Donator threatening Paypal donation refund after breaking the rules, is that even possible?
39 replies, posted
I run a Garry's Mod server and have a donation system set up where you can gain additional classes/perks as a donator. Today, said donator broke 4 of the rules defined in the motd and got banned for 7 days. He also should have read the area regarding donations which says:
"To gain donator access you need to donate a minimum of $5 to the server. The button to do so is located at the bottom of the motd.
PLEASE BE AWARE - The server owner (uncannytranny) and co-owner can REMOVE your donator access at ANY time. We are not bound to allow you to abuse privileges and let you get away with it. We won't disallow access unless we have a good reason (ex., breaking multiple server rules in one session)."
We didn't remove the donator access, just banned him temporarily. Could he actually get a refund? Especially if it is a donation and is specified that we can restrict your access to it. Under what conditions COULD he actually request a valid refund?
Do you have the donation account set up with some kind of non-refundable clause?
I don't believe paypal allows a nonrefundable option to donations. The donations go to my Paypal account, but when creating a donation button I didn't see any fields regarding refundable or nonrefundable including in the terms and conditions. Would I have to set up an entire new Paypal and make it nonrefundable specifically for the server purpose?
If it's refund-able, and the donator is only threatening to get a refund, then that would imply that he still wants to stay on the server.
If it's possible for him to get a refund, give him two options:
1. He can get a refund, but be permanently banned from the server
or
2. He can stick around and not get perma-banned, but not refund his donation money, and will have to stay banned for whatever bullshit he did.
Donating shouldn't give you an excuse to break the rules, and then get away with it. I know people like this who donate, break the rules on a server, and then complain that they gave money to the server and should be immune to any punishment.
Also, I would assume this goes into the Garry's Mod sub-forum, or atleast, General Gaming Discussion.
I put it here since it regards legal issues and there isn't a forum dedicated to that, the fact it was GMod was kinda a small addition. Thanks for the info though. Aren't donations non refundable by default? I thought that is what a donation was. Giving people money for a cause, in this case it's the server. He shouldn't be able to revoke money from a cause of which he once thought was okay to him which now isn't since he is banned.
I mean, it shouldn't, but people always find a way for this sort of thing. Like I said, it seems like he doesn't want to do this, since he only threatened to do so. I would give him those options if he does find a way.
Also, it sounds like this guy is scum. I wouldn't want a person like this in a community that I would be involved in.
he should be able to get a refund bro
what if you gave money to a server and then they banned?
maybe have a rule like ; 1.5 weeks before donation you get a refund no matter what happens
[editline]17th July 2013[/editline]
just unban the guy,he gave you money for your server
money for your pixel fun
he gave you money so you can buy shit vs bullshit internet drama shit
Difference is if I am willing to donate my cash to a server and I did something dumb enough to get banned I'd actually face it as it was, I was stupid and got banned. Not I got banned from a server so now I have to immediately revoke whatever cash I dedicated to that server so I can basically get free perks.
just dont take his money anymore after that
You're fine just ignore the child. I ran a GMod server with friends before too. We made sure to word everything well. You are DONATING to the server, not buying a product. Since you donated, out of the kindness of our heart we are giving you a reward. You are not entitled to this reward. You act like a kiddie you still get banned and we don't care about your $10 you lost.
I would just perma-ban the guy if he refunds it. He'll pull this shit again if he gets banned in the future.
Alright guys. But does anyone have any definitive information that I can reference him to if he or any other donator tries to do it later?
Also I just now realized donator isn't a word. Donor is what it should be. Whoops.
[QUOTE=Cjmax;41502047]Alright guys. But does anyone have any definitive information that I can reference him to if he or any other donator tries to do it later?
Also I just now realized donator isn't a word. Donor is what it should be. Whoops.[/QUOTE]
Just make sure you have a paragraph above the donation button along the lines of:
By clicking this button and donating money to this server you are not buying a product. It is considered a donation and we are giving you a reward based on your donation. You are not entitled to your reward,
etc. you get what I'm saying.
You'll be fine, it happens with everyone who host a server. It was a donation and a short ban at that
Alright guys, thanks for the advice. Real asshole I'm dealing with here, if he didn't like the server in the first place he shouldn't have donated.
Seems like a written agreement that he agreed to by donating.
edit: I don't know every country's laws concerning agreements but usually they are somewhat lax and you've got both the agreement handy and the transaction as proof of acceptance.
I read something on Paypal that you can't get a refund if you purchase something non-physical which I kinda see a donation as. And if he broke the rules and is upset about his donation you should refer to your rules as stated. He's a dork.
It depends on how he sent you the money.
If it was through an automated transaction then he will be covered by buyer protection.
If he sent it directly and chose 'Friends or Family' option whilst going through the steps then he will not be covered at all and try all me might, your argument will win.
If PayPal opens a case or your see the money get put on hold then call them directly and speak to them. I work with PayPal for a living as I run an eBay store for a company and calling them directly is always the fastest and easiest way to end any dispute.
If he's paid for a service within his own will and this service has set rules he had to acknowledge that he also broke then yes, he can't win.
Even more so that you have disclaimer explaining that.
Just take care with PayPal. The moment you see any activity on there, call them. PayPal do a pathetic job at letting people something is going on.
He's more hassle than he's worth, fire the client.
[url]http://www.missionfish.org/help/policies/us_donation-refund-policy.html[/url]
[QUOTE]A donation refund is possible if:
The seller has an unpaid item transaction on eBay (also known as a “non-paying bidder”).
OR
The seller and buyer mutually agreed to terminate the transaction[/QUOTE]
Therefore:
No, because you didn't have any physical transaction (no items of any kind were "bought" using a donation (this is usually done so ebay takes less of the dosh from the end price) and no because you didn't agree with him.
You can legally tell him to fuck off for not following terms of service stated in the motd.
[editline]18th July 2013[/editline]
Appearently I can't edit the post without losing everything so here's automerge
The above thing isn't paypal's official guideline, but paypal will not refund a donation unless legally forced to. Because, why would they care?
When people threaten to chargeback on my Minecraft server I permanently ban them. You don't need to deal with that shit...
[QUOTE=arimi;41501989]he should be able to get a refund bro
what if you gave money to a server and then they banned?
maybe have a rule like ; 1.5 weeks before donation you get a refund no matter what happens
[editline]17th July 2013[/editline]
just unban the guy,he gave you money for your server
money for your pixel fun
he gave you money so you can buy shit vs bullshit internet drama shit[/QUOTE]
A donation is a donation. Just because he gave them money doesn't mean he has immunity from the rules. If anything, I would ban people who have donated for longer periods of time, because they should know the rules if they've played long enough to give money towards the server. If they want to act like shit heads, then they will be treated like a shit head.
It's not like gold members here get a free pass here to say/do anything they want since they paid then get a refund for their ban, i don't see anything different in this case. You're fine
I own multiple servers. Long story short: no.
By playing on a third party server, there is no legal agreement or binding that would prevent you from revoking or preventing him from use of the donator rank.
If he paid for the rank, let him have it, but it shouldn't exclude him from server rules, he should have known that...
if he's a jerk, he should (and by the sound of it has) be treated the same as any random...
don't give him his money back i think.
he [B]Donated[/B] money, and got perks cos of it
he didn't BUY something. and besides, when do you go to the salvation army and say, "So, that donation i made a few days back, can i have it back please."
I've never heard of Paypal refunding a donation. As long as you're using the actual 'Donation' transaction type that Paypal has, it shouldn't be refundable.
It's fairly easy to get a refund from Paypal, depending on how he sent it.
There's 2 options:
1) The "my purchased item didn't arrive" option.
This shouldn't be a problem in your case.
2) The "Unauthorized transaction" option.
There is not much you can do to stop it if he claims this. Paypal tend to refund anyone using this option unless you can prove they're lieing - perhaps you could use any evidence of him threatening to chargeback?
So what happened, OP?
SataniX is right there's even people thwt scam like that on ebay and there is nothing you can do ss paypal most of the time believes the buyer and is on his side. Though this is a donation there is nothing that he did not receive so.
[QUOTE=kwk;41522138]So what happened, OP?[/QUOTE]
Well, I updated the MOTD to make it perfectly clear that if you donate, under no circumstances are you getting your money back. The guy who threatened the refund said hes gonna "quit the server" but one of his friends copy pasted his chat with him where he stated he couldn't wait for the ban to be over.
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