(sorry if this is late; I searched but found nothing)
[QUOTE]Video of unarmed transit guards watching a girl being beaten on a bus tunnel platform has prompted Seattle authorities to review guidelines that kept the guards from intervening.
As the victim was beaten, the guards didn't intervene. Instead, they called in the incident to authorities. As police arrived, the people at the scene fled, but officers eventually arrested four people, including the suspect in the assault.
...
"The security guards have a range of duties," Desmond said, "including providing routine assistance and safety reminders to customers and reporting suspicious objects, disruptive behavior and equipment problems in the tunnel stations. Intervention by civilian security guards when a violent crime is being committed can have serious consequences for bystanders and the guards themselves.
"Therefore, we will rely on the expertise of our sheriff's office and others as we review the circumstances surrounding this particular incident, and review a range of issues including the appropriate level of response that should be authorized to effectively defuse such situations."[/QUOTE]
source: [url]http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/02/11/seattle.beating/index.html[/url]
Like this means anything. If the sheriff's office had any 'expertise' this wouldn't have happened in the first place. More political maneuvering and posturing. Yuck.
Well it is really due to liability and all that, these guards are not trained like police are. Let say if one of them did something to stop it, the suspect did get hurt by the guard. That suspect could sue the company. They did the right thing and kept to their job description.
[QUOTE=MR-X;20425231]Well it is really due to liability and all that, these guards are not trained like police are. Let say if one of them did something to stop it, the suspect did get hurt by the guard. That suspect could sue the company. They did the right thing and kept to their job description.[/QUOTE]
This.
They aren't superheroes.
[QUOTE=wheresmyfish;20425176] If the sheriff's office had any 'expertise' this wouldn't have happened in the first place.[/QUOTE]
You do realize Minority Report was just a movie, right?
A Fight breaking out in the downtown bus tunnel who would think it. I had at least 3 people try to sell me dope in the 5 mins i was waiting for my bus.
They are a bunch of fucking morons for not doing ANYTHING. No matter what you say, they should have at least gotten the girl up at the very least, and probably push the girls away.
[QUOTE=MR-X;20425231]Well it is really due to liability and all that, these guards are not trained like police are. Let say if one of them did something to stop it, the suspect did get hurt by the guard. That suspect could sue the company. They did the right thing and kept to their job description.[/QUOTE]
I'm not a security guard, I'm not trained in the field, but I'd still step in. It's just immoral to watch and do nothing.
[QUOTE=trent_roolz;20425488]They are a bunch of fucking morons for not doing ANYTHING. No matter what you say, they should have at least gotten the girl up at the very least, and probably push the girls away.[/QUOTE]
Then get their company sued, put out of a job, and have an entire area of work (Private Security) ruined for them.
Totally worth it!
This girl isent some innocent victim and she probably wont be getting anything in court. this is the same person who also jumped another girl and has been caught shoplifting on a few occasions and also punched a lady wile trying to steal her purse, But she claims that she has a heart condition. Why diden't her heart condition stop her from punching someone in the face?
Rick Sanchez makes me lose it. He is such a fucking idiot. Guards are told not to become involved in confrontations in case they get beaten up or killed themselves if someone produces a weapon. Like MR-X said too, they are also legally liable for any sort of injury they could potentially cause. They did the right thing.
"Observe and Report" is the motto of the private security industry.
[QUOTE=wheresmyfish;20425176]Like this means anything. If the sheriff's office had any 'expertise' this wouldn't have happened in the first place. More political maneuvering and posturing. Yuck.[/QUOTE]
There is this thing called 'response time', how long it takes for an officer to get from where he is, to where he needs to go. It's not instant, if there are no cops at the scene already, you have to wait for them... I can't believe I have to explain this.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;20426615]There is this thing called 'response time', how long it takes for an officer to get from where he is, to where he needs to go. It's not instant, if there are no cops at the scene already, you have to wait for them... I can't believe I have to explain this.[/QUOTE]
This is new shit to me. Rated informative.
Why is anyone complaining about the security guards not doing anything? They called the cops, didn't they? They did all they can do, not being allowed or trained to do anything else.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;20426615]There is this thing called 'response time', how long it takes for an officer to get from where he is, to where he needs to go. It's not instant, if there are no cops at the scene already, you have to wait for them... I can't believe I have to explain this.[/QUOTE]
I'm going to assume you're being sarcastic. Becuase when the [i]guards[/i] are yards away from the fight, the 'response time' should be about three and a half seconds.
[QUOTE=wheresmyfish;20429027]I'm going to assume you're being sarcastic. Becuase when the [i]guards[/i] are yards away from the fight, the 'response time' should be about three and a half seconds.[/QUOTE]
The guards can't do shit, well, they can, but they'd be risking their jobs and a lawsuit if they did. The most they can do is call the Police and wait for them to arrive. Unlike Police, Security Officers don't have any laws to protect them from being sued in these situations.
[QUOTE=MR-X;20425231]Well it is really due to liability and all that, these guards are not trained like police are. Let say if one of them did something to stop it, the suspect did get hurt by the guard. That suspect could sue the company. They did the right thing and kept to their job description.[/QUOTE]
You know what, I'd rather lose my sad fucking job as a "guard" and get sued than to just stand by and watch as a 15 year old girl gets physically abused.
[QUOTE=demoguy08;20431551]You know what, I'd rather lose my sad fucking job as a "guard" and get sued than just watch as a 15 year old girl gets abused.[/QUOTE]
You should all stop complaining. The reality is the guards did their job, and so did the police. If anyone really should be given blame its everyone else who decided not to do a damn thing.
They didn't do their jobs as compassionate, moral human beings. Then again, neither did any of the bystanders. Society is just fucked up.
[QUOTE=Exploits;20431568]You should all stop complaining. The reality is the guards did their job, and so did the police. If anyone really should be given blame its everyone else who decided not to do a damn thing.[/QUOTE]
They're right, it's a moral injustice to just watch some kid get the shit beat out of her. So what if I lose my minimum wage job as a guard because I helped someone, in the end I'd feel better. Now what I don't know is the legality of protecting someone else, because it isn't self-defense. I hate to say it, but we need Lankist in here.
[editline]10:13AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=demoguy08;20431700]They didn't do their jobs as compassionate, moral human beings. Then again, neither did any of the bystanders. Society is just fucked up.[/QUOTE]
It's called diffusion of responsibility, it's the effect of people in groups projecting responsibility onto one another silently. It results in the entire group doing nothing in the face of someone in trouble.
The bystander effect, sure. But I saw the clip, there weren't [I]that[/I] many people on the platform if I recall correctly.
[QUOTE=leet;20425619]I'm not a security guard, I'm not trained in the field, but I'd still step in. It's just immoral to watch and do nothing.[/QUOTE]
At the same time you have to consider the legal ramifications. I know beureacracy sucks but i'd rather leave something to the profesionals than sit in a cell. If it were only civilians i'm sure they would help but as there are transit guards present people expect them to step out of their job description and risk legal action. People need to realise that at the end of the day you should stick to your job description. It's the only sure fire way to avoid getting suspended or even fired.
[QUOTE=trent_roolz;20425488]They are a bunch of fucking morons for not doing ANYTHING. No matter what you say, they should have at least gotten the girl up at the very least, and probably push the girls away.[/QUOTE]
Would you have helped? NO.
There was a large group of them, you mess with the baby mama of one of the thugs what's going to stop the 10-15 people associated with this fight turning on you and possibly killing you?
If I was unarmed I would have not intervened, because it would be stupid to risk my own life knowing that I would most likely not make a difference.
It might not have been 10-15, but if I remember from the video there were more than 2 people watching this fight who were most likely associated with the one doing the fighting.
Again, leet wouldn't have done anything either.
NO ONE IN HERE WOULD HAVE STEPPED IN.
[QUOTE=Squad;20433172]NO ONE IN HERE WOULD HAVE STEPPED IN.[/QUOTE]
Actually I have stepped in for situations like this, but long before they turn into fights. The one time it was, everyone else stepped in too. People love a leader.
[QUOTE=wheresmyfish;20425176](sorry if this is late; I searched but found nothing)[/QUOTE]
Did you really do a search? This story was posted two weeks ago, and this isn't an update it's the same story.
[url]http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=893286[/url]
[QUOTE=MachiniOs;20433118]At the same time you have to consider the legal ramifications. I know beureacracy sucks but i'd rather leave something to the profesionals than sit in a cell. If it were only civilians i'm sure they would help but as there are transit guards present people expect them to step out of their job description and risk legal action. People need to realise that at the end of the day you should stick to your job description. It's the only sure fire way to avoid getting suspended or even fired.[/QUOTE]
"at the end of the day you should stick to your job description."
What the hell kind of twisted illogic is that? That not only spits in the face of human morality and ethics, it's the logic of a coward. "Well I'm not paid to do it, so I guess I should just ignore it..." It's ignorant ideologies like this that allows military dictators to keep their people under control; assuming that they wont act for what's morally right. It's people that just "keep their head down" that allow [URL=http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/predators/kitty_genovese/1.html]things like this[/URL] to happen. Kitty Genovese was fatally stabbed while almost 30 people watched without doing anything. You sir need to get your priorities straight.
[QUOTE=Gorgonoth;20434826]"at the end of the day you should stick to your job description."
What the hell kind of twisted illogic is that? That not only spits in the face of human morality and ethics, it's the logic of a coward. "Well I'm not paid to do it, so I guess I should just ignore it..." It's ignorant ideologies like this that allows military dictators to keep their people under control; assuming that they wont act for what's morally right. It's people that just "keep their head down" that allow [URL=http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/predators/kitty_genovese/1.html]things like this[/URL] to happen. Kitty Genovese was fatally stabbed while almost 30 people watched without doing anything. You sir need to get your priorities straight.[/QUOTE]
Okay next time someone is getting brutally stabbed to death jump into the fray to meet your moral obligations!
We all know what we're supposed to do, we're not five, stop drilling us on it. Were the same guards not on their shifts, they could have easily stepped in. They didn't because the ramifications would have been worse. The girl still would have been a victim of assault (Albeit for less time), both would be out of work, and the entire company that hires them would be placed under scrutiny, possibly pressuring lay-offs of many other workers.
So please, stop the preaching and get off your soap box.
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