Indonesia executes 8 this morning - including Australians Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran - Polidicks

Source: [url]http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-04-29/andrew-chan-and-myuran-sukumaran-executed/6426654[/url] [quote]Australians Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran have been executed by firing squad in Indonesia, prompting Australia to recall its ambassador from Jakarta in protest. Convicted drug traffickers Chan, 31, and Sukumaran, 34, were shot dead on the prison island of Nusakambangan in the early hours of this morning. They were killed along with six other death row prisoners just before 3:30am AEST. This morning Prime Minister Tony Abbott said Australia was withdrawing its ambassador from Jakarta in the wake of the "cruel and unnecessary" executions. In a brief statement, the families of the two men said: "Today we lost Myuran and Andrew. Our sons, our brothers". "In the 10 years since they were arrested, they did all they could to make amends, helping many others. They asked for mercy, but there was none. They were immensely grateful for all the support they received. We too, will be forever grateful." Foreign Minister Julie Bishop confirmed the deaths of the Australians, saying gunfire had been heard from Nusakambangan during the night."[/quote] To the people rating this late, I am aware of the article regarding their imminent deaths. This is explicitly about the fact that they have now been executed. It also mentions the fact their ambassador has now been recalled. If it's too similar to the other one, mods feel free to close it.

we'll them and Australia are going to in hot water.

Waiting 10 years with nothing but death on your mind is unforgivable torture

[QUOTE]"They had initially not allowed them to have their nominated pastors with them over there on the island for last-minute consolation," he said. "But we understand that a short time beforehand they were allowed to have those pastors over there. "[But] when it came to the actual execution itself, we understand that nobody was there to witness that, although normally the nominated religious clerics are there to witness the death penalty being carried out and actually give the last rites to the people who are facing the firing squad. They were refused clemency by Indonesian president Joko Widodo as part of a hardline stance on the death penalty for convicted drug criminals. They were shot dead despite an emotional final plea for clemency from the Chan and Sukumaran families only hours before the execution.[/QUOTE]

I think it's pretty barbaric to kill someone over drugs. Rape, murder? Can understand ( but do not condone the death penalty in any form), but drugs? Extreme... but then again places in indonesia like singapore are well known for that sort of thing. Still sickening.

[QUOTE=Instant Mix;47623956]I think it's pretty barbaric to kill someone over drugs. Rape, murder? Can understand ( but do not condone the death penalty in any form), but drugs? Extreme... but then again places in indonesia like singapore are well known for that sort of thing. Still sickening.[/QUOTE] This entire war on drugs is insane, especially in those countries I mean seriously, give them like 7 years or something. That seems perfectly fair.

[QUOTE=mcgrath618;47624273]This entire war on drugs is insane, especially in those countries I mean seriously, give them like 7 years or something. That seems perfectly fair.[/QUOTE] 7 years still isn't fair.

[QUOTE=Twistai;47624390]7 years still isn't fair.[/QUOTE] You're right, but baby steps

5000 die in nepal and no one bats an eye 2 ex drugs smugglers get executed and everyone loses their minds [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Don't post just to put your epic zinger, reference or pun." - OvB))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=IceBlizzard;47624474]5000 die in nepal and no one bats an eye 2 ex drugs smugglers get executed and everyone loses their minds[/QUOTE] Don't know about you but over here the earthquake in Nepal gets as much if not more coverage than this ordeal.

[QUOTE=IceBlizzard;47624474]5000 die in nepal and no one bats an eye 2 ex drugs smugglers get executed and everyone loses their minds[/QUOTE] heheh sick nasty reference bruh

[QUOTE=IceBlizzard;47624474]5000 die in nepal and no one bats an eye 2 ex drugs smugglers get executed and everyone loses their minds[/QUOTE] you're right, we should execute that damnable earthquake.

[QUOTE=BrickInHead;47624694]you're right, we should execute that damnable earthquake.[/QUOTE] death to seismologists

This is just wrong. I'm against the death penalty, but this is just above and beyond: 10 years in jail waiting for death because of a crime that even get a life sentence years in most countries.

There's also the rest of the Bali 9, which they all had gotten life imprisonment except for one, who was given a 20 year sentence. Still a bunch of bullshit all around, drug charges are taken way too seriously in this country. From a [URL="http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/bali-nine-indonesia-says-executions-of-andrew-chan-myuran-sukumaran-were-perfect/story-fnh81fz8-1227327478332"]different article[/URL], which was really sad to read, and it goes in detail with what happened [quote] "“The executions have been successfully implemented, perfectly,” “All worked, no misses,” - Attorney-General HM Prasetyo[/quote] [quote]Chan and Sukumaran courageously declined the offer of hoods and watched the firing squads take aim and fire. Medical teams declared all the men dead three minutes after they were shot.[/quote] Jesus Christ. [quote]Charlie Burrows says Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran were executed with their arms outstretched on what were effectively crucifixes.[/quote] Charlie Burrows was one of the witnesses for the people being executed.

Had they not been caught, their product would have caused nothing but ruin, misery and death. They knew that, they knew the risks, and they did it anyway. For personal financial gain. They got nothing more than what they deserved. Why don't we have a news article on the thirty-three Indonesians who die every day from drugs?

[QUOTE=lazyguy;47625526]Had they not been caught, their product would have caused nothing but ruin, misery and death. They knew that, they knew the risks, and they did it anyway. For personal financial gain. They got nothing more than what they deserved. Why don't we have a news article on the thirty-three Indonesians who die every day from drugs?[/QUOTE] You should understand though, that a lot of folks don't believe in the death penalty for drug smuggling, or that there should be any death penalty at all. And to be honest, none of us in the way society's at, at present, are capable of remaining objective enough in our judgments for it to still be a legal punishment. For the most part, it's just state sanctioned killing done to satisfy the principle of an eye for an eye. In an ideal society, life sentences should be the highest quantum of punishment. Note that I'm talking only about the ideal bit here. We won't see any such thing in our lifetimes or even a dozen generations from now, but we can try to work towards it. Also don't forget that they were, in some way, reformed because of their time in prison and spent that time educating other inmates that it was wrong to smuggle drugs. Punishment is meant to try and reform offenders, that's the point of a penal system, trying to make people realize what they did was wrong. I'll admit your points on the ill effects of drugs, having seen what they can do to people on a day to day basis. Yes, drugs cause addiction. Yes, they cause suffering. Yes, they can cause lives to be torn apart. Yes, good people have died in the so-called war on drugs. But you have to understand that drug addiction isn't as simple as it looks to overcome, much less educate others on what will happen to them if they start getting addicted to drugs. People start to see it as an escape from reality, and then it goes downhill from there. Peer pressure, lionizing of drug use, societal factors, poverty, mental illnesses, all of these factors and more are the ones responsible for driving somebody into using drugs. Though ultimately it's the individual's choice - even educated people who know it's not going to do them any good will take to drugs either to escape, or because they dont give a shit until something bad happens. Much the same can be observed in the use of alcohol or tobacco products, both of which are basically legal addictions. The prisoners did do it for financial gain and for the thrill of it. Only thing is, death isn't going to change anything. They were harmless and showing remorse. The state should have been the better men and commuted their sentencing. Human rights are an inalienable thing, you can't simply flick a switch on and off and say that somebody no longer deserves those rights. The right to life is among them. Even the shittiest human beings still deserve those rights.

[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;47625640]You should understand though, that a lot of folks don't believe in the death penalty for drug smuggling, or that there should be any death penalty at all. And to be honest, none of us in the way society's at, at present, are capable of remaining objective enough in our judgments for it to still be a legal punishment. For the most part, it's just state sanctioned killing done to satisfy the principle of an eye for an eye. [/quote]Any criminal sentence can ruin lives. Few people will hire convicts. Fines can cause financial ruin. And yet you seem to consider us objective enough to mete out these. The purpose of punishment is to stop people from committing crimes in the first place. [quote] Also don't forget that they were, in some way, reformed because of their time in prison and spent that time educating other inmates that it was wrong to smuggle drugs. Punishment is meant to try and reform offenders, that's the point of a penal system, trying to make people realize what they did was wrong. [/quote] The point of a penal system is a) to protect the innocent from those who would do them harm, b) deter citizens from committing crime, c) punish those who do and finally d) reform those who can be reformed. Whether they claim, after they've been caught and sentenced and have execution looming over their heads, that they are reformed, affects only point d. [quote] I'll admit your points on the ill effects of drugs, having seen what they can do to people on a day to day basis. Yes, drugs cause addiction. Yes, they cause suffering. Yes, they can cause lives to be torn apart. Yes, good people have died in the so-called war on drugs. But you have to understand that drug addiction isn't as simple as it looks to overcome, much less educate others on what will happen to them if they start getting addicted to drugs. People start to see it as an escape from reality, and then it goes downhill from there. Peer pressure, lionizing of drug use, societal factors, poverty, mental illnesses, all of these factors and more are the ones responsible for driving somebody into using drugs. Though ultimately it's the individual's choice - even educated people who know it's not going to do them any good will take to drugs either to escape, or because they dont give a shit until something bad happens. Much the same can be observed in the use of alcohol or tobacco products, both of which are basically legal addictions. [/quote] This is all well and good, but the fact is that all the demand in the world does nothing without supply. These people were the supply. [quote] The prisoners did do it for financial gain and for the thrill of it. Only thing is, death isn't going to change anything. They were harmless and showing remorse. The state should have been the better men and commuted their sentencing. Human rights are an inalienable thing, you can't simply flick a switch on and off and say that somebody no longer deserves those rights. The right to life is among them. Even the shittiest human beings still deserve those rights.[/QUOTE] They were most certainly not harmless; they were willing to do untold damage to others to service their own greed. The state should stand by its initial judgement and carry out the sentence pronounced. And as for human rights - you yourself advocate the infringement of the right to free movement.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;47626055]Any criminal sentence can ruin lives. Few people will hire convicts. Fines can cause financial ruin. And yet you seem to consider us objective enough to mete out these. The purpose of punishment is to stop people from committing crimes in the first place.[/QUOTE] The point is that any criminal sentence is reversible to some extent, with the exception of death sentence. Unless you find a way to resurrect dead people, you can't argue against the fact that this is a huge issue, especially when you find out that they were actually innocent after carrying the sentence (which has already happened in the past). Given that the death sentence serves absolutely no practical purpose that a life sentence wouldn't, aside from satisfying the mob's crude urge to put criminals to death, any nation that still perpetrates the death sentence to this day cannot pretend they are juridically sound or humane.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;47626055]Huge Post[/QUOTE] Drugs are a different kettle of fish. It's almost entirely finance based, yes it may cause misery to others but these people [the drug consumers] are doing this out of their own volition, the bali nine are not getting drugs and ramming it down peoples throats - they are simply a business. I do not remotely condone anything in the form of hard drugs, however these people are not remotely on the same quanta as rapists or murders - it really is the equivalent of giving a banker or government official the death sentence for austerity. I am very sure that in some form the decreased amount of funds will negatively effect people in a way that may turn them to drugs... Do you sort of see the point I'm trying to establish? Drugs aren't OK ( the heavier narcotics ) but these people did not directly harm or injure people or have the intent to harm or injure people - they were in it for the money. Doesn't make them good people but doesn't necessarily mean that their lives should be prematurely terminated. Plus, the death penalty as a form of deterrent just simply does not work. At all. Just look up any of the figures.

I'm not sure how drug crews work on that side but the guys were caught with 18 pounds of herion. Surely he may have been connected to a Mexican drug cartel? The death penalty is pretty harsh but lets also not pretend like this was some small time pawn.

[QUOTE=Twistai;47624390]7 years still isn't fair.[/QUOTE] It's drugs man. Just let the government legalize everything and profit like bastard

The aussie police must feel like shit, seeing as they tipped off the indonesian police. They should had arrested them upon arrival to australia instead