Vote today in the house to defund all NSA spying against American citizens - Polidicks

[QUOTE]The Obama administration has forcefully urged the defeat of a legislative measure to curb its wide-ranging collection of Americans' phone records, setting up a showdown with the House of Representatives over domesticsurveillance. A statement from the White House press secretary, Jay Carney, late on Tuesday evening capped an extraordinary day of near-revolt on Capitol Hill concerning the secret National Security Agency surveillance programes revealed by ex-NSA contractor Edward Snowden and published by the Guardian and Washington Post. The White House urged House members to vote against a measure from Representative Justin Amash, a Michigan Republican, that would stop the NSA siphoning up the telephone records of millions of Americanswithout suspicion of a crime. "This blunt approach is not the product of an informed, open or deliberative process," said the statement emailed from the White House late on Tuesday in anticipation of a House debate on the Amash measure scheduled for Wednesday. "We urge the House to reject the Amash amendment and instead move forward with an approach that appropriately takes into account the need for a reasoned review of what tools can best secure the nation."[/QUOTE] [URL]http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/24/nsa-surveillance-amash-amendment[/URL] Funfact: Amash is my representative, and through the research I've done about him, he is one of the least dumb and arrogant Republicans. He votes no on basically everything though, that's why he is the member of congress who votes least often with his party. He is the closest one could get to be a libertarian in congress without being a member of the libertarian party. Also it was a bit difficult to find an unbiased news article on this amendment, but The Guardian pulled through.

I feel that most senators and congressmen are scared of saying anything about the NSA because it could cost them their entire political career. I do hope this goes through, and NSA becomes defunded.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;41577702]I feel that most senators and congressmen are scared of saying anything about the NSA because it cost them their entire political career.[/QUOTE] Another reason why NSA shouldn't be around.

Good riddance

I JUST got an email back from my states senator debbie stabenow, she had a pretty promising answer to all this NSA shit. [QUOTE]Dear Jake, Thank you for contacting me about federal surveillance programs. I appreciate that you have taken the time to communicate your views and concerns with me. As you may know, Congress passed legislation that gives intelligence agencies the tools necessary to keep America safe from terrorism while maintaining personal privacy and protecting civil liberties. When the Senate considered the reauthorization of these operations, I voted in support of an amendment to improve transparency by requiring the federal government to disclose more information to the public about how these surveillance programs operate. I also supported an effort to ensure stronger privacy protections for all Americans. Recent reports of widespread information collection by intelligence agencies are concerning to me. As we review future proposals, it is important to maintain the right balance in defending our country while ensuring that our law enforcement officials do not inadvertently infringe upon the very civil liberties they have sworn to protect. I will continue to monitor these surveillance programs and keep your concerns in mind as Congress considers these important issues. Thank you again for contacting me. Please continue to keep me informed about issues of concern to you and your family. Sincerely, Debbie Stabenow United States Senator [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=GlebGuy;41577719]Another reason why NSA shouldn't be around.[/QUOTE] As of the present moment, I'm not going to be surprised if the Republicans win both the house, senate, and come 2016, the Whitehouse. The current administration is really tarnishing the Democrat party name, and it's going to cost them a lot of states.

[QUOTE=breakyourfac;41577739]I JUST got an email back from my states senator debbie stabenow, she had a pretty promising answer to all this NSA shit.[/QUOTE] It sounds like she's on our side, but then again this is a politician we're talking about, and I have little faith in any politician regardless of alignment or stature, since power corrupts all regardless.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;41577766]As of the present moment, I'm not going to be surprised if the Republicans win both the house, senate, and come 2016, the Whitehouse. The current administration is really tarnishing the Democrat party name, and it's going to cost them a lot of states.[/QUOTE] I seriously doubt the Republicans winning in 2016 unless they change their platform towards people like Hispanics and LGBT or abortion.

Well as a non-American I hope that if this passes, foreign nations like EU nations also get left alone. Please.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;41577766]As of the present moment, I'm not going to be surprised if the Republicans win both the house, senate, and come 2016, the Whitehouse. The current administration is really tarnishing the Democrat party name, and it's going to cost them a lot of states.[/QUOTE] Goes to show how ignorant the voting populace is then since Republicans support the same spy programs democrats do, it's just that right now there is a Democrat in the White House. If this story broke under Bush Republicans wouldn't be doing shit except throwing Democrats under the bus for not caring enough about the security of the homeland. Also if the GOP loses Texas there won't be a Republican in the White House probably ever again.

[QUOTE=Emperorconor;41577791]I seriously doubt the Republicans winning in 2016 unless they change their platform towards people like Hispanics and LGBT or abortion.[/QUOTE] They will get some votes. You have to realize a good majority of retarded Americans will go "hmm well everything isn't totally 100% fixed so I'm voting republican this election" it happens every year. People flip-flop like a motherfucker because they don't know shit about politics.

[QUOTE=ironman17;41577788]It sounds like she's on our side, but then again this is a politician we're talking about, and I have little faith in any politician regardless of alignment or stature, since power corrupts all regardless.[/QUOTE] Not trusting people leads to them being untrustworthy.

[QUOTE=Emperorconor;41577791]I seriously doubt the Republicans winning in 2016 unless they change their platform towards people like Hispanics and LGBT or abortion.[/QUOTE] And that's really all they would have to do. They change their platform just a tiny-bit, and go full frontal they'll most likely gain more voters simply by the fact their also tending to the "3rd Party" people(ie. Libertarians/Green Party).

the fact that you even have to vote on this is ridiculous it shouldn't even be considered

[QUOTE=Raidyr;41577841]Goes to show how ignorant the voting populace is then since Republicans support the same spy programs democrats do, it's just that right now there is a Democrat in the White House. If this story broke under Bush Republicans wouldn't be doing shit except throwing Democrats under the bus for not caring enough about the security of the homeland. [B]Also if the GOP loses Texas there won't be a Republican in the White House probably ever again.[/B][/QUOTE] Gotta love the Electoral College. That would be another thing that I'd love to see Republicans actually try to support... Getting rid of the Electoral College to prevent crap like California, NY, Texas, and other "large" states getting a majority of the votes.

I feel like the spying will continue even if this vote passes.

The whole system is rigged anyway, voting won't help until the money has been taken out of politics.

[QUOTE=Emperorconor;41577791]I seriously doubt the Republicans winning in 2016 unless they change their platform towards people like Hispanics and LGBT or abortion.[/QUOTE] No, they likely will. This won't be the first election in which hispanics, gays, and pro-choicers have existed, and in this instance the infringement of their civil liberties is less publicly exposed as the infringement of everybody else's. In light of this NSA nonsense coming out of the closet, the majority of swing voters are unlikely to go Democrat again. The unfortunate reality of this is that the spying business is the result of Bush's Patriot Act, but because it wasn't exposed until this far into Obama's presidency (and, even moreso, because of how he handled the situation once it was exposed), the middle ground is going to be pretty uncomfortable with the left come the next election cycle. The United States government operates in shifts, anyway. For as long as we have only two notable parties, rule will keep swinging back and forth. After eight years of a democrat in office, it's the Republicans' turn.

[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;41578246]No, they likely will. This won't be the first election in which hispanics, gays, and pro-choicers have existed, and in this instance the infringement of their civil liberties is less publicly exposed as the infringement of everybody else's. The United States government operates in shifts, anyway. For as long as we have only two notable parties, rule will keep swinging back and forth. After eight years of a democrat in office, it's the Republicans' turn.[/QUOTE] This is also evident with Obama's tanking approval rate and, like breakyourfac said, how people resolve everything to Republican v Democrat.

[QUOTE=Protocol7;41578267]This is also evident with Obama's tanking approval rate and, like breakyourfac said, how people resolve everything to Republican v Democrat.[/QUOTE] His declining approval rating isn't much surprise, either! This NSA biz has deeply tarnished his public image.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;41577702]I feel that most senators and congressmen are scared of saying anything about the NSA because it could cost them their entire political career. [/QUOTE] That's total bullshit. Anything that is being kept hush-hush has to go to Congress to request funding since it isn't part of their normally-allocated budget and can't have a public paper trail. Congress has the power to deny the NSA the funding they want, they're the ones in control and they have to be kept informed because if they feel they aren't being kept in the loop they can just say no. If they [url=http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/305765-senators-skip-classified-briefing-on-nsa-snooping-to-catch-flights-home]weren't paying attention to the briefing[/url] it's their own fault. This is the stupidest form of political maneuvering. They knew exactly what was happening and gave it a seal of approval, and now they're turning around and trying to score political points by turning on the NSA because it's now public.

Yeah it is very important that AMERICAN citizens aren't spied on. It's good that we keep an eye on all those european terrorists tho.

[QUOTE=SEKCobra;41578432]Yeah it is very important that AMERICAN citizens aren't spied on. It's good that we keep an eye on all those european terrorists tho.[/QUOTE] It's not like we can trust the Europeans to monitor themselves for terrorist threats or anything. Nah, gotta do it ourselves!

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;41577882]Gotta love the Electoral College. That would be another thing that I'd love to see Republicans actually try to support... Getting rid of the Electoral College to prevent crap like California, NY, Texas, and other "large" states getting a majority of the votes.[/QUOTE] And yet small states still get equal representation via their seats in the Senate... it cuts both ways. Why should a large state whore all the power? Why should a small state? That's why we have both a Senate and a House. Small states wield power far above their proportion of the population in the Senate, and large states wield power far above their "1/50th" in the House. There's a reason for it. Not really sure why you're talking about the Electoral College in this case. Although, I do agree that it's a shady institution; electoral college rep's can just "choose" to disregard their constituency's votes and cast their vote however they want, which is strange. Also, our winner-take-all system is bad.

[QUOTE=Protocol7;41578441]It's not like we can trust the Europeans to monitor themselves for terrorist threats or anything. Nah, gotta do it ourselves![/QUOTE] Nah, the most important thing is to make sure they don't send any of their goddamn german bombers!

[QUOTE=SEKCobra;41578461]Nah, the most important thing is to make sure they don't send any of their goddamn german bombers![/QUOTE] and those damn red coats

[QUOTE=ForDaNords;41578034]I feel like the spying will continue even if this vote passes.[/QUOTE] They'll do a piss poor job of it if they don't have the money to actually do it. I doubt the people working in the NSA bunker are going to spy on their brothers and sisters for free.

Well I wrote my representative.

[quote]The Amash-Conyers amendment ends NSA’s blanket collection of Americans’ telephone records. It does this by requiring the FISA court under Sec. 215 to order the production of records that pertain only to a person under investigation.[/quote] from a better less politically skewed source, it does not defund anything, it just makes the NSA have to follow procedure to gather data, the FISA court is stocked with a secret pannel of judges who sign these orders without much oversight. infact they are self-regulating [editline]24th July 2013[/editline] [url]http://amash.house.gov/speech/amash-nsa-amendment-fact-sheet[/url]

[QUOTE=thirty9th;41578458]And yet small states still get equal representation via their seats in the Senate... it cuts both ways. Why should a large state whore all the power? Why should a small state? That's why we have both a Senate and a House. Small states wield power far above their proportion of the population in the Senate, and large states wield power far above their "1/50th" in the House. There's a reason for it. Not really sure why you're talking about the Electoral College in this case. Although, I do agree that it's a shady institution; electoral college rep's can just "choose" to disregard their constituency's votes and cast their vote however they want, which is strange. Also, our winner-take-all system is bad.[/QUOTE] The only way the Electoral College could be done reasonably is by making it so every county get's one vote, and the electoral college is only used when the popular vote is to close to call. Ie. 3% deviance. Also yes.. We need alternate voting and transfer over to a parliament type system which is more open to 3rd Parties.