[quote][t]http://thehill.com/sites/default/files/styles/thumb_small_article/public/blogs/danrather.jpg?itok=jhK2TBmZ[/t]
Dan Rather warned Americans about the Trump administration in a Facebook post on Sunday, saying these are not "normal times."
The former CBS Evening news anchor targeted President Trump, adviser Kellyanne Conway and press secretary Sean Spicer for comments in the last 24 hours.
“When you have a spokesperson for the president of the United States wrap up a lie in the Orwellian phrase 'alternative facts'...,” Rather wrote.
"When you have a press secretary in his first appearance before the White House reporters threaten, bully, lie, and then walk out of the briefing room without the cajones to answer a single questions...," he added.
"When you have a President stand before the stars of the fallen CIA agents and boast about the size of his crowds (lies) and how great his authoritarian inaugural speech was...”
“These are not normal times.”[/quote]
[url]http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/315555-dan-rather-on-trump-these-are-not-normal-times[/url]
His full post on FB:
[quote]These are not normal times. These are extraordinary times. And extraordinary times call for extraordinary measures.
When you have a spokesperson for the president of the United States wrap up a lie in the Orwellian phrase "alternative facts”…
When you have a press secretary in his first appearance before the White House reporters threaten, bully, lie, and then walk out of the briefing room without the cajones to answer a single question…
When you have a President stand before the stars of the fallen CIA agents and boast about the size of his crowds (lies) and how great his authoritarian inaugural speech was….
These are not normal times.
The press has never seen anything like this before. The public has never seen anything like this before. And the political leaders of both parties have never seen anything like this before.
What can we do? We can all step up and say simply and without equivocation. "A lie, is a lie, is a lie!" And if someone won't say it, those of us who know that there is such a thing as the truth must do whatever is in our power to diminish the liar's malignant reach into our society.
There is one group of people who can do a lot - very quickly. And that is Republicans in Congress. Without their support, Donald Trump's presidency will falter. So here is what I think everyone in the press must do. If you are interviewing a Paul Ryan, a Mitch McConnell, or any other GOP elected official, the first question must be "what will you do to combat the lying from the White House?" If they dodge and weave, keep with the follow ups. And if they refuse to give a satisfactory answer, end the interview.
Facts and the truth are not partisan. They are the bedrock of our democracy. And you are either with them, with us, with our Constitution, our history, and the future of our nation, or you are against it. Everyone must answer that question.[/quote]
[url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10158087282405716&id=24085780715&__tn__=%2As[/url]
I guess the saying "may you live in interesting times" really is a curse.
At least we can tell the next generation about something interesting.
"extraordinary measures."
both of our major parties need to get their shit together because clearly what they're doing now isn't working and won't work to combat any bad decision trump makes. choices need to be made to balance power not based on what benefits each individual most ($$$, status, kissing ass) but on what benefits the country and the future of our nation. dems need to stop being used to being comfy and repubs need to stop being so radical (tea party), or... whatever their plan was (failure of a primary election).
journalists need to start giving us the truth and not the skewed truth or the tabloid truth. they need to get back on the side of THE AMERICAN again so that we can regain their trust. because right now, they're the boy that cried wolf, and they're getting torn to shit with nobody to give a damn.
if thats extraordinary then we're fucked up.
I can only hope the media is able to keep up the fight against trump's oncoming attacks on the truth and his authoritarianism
[QUOTE=Judas;51712640]I can only hope the media is able to keep up the fight against trump's oncoming attacks on the truth and his authoritarianism[/QUOTE]
Trump doesn't have enough public support to turn the population entirely against the media and I would hope that there are enough dems in the senate to filibusterer the shit out of anything overtly anti-media, assuming the republicans even support anything too bad.
[QUOTE=TheJoey;51712635]"extraordinary measures."
both of our major parties need to get their shit together because clearly what they're doing now isn't working and won't work to combat any bad decision trump makes. choices need to be made to balance power not based on what benefits each individual most ($$$, status, kissing ass) but on what benefits the country and the future of our nation. dems need to stop being used to being comfy and repubs need to stop being so radical (tea party), or... whatever their plan was (failure of a primary election).
journalists need to start giving us the truth and not the skewed truth or the tabloid truth. they need to get back on the side of THE AMERICAN again so that we can regain their trust. because right now, they're the boy that cried wolf, and they're getting torn to shit with nobody to give a damn.
if thats extraordinary then we're fucked up.[/QUOTE]
What can Republicans/Democrats/Tea Party Republicans/the press do about Trump's press secretary telling blatant lies? Like I get the fact that you are upset with everything but I feel like you targeted everyone that isn't the person at fault here.
[QUOTE=TheJoey;51712635]"extraordinary measures."
both of our major parties need to get their shit together because clearly what they're doing now isn't working and won't work to combat any bad decision trump makes. choices need to be made to balance power not based on what benefits each individual most ($$$, status, kissing ass) but on what benefits the country and the future of our nation. dems need to stop being used to being comfy and repubs need to stop being so radical (tea party), or... whatever their plan was (failure of a primary election).
journalists need to start giving us the truth and not the skewed truth or the tabloid truth. they need to get back on the side of THE AMERICAN again so that we can regain their trust. because right now, they're the boy that cried wolf, and they're getting torn to shit with nobody to give a damn.
if thats extraordinary then we're fucked up.[/QUOTE]
Keep dreaming.
As long as the news is controlled by corporate interests that is all you're gonna see. Is their interest.
Instead of hoping they get their shit together how about just regular citizens get their shit together and start promoting change. Instead of this us vs them bullshit.
I'm so apathetic to this country. Seen too much hate. Too much ignorance. It's hard to stop the Titanic from sinking when it feels like every passenger on board is poking holes in the ship and the captain thinks ramming an iceberg is the best way to get past it.
[QUOTE=Anderan;51712659]Trump doesn't have enough public support to turn the population entirely against the media and I would hope that there are enough dems in the senate to filibusterer the shit out of anything overtly anti-media, assuming the republicans even support anything too bad.[/QUOTE]
im worried about trump waging a war of attrition on the media and the truth as a whole, just spewing so many lies and propaganda over and over that media doesn't have the time or energy to call it out constantly, and that the lies become normal to the american people
[QUOTE=New Cidem;51712725]I'm so apathetic to this country. Seen too much hate. Too much ignorance. It's hard to stop the Titanic from sinking when it feels like every passenger on board is poking holes in the ship and the captain thinks ramming an iceberg is the best way to get past it.[/QUOTE]
What annoys me is that now, after the election and after the inauguration, we are hearing and seeing all this anti-Trump passion. Where were all these people before the election and on election day? Now it's too late to start getting upset.
[QUOTE=Judas;51712731]im worried about trump waging a war of attrition on the media and the truth as a whole, just spewing so many lies and propaganda over and over that media doesn't have the time or energy to call it out constantly, and that the lies become normal to the american people[/QUOTE]
People have already grown complacent to being lied to. Facebook pages for so long have perpetuated bullshit lies and garbage "news", shit even look at Gamergate. Spewing lies has become the norm way earlier than the Donald Trump presidency.
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;51712827]What annoys me is that now, after the election and after the inauguration, we are hearing and seeing all this anti-Trump passion. Where were all these people before the election and on election day? Now it's too late to start getting upset.[/QUOTE]
Just tells me this country is going nowhere fast.
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;51712827]What annoys me is that now, after the election and after the inauguration, we are hearing and seeing all this anti-Trump passion. Where were all these people before the election and on election day? Now it's too late to start getting upset.[/QUOTE]
I don't really think people felt the need before the election and on election day, a lot of people were convinced he had no real chance of winning.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;51712662]What can Republicans/Democrats/Tea Party Republicans/the press do about Trump's press secretary telling blatant lies? Like I get the fact that you are upset with everything but I feel like you targeted everyone that isn't the person at fault here.[/QUOTE]
Call them out on it and correct the lie. With the actual truth, not with "alternative facts" or tabloid bullshit.
But then again we live in an country of growing scientific and journalistic doubt where tabloids and alternative news sources are more credible to many people than experts and professionals. You'd think Dems and Repubs could at least agree on basic fucking facts.
[editline]23rd January 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Anderan;51712913]I don't really think people felt the need before the election and on election day, a lot of people were convinced he had no real chance of winning.[/QUOTE]
Not to mention his flipflopping and cabinet picks turned out to be even worse than anyone expected. All the hope that he'd at least surround himself with experienced experts has vanished in favor of the establishment he ran his campaign on tearing down.
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;51712827]What annoys me is that now, after the election and after the inauguration, we are hearing and seeing all this anti-Trump passion. Where were all these people before the election and on election day? Now it's too late to start getting upset.[/QUOTE]
back when everyone thought hillary had a 90% chance of winning because thats what the media said over and over
You're right, these aren't normal times. A NYC businessman is running our country
[QUOTE=Judas;51715572]back when everyone thought hillary had a 90% chance of winning because thats what the media said over and over[/QUOTE]
The media thought Hillary because the polls thought hillary would win. The polls were operating on the basis that everyone would vote how they would 4 years ago, which obviously didn't end up happening.
[QUOTE=TheJoey;51712635]"extraordinary measures."
both of our major parties need to get their shit together because clearly what they're doing now isn't working and won't work to combat any bad decision trump makes. choices need to be made to balance power not based on what benefits each individual most ($$$, status, kissing ass) but on what benefits the country and the future of our nation. dems need to stop being used to being comfy and repubs need to stop being so radical (tea party), or... whatever their plan was (failure of a primary election).
journalists need to start giving us the truth and not the skewed truth or the tabloid truth. they need to get back on the side of THE AMERICAN again so that we can regain their trust. because right now, they're the boy that cried wolf, and they're getting torn to shit with nobody to give a damn.
if thats extraordinary then we're fucked up.[/QUOTE]
What does this have to do with the president's press secretary lying and one of trump's people calling it a alternative fact?
These are dark times there is no denying. Our world has perhaps faced no greater threat than it does today.
[QUOTE=Lambeth;51715726]What does this have to do with the president's press secretary lying and one of trump's people calling it a alternative fact?[/QUOTE]
if it's troublesome then it's all about combating this type of behavior. however the way everything turned up and the way everyone is behaving, this is going to be very difficult unless things change.
my point is, if nobody likes trump and we've got four years of blatant lying ahead of us, repubs need to be smart about the power they hold for the next four years and not allow trump to damage the country's future with the way he behaves. journalists need to report on the lying in a way that isn't stretching the actual god damn truth. then after four years, the dems need to get us to trust them enough so that we have a reason to vote him out. in the mean time we should also be writing our senators. among other things. basically, we all need to be doing the democratic thing-- correctly, this time.
those are our "measures" that we should all be taking.
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;51712827]What annoys me is that now, after the election and after the inauguration, we are hearing and seeing all this anti-Trump passion. Where were all these people before the election and on election day? Now it's too late to start getting upset.[/QUOTE]
They were always around, poking holes in obvious flaws with Trump and his lack of any actual plan. If you chose to ignore them that's on you. They were there pointing out his empty rhetoric, they were there pointing out his abhorrent behaviour. People have always been fighting against the Annoying Orange In Chief.
Nobody felt the need to protest at the time because at the time he wasn't exactly assured the win, and only won on the technicality that is the electoral college in the end. You don't tend to protest things that you don't deem an immediate threat. It's partly complacency, partly having some faith that people aren't fucking idiots (people happen to be fucking idiots is a pretty solid assumption from now on it seems).
When a large talking point for the media during the election was a cartoon frog they had deemed to be a white nationalist symbol, or when 4chan singlehandedly memed a man into the oval office, I'd say we are indeed living in extraordinary times.
[QUOTE=TheJoey;51716111]if it's troublesome then it's all about combating this type of behavior. however the way everything turned up and the way everyone is behaving, this is going to be very difficult unless things change.
my point is, if nobody likes trump and we've got four years of blatant lying ahead of us, repubs need to be smart about the power they hold for the next four years and not allow trump to damage the country's future with the way he behaves. journalists need to report on the lying in a way that isn't stretching the actual god damn truth. then after four years, the dems need to get us to trust them enough so that we have a reason to vote him out. in the mean time we should also be writing our senators. among other things. basically, we all need to be doing the democratic thing-- correctly, this time.
those are our "measures" that we should all be taking.[/QUOTE]
And if those measures don't work, what then? You can only stage so many protests, deliver so many speeches, make so many angry phone calls, write so many letters to your Congressmen, etc. before becomes clear that this tactic isn't accomplishing anything. Wait too long and the damage is done. It might not be possible to come back from it. There's no reason to let things get that far out of hand and be too far gone when it can be stopped.
We must consider the alternatives besides just "have faith in the system and try to work with it". The system is not working, it's not listening to us or representing us, and it's not looking out for what's in our best interests. Instead, it's openly and unashamedly lying to us, it's restricting our freedoms and denying us access to things we need and want (healthcare, abortion rights, LGBT rights, etc.), it's doing its best to ignore us and marginalize us...
Like Rather said, we must do [i]whatever[/i] is in our power to fight back against this shit. It's unprecedented and warrants the concern of every American.
[QUOTE=Anderan;51712913]I don't really think people felt the need before the election and on election day, a lot of people were convinced he had no real chance of winning.[/QUOTE]
Frankly that's one of the worst things. Nothing should be reported as assured to occur until it occurs. Sure, report the polling, report on most everything. However, do not ensure that something will certainly occur and especially in the case of politics.
That's one of many things the major media outlets should learn after this farce of a man was able to get in.
[QUOTE=New Cidem;51712725]I'm so apathetic to this country. Seen too much hate. Too much ignorance. It's hard to stop the Titanic from sinking when it feels like every passenger on board is poking holes in the ship and the captain thinks ramming an iceberg is the best way to get past it.[/QUOTE]
You just got black pilled.
I believe in accelerationism and some told I'm a horrible person for it. Im not. You just described why I'm of this view. The ship is sinking. Its better to make the vessel go down faster. Shock therapy and all.
As time goes on more will come to this view or so I believe.
[QUOTE=1239the;51712620]I guess the saying "may you live in interesting times" really is a curse.
At least we can tell the next generation about something interesting.[/QUOTE]
or punch those boomers that still say this wasn't as bad as the 60s, at least back then the worst the cia could do to you was put LSD in your water, today they can read your everything, see you at all times, and if signed off, blow you up at any time
its worse than the 60s, they just don't get that they are the man that they rallied against back then
[QUOTE=Guriosity;51717605]You just got black pilled.
I believe in accelerationism and some told I'm a horrible person for it. Im not. You just described why I'm of this view. The ship is sinking. Its better to make the vessel go down faster. Shock therapy and all.
As time goes on more will come to this view or so I believe.[/QUOTE]
acceleration towards what?
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;51712827]What annoys me is that now, after the election and after the inauguration, we are hearing and seeing all this anti-Trump passion. Where were all these people before the election and on election day? Now it's too late to start getting upset.[/QUOTE]
Nobody thought he would actually win.
[QUOTE=Judas;51717740]acceleration towards what?[/QUOTE]
Accelerationism is the idea that America cannot be saved and is in irreversible decline. A collapse like Roman empire, soviet union or venuzeula. The only thing is draw out the process over long period of time or try to make the process faster so a new system can be built from the ashes. What system, I don't care. What we got is broken.
Think burning down a house to collect insurance money to buy a new one vs trying to fix it up.
[editline]24th January 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=The golden;51717733]And it never will. At least not any time soon.
Once Trump is done (or impeached) and the next federal election is called - everything will probably swing Blue again and it will be a huge effort to repair all the damage from Trump. Then people will get bored or pissy with the government and come the next election it will swing Red again and the new government will instantly work to demolish the country and undoing everything that was done. Rinse and repeat.
This is what happens when your country is so fucking divided that neither side wants anything to do with eachother and, in many cases, outright fucking hate each other to the point of violence. And then they have to pick a leader to sit in a single seat while half the entire country hates everything.
I will admit that my understanding of US history isn't great...but the United States is absolutely not united at all. I'm actually surprised things have gone this long without another attempt at a civil war.
And the gap between the sides grows bigger and bigger with each election.[/QUOTE]
I have some solution s but I'm not in a position to deploy them or further develop them.
One idea is the mutualistic approach. The other is begin educationg the public at large about ideas out the current left right dichotomy.
[QUOTE=Guriosity;51717783]Accelerationism is the idea that America cannot be saved and is in irreversible decline. A collapse like Roman empire, soviet union or venuzeula. The only thing is draw out the process over long period of time or try to make the process faster so a new system can be built from the ashes. What system, I don't care. What we got is broken.
Think burning down a house to collect insurance money to buy a new one vs trying to fix it up.[/QUOTE]
The major disagreement I have with accelerationism is that there tends to be this idea that burning everything down is basically hitting a reset button - it sure as hell isn't, and whatever "replaces" what we have right now is more than likely going to be way, way worse.
Democracies that collapse tend to jump pretty quickly to totalitarianism.
[QUOTE=1239the;51718139]The major disagreement I have with accelerationism is that there tends to be this idea that burning everything down is basically hitting a reset button - it sure as hell isn't, and whatever "replaces" what we have right now is more than likely going to be way, way worse.
Democracies that collapse tend to jump pretty quickly to totalitarianism.[/QUOTE]
We are already on our to totalitarianism. Making things collapse quicker would make thing less awful. Think post Roman empire. Instead of one big system oppressing people on a large scale, it would make it smaller of various degrees through various locales.
Wars would be smaller intensity between small regions instead of world wide scale and bigger intensity.
Concerning resources, if todays society collapsed today, there would be some resources left for a recovery to some what our current technological level where if delayed would mean no chance of recovery.
When a recovery happens, it will generate new ideas where now people are autopilot using ideas that don't fit for todays circumstances. Leaves the field wide open to trying new ways.
In either case, it the future I'm afraid and its better to go with it them against it.
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