[quote]A transgendered inmate who once sued the state to pay for her [URL="http://www.wtkr.com/topic/health/surgery/sex-reassignment-surgery-HEPAS000030.topic"]sex reassignment surgery[/URL] isn’t giving up without a fight. Ophelia De’Lonta is now appealing a judge’s ruling that the state doesn’t have to pay for the surgery. The American’s for Civil Liberties Union is also in on the case.
The [URL="http://www.wtkr.com/topic/social-issues/american-civil-liberties-union-ORCIG0000034.topic"]ACLU[/URL] filed a brief this month on Ophelia’s behalf.
De’Lonta, 50, was born a male. She was born Michael Stokes and has undergone hormone therapy treatment for years while serving time behind bars. She told CBS 6, in a letter, that it’s because she won a case against the Department of Corrections in 2003 to allow it.
Rebecca Glenberg with the ACLU argued “that the Department of Corrections can’t simply flatly deny a necessary medical treatment just because it may be politically unpopular or that some people may disagree with the necessity of it.
“It’s clear Ophelia suffers from a severe form of gender identity disorder.” “This is a surgery meant to address a serious medical need” added Glenberg.
Not everyone agrees. We spoke with Delegate Todd Gilberts who knows about Ophelia’s case. He said he’s opposed to the state spending any money on the procedure.
"There’s certainly a psychological issue but as for this being a medical necessity, it’s certainly it's not something taxpayers should have to pay for,” said Gilberts.
Gilbert doesn’t believe that the issue should be framed as medical concern, and called the matter frivolous.
“I don’t believe we should set the precedent that people who are similarly situated in the prison system serving sentences for violating the laws of our Commonwealth should be afforded the opportunity to have something as frivolous as a sex change in the context of taxpayer dollars” said Gilbert.
He said if this ever rises to the level that a court mandates the state to pay for Ophelia’s sex reassignment surgery, he’ll be prepared to fight it through legislation.
“To ensure that the courts can’t order taxpayers to pay for these services for inmates who again are there because they harmed our fellow citizens,” said Gilbert.” “I would do everything I could to put a stop to it, if the court ever ordered it” he added.
The U.S. Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals will handle this matter. Stay with CBS 6 News for the latest developments in the case. [/quote]
[url]http://www.wtkr.com/news/wtvr-inmate-sues-state-to-pay-for-sexchange-20120130,0,6631881.story[/url]
She's in Prison, not a day spa. The state shouldn't have to pay for it.
She's under mental and physical duress from her condition, that is quite literally bring a woman trapped in a male's body. I see no issue with it.
Getting a sex change should be on her own money, not taxpayer money.
She's in prison, she's going to have to pay for surgery like the others around her.
[QUOTE=Noth;34470419]She's in Prison, not a day spa. The state shouldn't have to pay for it.[/QUOTE]
yes, cause you know, gender is one of those things you just change on a whim. its not like shes undergone hormone therapy and has a real medical condition or anything.
[editline]30th January 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Ninja Duck;34470493]Getting a sex change should be on her own money, not taxpayer money.
She's in prison, she's going to have to pay for surgery like the others around her.[/QUOTE]
yes. i agree. lets make all prisoners pay for all of their healthcare bills. great idea.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;34470697]yes. i agree. lets make all prisoners pay for all of their healthcare bills. great idea.[/QUOTE]
This isn't healthcare though.
It won't do any harm to stay in his/her current state.
[QUOTE=minilandstan;34470762]This isn't healthcare though.
It won't do any harm to stay in his/her current state.[/QUOTE]yes it will.
Gender Dysphoria isn't the same thing as being bummed out because you're a couple inches shorter than you'd like. it's a source of legitimate emotional and mental stress
what if a prisoner has depression and immense mental / physical duress from being obese and ugly?
should they have a right to sue the state for plastic surgery + liposuction as well?
[QUOTE=minilandstan;34470762]This isn't healthcare though.
It won't do any harm to stay in his/her current state.[/QUOTE]
The rate of suicide in transgenders is abnormally high, it's not something you just joke about.
[editline]31st January 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=lolwutdude;34470828]what if a prisoner has depression and immense mental / physical duress from being obese and ugly?
should they have a right to sue the state for plastic surgery + liposuction as well?[/QUOTE]
That is not even comparable, being transgender is not something you just change, unlike Obesity
"Hey everyone I wanna chop my dick off, but it didnt go so well so I want to make you tax payers pay for the rest of the hot dick chopping action so I can become a women then bitch endlessly about how guys are such douchebags. Please pay for me to have a pussay"
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;34470845]T
That is not even comparable, being transgender is not something you just change, unlike Obesity[/QUOTE]
who are you to say its not comparable?
that's just as ignorant as saying you change your sexuality and gender.
what if they're genetically obese or genetically ugly, should they have a right to sue the state to make them use taxpayer's money to pay for plastic surgery + liposuction, yes or no?
[QUOTE=Noth;34470419]She's in Prison, not a day spa. The state shouldn't have to pay for it.[/QUOTE]
You're marginalizing it by suggesting going through gender assignment surgery is like getting a facial scrub.
I think if she already went through hormone therapy you may as well do the surgery.
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;34470845]That is not even comparable, being transgender is not something you just change[/QUOTE]
Uh, you can
[QUOTE=lolwutdude;34470940]what if they're genetically obese or genetically ugly, should they have a right to sue the state to make them use taxpayer's money to pay for plastic surgery + liposuction, yes or no?[/QUOTE]
No
[editline]30th January 2012[/editline]
Unless their obesity signification affects their health, like if they have diabetes or something.
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;34470845]The rate of suicide in transgenders is abnormally high, it's not something you just joke about.
[editline]31st January 2012[/editline]
That is not even comparable, being transgender is not something you just change, unlike Obesity[/QUOTE]
You do realize not everyone is obese because they chose to eat nothing but chicken wings, right?
[QUOTE=Lambeth;34470978]No[/QUOTE]
then neither is she in prison, she should use her own money, and if you wanna say she can't cause she's in prison, maybe she shouldn't have committed the crime in the first place?
with this sort of logic, every transgender who lacks money should just commit and crime to get a sex change surgery in prison
[QUOTE=supercopter;34470894]"Hey everyone I wanna chop my dick off, but it didnt go so well so I want to make you tax payers pay for the rest of the hot dick chopping action so I can become a women then bitch endlessly about how guys are such douchebags. Please pay for me to have a pussay"[/QUOTE]
horrendous post. thanks for being a gigantic bigot
[QUOTE=lolwutdude;34471007]then neither is she in prison, she should use her own money, and if you wanna say she can't cause she's in prison, maybe she shouldn't have committed the crime in the first place?
with this sort of logic, every transgender who lacks money should just commit and crime to get a sex change surgery in prison[/QUOTE]
I just think they shouldn't half ass it. She already took hormone therapy, you may as well go all the way.
[QUOTE=SPESSMEHREN;34470999]You do realize not everyone is obese because they chose to eat nothing but chicken wings, right?[/QUOTE]
"It runs in my family!"
No, Noone runs in your family
Transgender isn't really a "black and white" enough issue for the state to have to pay for it. The debating in this thread just proves that imo.
Plus, I'm sure a lot of people would classify it as a cosmetic surgery and those are almost never paid for by the state/insurance companies.
That money would be better off for inmates who need medical care
[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;34471152]Transgender isn't really a "black and white" enough issue for the state to have to pay for it. The debating in this thread just proves that imo.
Plus, I'm sure a lot of people would classify it as a cosmetic surgery and those are almost never paid for by the state/insurance companies.[/QUOTE]
Excuse me but what debating? Besides maybe 1 person defending transgendered people the rest have been uninformed and bigoted. Facepunch honestly shows it's real colors in ANY threads related to transgendered issues.
Also the surgery itself is usually not considered to be cosmetic surgery but it depends on the definition, usually by insurance companies.
I have a bit of a question here. I may be way off because I'm not a transgendered person myself but: Why does physically looking like the gender you associate yourself as matter? Sure, it'd make things easier in the long run, but is it completely necessary?
Seems like "I was born a man sex wise, I am a woman gender wise" the only thing stopping you is your hang up on the fact that you don't look like a women aka purely cosmetic reasons.
I mean, if you can't be yourself without a cosmetic change how can you be yourself at all?
Then again, I could be looking at it from the wrong perspective. I view it more as a sort of plastic surgery rather than something that actually defines what you are, which it might not be.
[QUOTE=Lol-Nade;34470963]Uh, you can[/QUOTE]
No you really can't, just ask any credible mental health professional.
[QUOTE=QueenSasha24;34471275]No you really can't, just ask any credible mental health professional.[/QUOTE]
he means going through with the surgery
[QUOTE=Mr. Bleak;34471269]I have a bit of a question here. I may be way off because I'm not a transgendered person myself but: Why does physically looking like the gender you associate yourself as matter? Sure, it'd make things easier in the long run, but is it completely necessary?
Seems like "I was born a man sex wise, I am a woman gender wise" the only thing stopping you is your hang up on the fact that you don't look like a women aka purely cosmetic reasons.
I mean, if you can't be yourself without a cosmetic change how can you be yourself at all?
Then again, I could be looking at it from the wrong perspective. I view it more as a sort of plastic surgery rather than something that actually defines what you are, which it might not be.[/QUOTE]
From my experience with transgendered individuals it's mostly so that you can fit into society as female (or male) and act the way that your mental self. The whole idea of being transgendered is that your current physical appearance doesn't represent how you are on the inside.
[editline]31st January 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Turnips5;34471300]he means going through with the surgery[/QUOTE]
Fair enough, my mistake.
[QUOTE=Mr. Bleak;34471269]I have a bit of a question here. I may be way off because I'm not a transgendered person myself but: Why does physically looking like the gender you associate yourself as matter? Sure, it'd make things easier in the long run, but is it completely necessary?
Seems like "I was born a man sex wise, I am a woman gender wise" the only thing stopping you is your hang up on the fact that you don't look like a women aka purely cosmetic reasons.
I mean, if you can't be yourself without a cosmetic change how can you be yourself at all?
Then again, I could be looking at it from the wrong perspective. I view it more as a sort of plastic surgery rather than something that actually defines what you are, which it might not be.[/QUOTE]
This is always hard to put into words, but gender identity not matching presented gender/biological sex, it creates a divide between ones self image and how others interact with them, which is a bit of a wrecking ball to ones emotional well-being, especially with how gender roles work.
Pisspoor explanation, but it's really something you understand by experiencing
Here is my opinion:
if a psychiatrist diagnoses the person with gender identity disorder, then sexual reassignment surgery can easily be considered a medical procedure (NOT a cosmetic one, you idiots) and should therefore be covered by the state like any other medical procedure since inmates are in the custody of the state
if the person DOESN'T have GID but wants the surgery (would likely never happen but hey, official policies need to cover all bases) then the state shouldn't be expected to cover it
[QUOTE=Triumph Forks;34471451]This is always hard to put into words, but gender identity not matching presented gender/biological sex, it creates a divide between ones self image and how others interact with them, which is a bit of a wrecking ball to ones emotional well-being, especially with how gender roles work.
Pisspoor explanation, but it's really something you understand by experiencing[/QUOTE]
Quite a good explanation, bit basic, but good.
It sounds like a good idea but it shouldn't be the highest priority.
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