Netherlands starts seperate housing for LGBT-refugees because of threats - Polidicks

[quote][b]"We could not guarantee the sense of security"[/b] Amsterdam homosexual refugees will be housed separately after threats and incidents in the shelters. This is very much against the wishes of the Secretary of State. The incidents in the refugeeshelters are numerous, with reports of: spitting, threats, shouting that they are a disgrace to their people. The gay and transgender people among the refugees have suffered in the shelters, also in Amsterdam. "They often do not dare to leave their room.'says Philip Tijsma of gay interest group COC. Amsterdam offers LGBT's, who have come from Syria in the recent months, separate shelter since september 2015. In October unrest among the refugees LGBT's (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender) broke out in an emergencyshelter at the Haaksberweg after incidents. "We could not guarantee the sense of security," said Harry Doef, Director Care Salvation Army Amsterdam Friday in Het Parool. [b]Unrest[/b] In November there was also unrest among LGBT refugees in the second emergency shelter, location Flierbosdreef. Two people were then housed externally. Next weekend another four gay refugees will be moved to a house in Amsterdam. The municipality supports the separate shelter in homes. "LHBT'ers are particularly vulnerable, I think it's important that they can relax in a safe environment and get the care they need," says Simone Kukenheim, alderman diversity. [b]'Stigmatizing'[/b] Amsterdam sticks out their neck with this special care, according to aid agencies. No other city is doing this. The city thus goes against the wishes of Secretary Klaas Dijkhoff. He sees nothing in separate shelters for LGBT'ers. "This is stigmatizing them.," he judges. Moreover, such a separate location could also be a target again from threats. Gay-interestgroup COC is just delighted with the Amsterdam initiative. "We wish more municipalities in the Netherlands are about to do so," says Tijsma. "The problems are severe. What value does a roof over a refugees head have, if he then has to fear others under that roof."[/quote] Basically, the national government denies that there are any problems, and that there's no or very few reports of muslims discriminating or threatening homosexuals. People who genuinely fled their countries to get away from these people. When cities take it upon themselves to protect people who receive hate and/or intolerance from the muslim group, in this case LGBT'ers, they are accused of 'stigmatizing LGBT'ers" thus trying to explain why they might be treated poorly. Our policy is causing them to be treated poorly by other refugees, not the refugees themselves are to blaim. Shoe -> mouth. [url=http://www.parool.nl/parool/nl/4/AMSTERDAM/article/detail/4201611/2015/12/04/Amsterdam-vangt-homoseksuele-vluchtelingen-apart-op.dhtml]Source; Het Parool[/url]

yeah, heard about this in Sweden. Don't forget that all the places these refugees come from are a lot less tolerant than we are. I've even heard homosexual migrants in Sweden complaining about the influx of refugees because now they're surrounded by the very people they tried to escape.

[QUOTE=Antlerp;49244674]yeah, heard about this in Sweden. Don't forget that all the places these refugees come from are a lot less tolerant than we are. I've even heard homosexual migrants in Sweden complaining about the influx of refugees because now [b]they're surrounded by the very people they tried to escape.[/b][/QUOTE] Try telling that to the politicians here.

It was not long ago 30 muslim immigrants threaned to kill and rape a woman and her son - because she immigrated without a man. I have a feeling attacks like these in immigrant housing will start to become more frequent, given the huge quantities of people coming in, and especially since most aren't from Syria.

[QUOTE=The fox;49244706]It was not long ago 30 muslim immigrants threaned to kill and rape a woman and her son - because she immigrated without a man. I have a feeling attacks like these in immigrant housing will start to become more frequent, given the huge quantities of people coming in, and especially since most aren't from Syria.[/QUOTE] It always surprises me how people escape from shitty situations only to start acting shitty towards others who are in the same boat.

[QUOTE=The fox;49244706]It was not long ago 30 muslim immigrants threaned to kill and rape a woman and her son - because she immigrated without a man. I have a feeling attacks like these in immigrant housing will start to become more frequent, given the huge quantities of people coming in, and especially since most aren't from Syria.[/QUOTE] Yeah, we had last week in a refugee center the next city over, multiple refugees/immigrants in that center getting arrested since they had been sexually abusing the women in that center, to the point that the women had to keep watch over one another where-ever they went in the center. One of the women apparently even got abused on the women's toilet by one of them. Really, it doesn't sit well with me how the current government isn't taking this all seriously enough. If they can't even show respect for other refugees, how the hell does the government expect them to ever integrate in our society?

This is why people are on the fence with this problem. Its not because they're racist or because of anything that correlates into "too lazy/dontwanttheirkind/whateverstraemanreason". Its because there are obvious differences and problems that are gonna come of doing that.

imagine being a transgender muslim refugee

LGBT now are stuck with dilemma. One on hand, they have parties that support their rights, but are afraid to criticize those from a culture hostile to them. On the other hand, if a responsible and effective immigration and assimilation policy is not enacted by the left, the voters will end up having no choice but voting in far right extremist parties. Who don't care for LGBT individuals. What a problem,

The best part is the governments probably will barely intervene or punish the assailants of discrimination. To them it is like children that don't know better or something, while citizens of their own nations can't criticize their behavior because it be "racist."

What;s the bet this is caused by some cognitive dissonance in the SJW style left? On one hand they love to support minority groups/refugees and the LGBT community, on the other hand the minorities/refugees are mostly backwards religious conservatives from a very backwards nation who hate gays.

[QUOTE=Jordax;49245160]Yeah, we had last week in a refugee center the next city over, multiple refugees/immigrants in that center getting arrested since they had been sexually abusing the women in that center, to the point that the women had to keep watch over one another where-ever they went in the center. One of the women apparently even got abused on the women's toilet by one of them. Really, it doesn't sit well with me how the current government isn't taking this all seriously enough. If they can't even show respect for other refugees, how the hell does the government expect them to ever integrate in our society?[/QUOTE] Hate to say it but this kind of mentality needs to be beaten out of those that still embrace it one way or the other and if they won't learn and continue to abuse others then they need to be dropped.

Won't it seem like the government is appeasing their homophobia?

Where are all refugee loving people now?

[QUOTE=Fourier;49251473]Where are all refugee loving people now?[/QUOTE] Don't be so cynical or you'll get cancer.

Can't wait until those whole "Refugee" fad dies out. We all know these people will never go back to their country, just close the borders and stop importing them. Near me the majority of a brand-new resort got bought out by the state, purely for housing refugees. The people who bought housing there are now faced by a gigantic loss, as their property is worthless. Not to mention the area around it will depreciate socially and economically.

[QUOTE=Hyperbole;49251517]Can't wait until those whole "Refugee" fad dies out. We all know these people will never go back to their country, just close the borders and stop importing them.[/QUOTE] You seriously believe it's just a fad? Because we all know there is serious shit happening in the Middle East. Or do you mean the arbitrary liking of refugees?

[QUOTE=Satansick;49251572]You seriously believe it's just a fad? Because we all know there is serious shit happening in the Middle East. Or do you mean the arbitrary liking of refugees?[/QUOTE] The whole "Let's import economic migrants and call them refugees so we can call everyone who disagrees heartless monsters" fad.

[QUOTE=Fourier;49251473]Where are all refugee loving people now?[/QUOTE] I'll rise to it. I think we should still accept refugees. Them having backwards views doesn't make them any less human beings. [editline]5th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Hyperbole;49252082]The whole "Let's import economic migrants and call them refugees so we can call everyone who disagrees heartless monsters" fad.[/QUOTE] Ironic I see it the other way round "lets call them economic migrants instead of refugees, so we can make them seem antagonistic and greedy" Clash of the view points!

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;49253815]I'll rise to it. I think we should still accept refugees. Them having backwards views doesn't make them any less human beings.[/quote] Who the hell is claiming they are lesser human beings.....nobody is, except for you're still suggesting it. Bring some rational constructive arguments, instead of these emotional empty arguments you keep bringing. IF i were dishonest now, I could just as easily say; "OH so you hate LGBT's since you're allowing their repression by these hateful people? You are such a dirty homophobe". [quote] Ironic I see it the other way round "lets call them economic migrants instead of refugees, so we can make them seem antagonistic and greedy" Clash of the view points![/QUOTE] I'm really starting to dislike how you reason. What is the motivation we have for wanting to make them seem antagonistic and greedy? You have such a messed up pattern of logic.. seriously.

[QUOTE=Turnips5;49248747]imagine being a transgender muslim refugee[/QUOTE] That's Oscar bait

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;49253815]I'll rise to it. I think we should still accept refugees. Them having backwards views doesn't make them any less human beings. [editline]5th December 2015[/editline] Ironic I see it the other way round "lets call them economic migrants instead of refugees, so we can make them seem antagonistic and greedy" Clash of the view points![/QUOTE] im starting to take your name more literally m8

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;49253815]Ironic I see it the other way round "lets call them economic migrants instead of refugees, so we can make them seem antagonistic and greedy" Clash of the view points![/QUOTE] Viewpoints are nice and all, but how about reality? Are they refugees or immigrants? The answer to this question has real effects on policy and the entire moral aura surrounding the issue.

[QUOTE=Rumbler;49254010]Who the hell is claiming they are lesser human beings.....nobody is, except for you're still suggesting it. Bring some rational constructive arguments, instead of these emotional empty arguments you keep bringing. [/quote] They're human => have human rights If they have human rights they should be able to claim asylum or be refugees from conflict and opression. [quote] IF i were dishonest now, I could just as easily say; "OH so you hate LGBT's since you're allowing their repression by these hateful people? You are such a dirty homophobe". [/quote] Glad you didn't, that'd look really silly. [quote] I'm really starting to dislike how you reason. [/quote] Just starting? I thought you and I had a fairly good understanding of where we stand on the refugee crisis. [quote] What is the motivation we have for wanting to make them seem antagonistic and greedy? You have such a messed up pattern of logic.. seriously.[/QUOTe] Your, and others, motivation behind making them seem greedy is to do away with any moral opposition to helping them. Culturally its frowned upon to not help someone in need and fleeing war/oppression. If you can instead say "na theyre fine where they were, they just want an easy ride" you are attempting to erode people sympathy and support for them. [editline]5th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=sgman91;49254082]Viewpoints are nice and all, but how about reality? Are they refugees or immigrants? The answer to this question has real effects on policy and the entire moral aura surrounding the issue.[/QUOTE] We'll the majority are from Syria, afghanistan, iraq, eritrea and nigeria. All states with war or, in eritrea's case, massive oppression. Sounds like a valid claim to refugee status tbh.

So long as they aren't actively going through the crowd asking people if they are LGBT and then bringing them away from everyone else. Some people might want to stay anonymous and their safety might hinge on that. I'm not sure concentrating all the people that might get attacked in one building is the best idea unless they are guarding it well.

[QUOTE=sgman91;49254082]Viewpoints are nice and all, but how about reality? Are they refugees or immigrants? The answer to this question has real effects on policy and the entire moral aura surrounding the issue.[/QUOTE] Well theres 2 things to it The moral aspect: It is our duty to help We have no obligation to help them Then the economic aspect: We can't afford it We can afford it Anyone using the moral "we have no reason to help these people" is imo a nob. Anyone using the economic "we can't afford to help" I have lots of understanding for, europe and the world is a mess atm economy wise. [editline]5th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Tarver;49254042]im starting to take your name more literally m8[/QUOTE] [quote=rumblor]I'm really starting to dislike how you reason.[/quote] Lol you read the other guy saying "I'm starting" in his post and thought you'd copy him. You even starred it. It must have made a big impression. Good show!

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;49253815]I'll rise to it. I think we should still accept refugees. Them having backwards views doesn't make them any less human beings. [editline]5th December 2015[/editline] Ironic I see it the other way round "lets call them economic migrants instead of refugees, so we can make them seem antagonistic and greedy" Clash of the view points![/QUOTE] Weren't you the one who'd take in a billion criminals to save a million good people? Yeah... You... You don't know what you're talking about, seeing how you'd let anyone in even if they celebrated some holiday where people kill women for fun.

[QUOTE=kweh;49254152]Weren't you the one who'd take in a billion criminals to save a million good people? Yeah... You... You don't know what you're talking about, seeing how you'd let anyone in even if they celebrated some holiday where people kill women for fun.[/QUOTE] Nope different person. Sorry to disappoint.

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;49254157]Nope different person. Sorry to disappoint.[/QUOTE] Oh right. That was stsomething or whatever. My bad.

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;49254105]They're human => have human rights If they have human rights they should be able to claim asylum or be refugees from conflict and opression.[/QUOTE] They have human rights yes, but so do the gays, lesbians and transgenders that they're culturally/religiously repressing and even killing.... I'm not willing to demish their standard of living in the West, by importing people with views that are incredibly detrimental to their wellbeing. The homosexuals, atheists, and other by islam unaccepted minorities fleeing Syria are in my opinion genuinely refugees. Not the majority of 'moderate' muslims who bring hateful views. [quote]Glad you didn't, that'd look really silly.[/QUOTE] Silly yes, yet that is exactly what you're doing when someone is critical of immigration. You insinuate the criticism stems from racism, xenophobia, or intolerance. Not just once, but systematically. [quote]Just starting? I thought you and I had a fairly good understanding of where we stand on the refugee crisis.[/QUOTE] You don't get to pretend that I'm intolerant of your views here. I'm starting to dislike HOW you come to your conclusion, not the conclusion that you reach itself. There might be some very valid arguments to reach a conclusion different than mine, and will be open to be convinced by them. However at the moment you've not displayed anything other than infantile, emotional arguments. [quote]Your, and others, motivation behind making them seem greedy is to do away with any moral opposition to helping them. Culturally its frowned upon to not help someone in need and fleeing war/oppression. If you can instead say "na theyre fine where they were, they just want an easy ride" you are attempting to erode people sympathy and support for them.[/QUOTE] I love how you know what my motivation is. Are you sure you're not just operating on presumptions, and generalized viewpoints, just like you're accusing of us doing when we speak out against problems that (mass)immigration is bringing? You're completely missing the fact that we acknowledge there ARE genuine refugees, BUT that we say there's also a large group of people pretending to be war refugees, but who are in fact economic refugees. Everytime we present facts, newsreports or evidence that backs this up otherwise you come up with some empty emotional argument and an appeal to sympathy to just overlook this. [quote]We'll the majority are from Syria, afghanistan, iraq, eritrea and nigeria. All states with war or, in eritrea's case, massive oppression. Sounds like a valid claim to refugee status tbh.[/QUOTE] Even if it's a valid claim, that great, but I'll just say now that out of the global population probably about 80% has some real problem they're facing now. I'm pulling that number out of my ass, yes, but the majority in the world has more problems, sometimes even life-threathening, worse than in the west. Does that mean that we are obligated to take them all in? [editline]6th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=kweh;49254152]Weren't you the one who'd take in a billion criminals to save a million good people? Yeah... You... You don't know what you're talking about, seeing how you'd let anyone in even if they celebrated some holiday where people kill women for fun.[/QUOTE] No it wasn't Mdeceiver. His arguments are pretty infantile, and shallow, but he's not claimed anything that diluded yet.