[quote] cahoots [/quote]
Because they are.
Think of what you payed for Witcher 3, what you payed for the DLC for Witcher 3, and what any other AAA company has been charging you for the last four years.
Or Divinity OS 2.
Think objectively about the content you received, not whether it was great or not or you liked it, but how much and of what build quality it was.
i know people "meme" about a 2nd videogame crash but honestly? they're heading that way even if its a minor crash
[QUOTE=krakadict;52762291]i know people "meme" about a 2nd videogame crash but honestly? they're heading that way even if its a minor crash[/QUOTE]
It won't be a crash, but it'll definitely be a swing in a different direction.
other things
harump
At this rate i'm going to end up dropping gaming as my hobby, and that's a fucking absurd notion to anyone who even remotely knows me.
I wont buy games that do this shit anymore unless i'm buying a [b]heavily[/b] discounted complete edition in a steam sale several years later.
The problem is, they all seem to be fucking doing it. So I'm not actually buying any new games, just playing my old ones, and there's only so many times you can replay the same old library of titles before you get bored stiff.
I'm just glad that I still have steam sales and indie titles.
Oh. God. The no royalties part made me suddenly feel incredibly ill. I feel filthy just thinking about the fact I'm playing on the top of near slave labor.
That's a pretty good point at the end about games like Minecraft and PUBG. I've gravitated away from AAA games and more toward indie stuff over the past couple generations, because indie developers will usually just give you a complete game with little to no bullshit attached.
Big budget games these days tend to just irritate me more often than not with things like DLC, sponsored content, DRM, pre-order bonuses (retailer specific, even), exclusive content, paid mods, and all kinds of other anti-consumer bullshit.
Smaller developers are making things out of a love of the craft, and the bigger ones are just doing it because it's their job. Any passionate developers working in a huge studio tend to get drowned out by their huge publishers pulling all kinds of strings.
[QUOTE=thejjokerr;52762444]I stopped gaming when everyone started complaining but kept buying games of the publishers doing this shit. It doesn't end until you don't buy an overpriced product and do exactly what the publishers are expecting you to do which is why they're doing it.
IMHO The only ones in the wrong here are the gamers buying these games, sometimes also indulging in the micro transactions and then complaining about it. The publishers are doing what they should do in a capitalistic world: see what people want that can make more money for them so they can grow.
I don't say I relate to the methods they use to make more money, but I'm just not buying their games so I'm not the one fueling their belief the method is working.[/QUOTE]
I just stopped buying shite games that try to take me for a sucker.
Y'know what I spent on Hollow Knight? I bought it on sale for like 7-8 bucks on sale. I have [I]34 hours in the game[/I] and it's been one of the most charming gaming experiences I've had recently.
AAA Schlock might get shit, but we're lucky to be in a market that practically overloaded with potential titles to try and play. All it takes is doing your research and being patient, which it seems like a lot of people have trouble with. I don't think I've bought a game I've been legitimately disappointed in in years.
This is why I've stopped buying games on launch. I'm not going to pay $100+ to get a full game.
I don't have an issue with expansions either, it's just that these are always developed within a year of the game's launch. I buy expansions from smaller devs because they usually price their games lower and even if they don't they actually make complete games that are further expanded upon.(instead of expanding to make a full game)
See: Red Orchestra 2, ARMA 3, Killing Floor, Insurgency, Wargame, etc.
The newest AAA game that I've bought was 2015's Fallout 4, and before that, 2014's Shadow of Mordor.
I've been mostly keeping myself entertained with indie games these days, which I generally find to have far more replay value than their AAA kin. Games like Heat Signature, Darkest Dungeon, Dungeons of Dredmor, and FTL: Faster Than Light.
That isn't to say I don't get much playtime out of the AAA games, though. I've 252 hours in Fallout 4, and I still haven't finished the story (I explore and faff about a [b]lot[/b] :v:).
It just so happens that these indie games are often able to entertain me just as much, with 133 hours in Darkest Dungeon, and a whopping 269 hours in FTL.
[editline]Fish[/editline]
[QUOTE=Destroyox;52762935]This is why I've stopped buying games on launch. I'm not going to pay $100+ to get a full game.[/QUOTE]
Oh, that's a good point, too.
I have a personal code where I don't spend more than $25 for a game usually. I'm a sale hound. :v:
[QUOTE=thejjokerr;52762444]I stopped gaming when everyone started complaining but kept buying games of the publishers doing this shit. It doesn't end until you don't buy an overpriced product and do exactly what the publishers are expecting you to do which is why they're doing it.
IMHO The only ones in the wrong here are the gamers buying these games, sometimes also indulging in the micro transactions and then complaining about it. The publishers are doing what they should do in a capitalistic world: see what people want that can make more money for them so they can grow.
I don't say I relate to the methods they use to make more money, but I'm just not buying their games so I'm not the one fueling their belief the method is working.[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't say that I've stopped playing games or gaming personally, I've just basically taken a step back and stopped buying AAA games as they're filled with this cancerous BS. Thankfully, this has an added benefit of keeping my wallet thicker.
I know it seems a little bit to late. But I found that Injustice 2 was the breaking point for me. The way they advertised it made it seem like the $60 edition was just a demo compared to buying the $120 version. And on top of that it also had lootboxes that could make the game P2W.
Makes it worse because I really enjoyed the first one.
[QUOTE=fulgrim;52762832]At this rate i'm going to end up dropping gaming as my hobby, and that's a fucking absurd notion to anyone who even remotely knows me.
I wont buy games that do this shit anymore unless i'm buying a [b]heavily[/b] discounted complete edition in a steam sale several years later.
The problem is, they all seem to be fucking doing it. So I'm not actually buying any new games, just playing my old ones, and there's only so many times you can replay the same old library of titles before you get bored stiff.[/QUOTE]
Quoting myself from a related thread.
[QUOTE]Take an interest in games for reasons other than marketing. Most of the time, AAA games aren't actually better than indies, they're just marketed way more. So go find games that you enjoy that aren't made by companies looking to fuck you over and then play those.
Honestly there are so many fantastic games i want to play these days that i don't have time for most of them, and none of them have this micro-transaction shit, if i see a game has it my brain just turns off the interest in it. I dont understand you if you're having to "fight to resist" buying shitty AAA games that want to exploit you when there's so much good stuff out there. [/QUOTE]
There are a ridiculous number of good, fun games out there that you should have no shortage if you toss AAA games completely, learn to find your games somewhere other than marketing.
[QUOTE=fulgrim;52762832]At this rate i'm going to end up dropping gaming as my hobby, and that's a fucking absurd notion to anyone who even remotely knows me.
I wont buy games that do this shit anymore unless i'm buying a [b]heavily[/b] discounted complete edition in a steam sale several years later.
The problem is, they all seem to be fucking doing it. So I'm not actually buying any new games, just playing my old ones, and there's only so many times you can replay the same old library of titles before you get bored stiff.[/QUOTE]
i'm glad i have a backlog a country mile long of games I haven't played from all the shit i've picked up through steam sales. i've been playing through GTA SA recently and realizing how much better of a game it is than GTA 5 is.
[QUOTE=fulgrim;52762832]So I'm not actually buying any new games, just playing my old ones, and there's only so many times you can replay the same old library of titles before you get bored stiff.[/QUOTE]
This has been me for over a year at this point. I remember every title I was excited for over the last few years came out and had a stunningly bad release, was short on content, was deliberately given microtransactions, or simply wasn't interesting. I love games and gaming but I feel like every new game is just a copy of something older and better now, on top of greed filtering into every aspect of game publishing and marketing. My favorite game to play currently is BF2, a game that came out over 12 years ago yet is more competent and full than most modern titles, including the new version made by DICE
[editline] 9 October 2017 [/editline]
not to mention, a lot of games coming out with MP focused gameplay / MP only and then ending up dead as a doornail a little over a year later
[QUOTE=nagachief;52762853]Oh. God. The no royalties part made me suddenly feel incredibly ill. I feel filthy just thinking about the fact I'm playing on the top of near slave labor.[/QUOTE]
fucking gearbox software is the only AAA studio i can find that distributes royalties among every single person that worked on a game
AAA is dying for me. Is there a term for game devs somewhere between full AAA and indie? MachineGames is a good example, I think, they're decently sized and professional but definitely not AAA.
[QUOTE=AtomicSans;52763168]AAA is dying for me. Is there a term for game devs somewhere between full AAA and indie? MachineGames is a good example, I think, they're decently sized and professional but definitely not AAA.[/QUOTE]
[quote][video=youtube;l0FI3iUt9H4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0FI3iUt9H4[/video][/quote]
relevant
I'm trying to stick to Grand Strategy and non big-title games, but the problem is with those, is that Paradox Interactive (Hearts of Iron, Crusader Kings, Europa Universalis and now Stellaris) have absolutely cornered the market. Your choices are to stick with them, go to Matrix Games (i.e i hope you like spreadsheets) or go down to 4X games like Civ.
For those not in the know, here's one of the big controversies that happened about a year ago:
Stellaris, a space 4X/GS hybrid has "portraits". These portraits represent species, blah blah, tend to be unique and add flavor. A while back, they released "Plantoids", which was a new set of portraits that had, you guessed it, plants.
The thing is, it came with a handful of portraits, some city sprites and some ship models. Neat, right? Not until you saw the $8 price tag for something that they [I]explicitly[/I] said that modders could do with PS+Maya for free. How did they respond to the criticisms?
[t]https://i.imgur.com/M7ehnDT.png[/t]
Notice that this guy is the head of creative direction, and essentially the head of development.
Besides that, Paradox is notorious for having lots and [I]lots[/I] of DLC. Worst example is Crusader Kings.
[t]https://i.imgur.com/ds4qiDM.png[/t]
$40USD for something that was released in 2012. It has remained at this price since release.
[t]https://i.imgur.com/jM3PQ9k.png[/t]
These are the DLCs. Many of them contain extremely important features for gameplay. Want to play as a Muslim? $10. Want to play as a Jew? $10. Want to play as a Pagan? $15. Want to play as a Hindu? $15. And that's just religious stuff, not to mention getting to use government types, diplomacy, interaction, character development, etc.
Before you go "But what about those content packs? They don't seem necessary". They are if you want to be immersed, but I'm not going into that.
tl;dr: AAA is not the only one at fault. The idea of getting everything on release is a lie and it's a disease plaguing all companies right now.
I've had much more fun playing games like Red Orchestra 2, Men of War Assault Squad 2 and Dying Light than I've had with any AAA games lately not just because years-old Call of Duty games are still sold full price on Steam but also because of bullshit like Shadow of War, where I can't go back to play it years after all the hoopla dies down because I'm expecting to have my gameplay experience deliberately gimped so WB Games can sell me some digital junk that should've been included in the asking price.
The worst part about this whole thing is that the AAA industry managed to create pop culture around themselves with all the marketing money they throw around. Getting the latest and greatest games isn't just a hardcore gamer thing anymore but something the general public indulges in more and more. While as a gamer that's good from a social standpoint, because you're no longer as stigmatized, from an industry standpoint, it gave the industry the market to turn failure into a practical impossibility. Instead of letting the merits of the product speak for themselves through, say, a demo, you drum up hype and momentum through marketing, that the game rides right into the sales charts. Preorders and lootboxes follow this to a tee because you pay before you get what you want. Unlike material goods in a store, you can't examine the contents of a preorder or lootbox for quality until you have it and paid for it. You might get the Infinity Stones, that're just some christmas lamps in plastic eggs grafted into a box, you might get a bunch of duplicates of shit graffitis you don't even want, you might get an overhyped game that's not worth playing beyond a couple hours. It doesn't matter what YOU want, what matters is that the publisher made some of their investment back.
You may be aware of all this, you've been playing the game long enough to avoid playing into their hands. But what about the other hundreds of millions of people who buy video games? The problem is that they usually spend their online presence on YouTube and social media, where they probably see ads for AAA games, they're exposed to [i]~gamerfood~[/i] tie-in promos and ads on TV. What sounds plausible is to basically drown your gaming friends in non-AAA games and to teach them how much entertainment they can get for how much less money and hope they do the same to their friends. But it's always easier said than done. If only indie games had a much bigger foothold in the console market.
wait wait wait how long has Jim's hat had a corset
[QUOTE=Luni;52763399]wait wait wait how long has Jim's hat had a corset[/QUOTE]
since the new intro p much
[QUOTE=meppers;52763166]fucking gearbox software is the only AAA studio i can find that distributes royalties among every single person that worked on a game[/QUOTE]
Because they're one of the very few that do.
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;52763366]
tl;dr: AAA is not the only one at fault. The idea of getting everything on release is a lie and it's a disease plaguing all companies right now.[/QUOTE]
I think the problem with Paradox is that they pretty much have a molopoly on the shit they do. If they didn't and had to compete with rivals we'll see them be more consumer friendly again.
"Indie AAAs" like Machinegames are smaller guys competing with the titans of gaming, they have absolutely no room to fuck over their customers since they can't brush off hits as easily as EA or the others.
So AAA is mainly at fault, but if the smaller guys maintain a iron grip on their cliched corner they can get away with being greedy dicks too.
Just buy and play games on a 4 year delay, then you can save money on hardware costs and game costs! Also you won't buy a piece of shit game that had more talk than walk.
It's because of all this bullshit that I don't think I've ever bought a game on release, unless I [I]really[/I] wanted it (see: games like Smash Bros or Pokemon). It's unfortunately because of this that I never seem to be able to catch the multiplayer waves, because most people who buy the games buy them on release, unfortunately, and by the time I get to it, the multiplayer is dead. I only buy single player games, and a long time after release.
It's because of this price gouging that I didn't play GTA V until only this summer. One of the biggest releases in the past decade, and I played it 4 years later.
[QUOTE=reedbo;52763743]Just buy and play games on a 4 year delay, then you can save money on hardware costs and game costs! Also you won't buy a piece of shit game that had more talk than walk.[/QUOTE]
I do this basically since I don't have a lot of money and think 60,- is just too expensive, but it's so easy to accidently read spoilers about a game which affects the experience.
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;52763366]I'm trying to stick to Grand Strategy and non big-title games, but the problem is with those, is that Paradox Interactive (Hearts of Iron, Crusader Kings, Europa Universalis and now Stellaris) have absolutely cornered the market. Your choices are to stick with them, go to Matrix Games (i.e i hope you like spreadsheets) or go down to 4X games like Civ.[/QUOTE]
Supreme Ruler Ultimate is also a good alternative to paradox grand strategy. I just picked that one up after enjoying Supreme Ruler 2020. It only has one priced DLC available, which isn't necessary to play the base game at all.
You're absolutely right though, grand strategy is one area of the games market without a lot of choices available. As saturated as the market is in other genres, you'd think that more companies would be trying to fill this gap.
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