every effort to verify each report, but many included in the count remain anecdotal." (How much is "many?") The burden of proof lies on you, and the SPLC, to verify these, not on me to disprove them. [editline]28th February 2017[/editline] Throwing up a big number is meaningless without the evidence behind it.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891967]Throwing up a big number is meaningless without the evidence behind it.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=-nesto-;51891923]there's been alot of bullshit faking going on[/QUOTE] Hmmm.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891967]The very first paragraph of your link says: "The SPLC made every effort to verify each report, but many included in the count remain anecdotal." The burden of proof lies on you, and the SPLC, to verify these, not on me to disprove them. [editline]28th February 2017[/editline] Throwing up a big number is meaningless without the evidence behind it.[/QUOTE] That's exactly what I said. I'm pointing out that they're doing what they can to verify the reports. No shit some will be faked. And as soon as they're verified as faked, they're stricken from the list. I'm asserting to Nesto that faking these reports isn't as big an issue as he's pretending it is. You're the one making the assertion "The SLPC list is total crap." Evidence is everything. Put up, or shut up.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891978]That's exactly what I said. I'm pointing out that they're doing what they can to verify the reports. No shit some will be faked. And as soon as they're verified as faked, they're stricken from the list. I'm asserting to Nesto that faking these reports isn't as big an issue as he's pretending it is. You're the one making the assertion "The SLPC list is total crap." Evidence is everything. Put up, or shut up.[/QUOTE] ... You have presented nothing to show that the list is legitimate. Nothing. There's no report going through each case proving their validity. They fully admit that "many" are anecdotal, but don't say how many that is. Etc. You're doing nothing more than appealing to the authority of the SPLC, a group that is known as being extremely biased. You've given us no reason to trust the number's veracity.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891982]... You have presented nothing to show that the list is legitimate. Nothing.[/QUOTE] Sorry, where's your evidence of rampant fake reports?
[QUOTE=Paramud;51891986]Sorry, where's your evidence of rampant fake reports?[/QUOTE] When did I make that claim? I can only look at cases that have actually been verified, and we know for certain that quite a few were faked and/or not presented correctly (like the Muslim woman assaulted on the subway, the burned down church, etc.)
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891982]... You have presented nothing to show that the list is legitimate. Nothing. There's no report going through each case proving their validity. They fully admit that "many" are anecdotal, but don't say how many that is. Etc. You're doing nothing more than appealing to the authority of the SPLC, a group that is known as being extremely biased.[/QUOTE] Rhetoric gets you nowhere. Evidence gets you everywhere. I posted a report indicating that there have been 1064 incidents of hate crime since the election. While many, of course, are unverified, only a small number have been proven to be false. Your assertion that the list is total crap has still had no evidence backing it up, only your complaints about the apparent bias of the SLPC's research, again, without evidence. Let's see something substantial. If you can give me supporting evidence of any sort that even indicates at least twenty percent of those reports are faked, I'll concede it's a serious problem. Until then, you've got zilch. Tell you what. At least prove to me that SLPC is not doing their part to weed out false claims. I'll make it easy for you.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891995]Rhetoric gets you nowhere. Evidence gets you everywhere. I posted a report indicating that there have been 1064 incidents of hate crime since the election. While many, of course, are unverified, only a small number have been proven to be false. Your assertion that the list is total crap has still had no evidence backing it up, only your complaints about the apparent bias of the SLPC's research, again, without evidence. Let's see something substantial. If you can give me supporting evidence of any sort that even indicates at least twenty percent of those reports are faked, I'll concede it's a serious problem. Until then, you've got zilch. Tell you what. At least prove to me that SLPC is not doing their part to weed out false claims. I'll make it easy for you.[/QUOTE] No, you didn't post a report. You posted a website that is known to be biased saying that they have a report. Post the actual report that goes into how they verified the claims and we can talk.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891993]When did I make that claim? I can only look at cases that have actually been verified, and we know for certain that quite a few were faked and/or not presented correctly (like the Muslim woman assaulted on the subway, the burned down church, etc.)[/QUOTE] You're attacking archangel for having a source with actual numbers while nesto made a claim about "lots of bullshit faking" with no sources and yet I'm hearing nothing from you about that.
[QUOTE=Paramud;51891998]You're attacking archangel for having a source with actual numbers while nesto made a claim about "lots of bullshit faking" with no sources and yet I'm hearing nothing from you about that.[/QUOTE] I'm not having a conversation with nesto? If you want to call him out, then be my guest.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51892001]I'm not having a conversation with nesto? If you want to call him out, then be my guest.[/QUOTE] How about you try to hide your blatant hypocrisy a little bit better.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51891997]No, you didn't post a report. You posted a website that is known to be biased saying that they have a report. Post the actual report that goes into how they verified the claims and we can talk.[/QUOTE] sgman91, I seem to recall in a previous conversation that you made the assertion that the police department and judiciary in Ferguson were not deliberately targeting African Americans. I presented you with pages and pages of quotes from the US State Department investigation report indicating that you were wrong. You dismissed the evidence and insisted upon your point. I continued posting evidence that contradicted you, until you eventually stopped replying. The evidence I presented would make any human being who was intellectually honest concede, but you did not. This time, I'm making you do the legwork. Let's see what you've got. Because I learned exactly what you were that day. Prove me wrong. If you can't put up, shut up. You're talk and nothing more.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51891962]Sounds to me like they're doing their due diligence to track false claims. [url]https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2016/12/16/update-1094-bias-related-incidents-month-following-election[/url] You're going to have to come up with evidence supporting your claim that the list is crap. I did some digging into the SLPC, and while they're considered left-leaning, their research, particularly on their Hatewatch reports, has no legitimate criticism against it that I could find. [editline]1st March 2017[/editline] High profile? [url]http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/28/us/bomb-threats-jewish-centers-jcc/[/url] Where's your proof that "many" people are faking hate crime reports, boyo? I'm the only one here dropping evidence so far. [I]Surely[/I] you've got something. Again, put up or shut up.[/QUOTE] Well, for starters from the SPLC [url]http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/north-park-fabricated-notes-402556366.html[/url] [url]http://www.phillyvoice.com/police-no-official-report-ugly-racial-incident-del-gas-station/[/url] And high profile nationwide cases that turned out to be bullshit [url]http://people.com/crime/muslim-girl-charged-false-report/[/url] [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/11/10/women-in-hijabs-on-2-campuses-say-they-were-attacked-by-men-invoking-donald-trump/[/url] [url]http://www.mediaite.com/online/black-man-charged-with-arson-for-burning-of-african-american-church-spray-painted-with-vote-trump/[/url] Unrelated to Trump but nonetheless topical [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2015/10/30/suspect-arrested-for-arson-following-string-of-st-louis-church-fires/?utm_term=.182fb3c554d9[/url] Everyone thought those dirty nazis were going around burning black churches during Mike Brown and lo and behold it was a black dude doing it. The fact is, people fake attacks and damage to further their political goals. I'm not saying the JCC threats and the cemetery vandalism are false flags but it's entirely plausible that it could be.
i'm glad that after the quebec shooting, the texas mosque burning, the two indian engineers being shot in a bar, all that, we can still agree that the most important crime to focus on, are the hoaxes.
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