Anger at Belgian face veil ban - Polidicks

[URL]http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/2010/01/201012515127437808.html[/URL] [quote=Al Jazzera] Muslims, academics and human rights groups have hit out at a looming public ban in Belgium on the full face veil, following a decision in the country's parliament to make the wearing of the article of clothing illegal. The vote on Thursday was almost unanimous with 134 MPs in support of the law and just two abstentions. "I think they're trying to wind us up," Souad Barlabi, a young woman wearing a simple veil, said outside the Grand Mosque in Brussels, the Belgian capital, around the time of Friday prayers. "We feel under attack," she said, a day after the politicians voted for the ban on clothes or veils that do not allow the wearer to be fully identified. [B]'Dangerous precedent'[/B] Amnesty International, a human rights group, said the measures must be reviewed by the upper house of parliament as they raise concerns about whether Belgium is in breach of international rights laws. in depth "A complete ban on the covering of the face would violate the rights to freedom of expression and religion of those women who wear the burqa or the niqab," said John Dalhuisen, Amnesty's expert on discrimination in Europe. "The Belgian move to ban full face veils, the first in Europe, sets a dangerous precedent." The law, which still needs to be passed by Belgium's senate, will be imposed in streets, public gardens and sports grounds or buildings "meant for public use or to provide services" to the public. "We're the first country to spring the locks that have made a good number of women slaves, and we hope to be followed by France, Switzerland, Italy, and the Netherlands; countries that think," said Denis Ducarme, a liberal deputy. People who ignore the ban could face a fine of $20 to $34 and, or, a jail sentence of up to seven days. [B] 'Disturbing' law[/B] "It's just a pretext," said Samuel Bulte, a convert to Islam handing out flyers and religious objects in front of the mosque. [highlight]"How many robberies are committed wearing a burqa?[/highlight] "I'm afraid that soon they're going to want to start putting crescents on the backs of Muslims," he said, in a reference to the yellow stars the Nazis forced Jews to wear. Another man outside the mosque said: "The Virgin Mary also wore a veil. No one says anything about this." Nearby, 25-year-old Said said he was stunned "that a secular country would get mixed up in religion." Bruno Tuybens, a Flemish Socialist, was one of the two deputies who abstained from Thursday's vote. "This law disturbs me," he said. "I believe in freedom of expression and I don't think it should be restricted unless it's in very exceptional circumstances. "There is no link at all between crime and wearing the burqa or niqab." [B]Sarkozy support[/B] In Le Soir, a French newspaper, Michael Privot, an Islamic scholar, said Belgium "now joins Iran and Saudi Arabia in that exclusive but unenviable rare club of countries to impose a dress code in the public domain". Nicolas Sarkozy, France's president, has declared that the face veil is not welcome in his country, calling it an affront to French values that denigrates women. He said the three cite "the protection of dignity, or even the freedom, of women to justify the unjustifiable: the restriction of individual freedoms of some of our citizens". France's National Assembly will begin debate in early July on a bill banning the full face veil. A final draft of the legislation outlawing the article of clothing from all public spaces as well as state institutions is set to be approved by the cabinet on May 19. Staunchly secular France passed a law in 2004 banning the wearing of headscarves or any other "conspicuous" religious symbols in state schools.[/quote] A lot of good points where brought up. A lot of people against the veil point out that husbands forcing them is the reason, which I said many times was not true, for example a [URL="http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/2010/01/201012515127437808.html"]Muslim women speaking out about her rights[/URL] to wear a Burqa. Another is security, I highlighted a part in the article due to its truthfulness [quote]How many robberies are committed wearing a burqa?[/quote]

If you're wearing something that covers your entire face, you're always a potential threat if you ask me. Also the logic of immigrant muslims is as backwards as shit. In their original country they're complaining about how the headrag oppresses them and how they want to lose it Yet here they're forced to ditch it and then they start bitching it shows their religion. [quote]How many robberies are committed wearing a burqa?[/quote] [url]http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3745402[/url] [url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1209006/Jewellers-robbery-Oxfordshire-burka-clad-man--150-000-designer-watches-stolen.html[/url] [url]http://www.france24.com/en/20100210-burqa-robbers-post-office-paris-nicolas-sarkozy-ban-national-identity-france-muslim[/url]

Regardless of what I do and don't believe, it's not the goverment's role to tell people what they should and shouldn't wear any more than the husbands of the women that wear them under their command.

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717635]If you're wearing something that covers your entire face, you're always a potential threat if you ask me. Also the logic of immigrant muslims is as backwards as shit. [/QUOTE] Why are face paints and ski masks still legal then? [quote] In their original country they're complaining about how the headrag oppresses them and how they want to lose it Yet here they're forced to ditch it and then they start bitching it shows their religion.[/quote]They don't.

[QUOTE=ph:lxyz;21717652]Regardless of what I do and don't believe, it's not the goverment's role to tell people what they should and shouldn't wear any more than the husbands of the women that wear them under their command.[/QUOTE] The ban is not only on burqas. It's a global ban on any kind of object that covers your face.

If you don't like it, go back to your country.

[QUOTE=starpluck;21717667]Why are face paints and ski masks still legal then?[/QUOTE] They're not and if they don't wear those rags in those middle eastern countries they'll either get raped or thrown in jail.

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717668]The ban is not only on burqas. It's a global ban on any kind of object that covers your face.[/QUOTE] Its just the Burqa.

most of the time they get raped and thrown in jail though.

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717684]They're not and if they don't wear those rags in those middle eastern countries they'll either get raped or thrown in jail.[/QUOTE] Where are you getting your facts? They are legal.

I think the ban will make people more comfortable in the long run. [editline]0[/editline] [QUOTE=jota de;21717675]If you don't like it, go back to your country.[/QUOTE] Also this

[QUOTE=starpluck;21717688]Its just the Burqa.[/QUOTE] This article only talks about the burqa but if you've been following the Belgian/Dutch news lately you would've known it's a global ban on anything that covers your face.

They should respect the country that they're living in rules. They came here, maybe fleeing their own country, so they should respect us for letting them in and atleast follow the rules...

[QUOTE=jota de;21717675]If you don't like it, go back to your country.[/QUOTE] what if they were born there? where will they go?

[QUOTE=jota de;21717675]If you don't like it, go back to your country.[/QUOTE] yea

[QUOTE=starpluck;21717706]Where are you getting your facts? They are legal.[/QUOTE] Ever read the stories about women getting thrown acid and burning material on their faces because they weren't wearing burqas? Seeing this post I bet you don't. The main reason behind the acid was because they didn't go into marriage though, but the point still stands.

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717635]If you're wearing something that covers your entire face, you're always a potential threat if you ask me.[/QUOTE] Ski lodges, BUSTLING HIVES OF DANGER. [QUOTE=WPlayer;21717635]Also the logic of immigrant muslims is as backwards as shit. In their original country they're complaining about how the headrag oppresses them and how they want to lose it Yet here they're forced to ditch it and then they start bitching it shows their religion.[/QUOTE] Regardless, it impedes their religious freedom just to ban something that is not dangerous in itself.

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717749]Ever read the stories about women getting thrown acid and burning material on their faces because they weren't wearing burqas? Seeing this post I bet you don't.[/QUOTE] I was talking about the ski masks and face-painting, the acid was from the Taliban, they're fucked up as it is.

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717749]Ever read the stories about women getting thrown acid and burning material on their faces because they weren't wearing burqas? Seeing this post I bet you don't.[/QUOTE] Woah that's crazy maybe we should ban throwing acid on people's faces Oh wait

[QUOTE=ph:lxyz;21717652]Regardless of what I do and don't believe, it's not the goverment's role to tell people what they should and shouldn't wear any more than the husbands of the women that wear them under their command.[/QUOTE] This.

[QUOTE=starpluck;21717764]I was talking about the ski masks and face-painting, the acid was from the Taliban[/QUOTE] The ban already exists in most countries, only they just count in government buildings. [editline]08:20PM[/editline] [QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;21717785]Woah that's crazy maybe we should ban throwing acid on people's faces Oh wait[/QUOTE] Aren't we witty today

brace for CriticalThought

[QUOTE=toxicpiano;21717848]brace for CriticalThought[/QUOTE] His ban will expire in exactly 3 hours.

[QUOTE=starpluck;21717867]His ban will expire in exactly 3 hours.[/QUOTE] best to prepare early

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21717832]The ban already exists in most countries, only they just count in government buildings.[/QUOTE] The law is obviously going to get more complicated in an circumstance like a government building where people may be asked to identify themselves anyway, but an outright ban is ridiculous.

[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;21718035]The law is obviously going to get more complicated in an circumstance like a government building where people may be asked to identify themselves anyway, but an outright ban is ridiculous.[/QUOTE] If the ban truly falls only on burqas, then it's just nitpicking on a certain religion but I can understand the concern about not being able to see the face. That and I see women wearing burqas daily and they don't even speak Dutch, they just keep talking their home country language whether it'd be Turkish or Moroccan, it's kind of intimidating for some people

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21718096]If the ban truly falls only on burqas, then it's just nitpicking on a certain religion but I can understand the concern about not being able to see the face.[/QUOTE] Why? [QUOTE=WPlayer;21718096]That and I see women wearing burqas daily and they don't even speak Dutch, they just keep talking their home country language whether it'd be Turkish or Moroccan, it's kind of intimidating for some people[/QUOTE] So because people feel uncomfortable about practices and languages different from their own, they should be banned?

[QUOTE=WPlayer;21718096] That and I see women wearing burqas daily and they don't even speak Dutch, they just keep talking their home country language whether it'd be Turkish or Moroccan, it's kind of intimidating for some people[/QUOTE] That applies everywhere and doesn't warrant a ban. I could say I never seen a Dutch person speaking Arabic in Dubai.

[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;21718137]Why? So because people feel uncomfortable about practices and languages different from their own, they should be banned?[/QUOTE] The second part explains the why and if you come to live in another country yet refuse to learn their language (some of them learn it though and I never hear anything bad about those) or just set themself to the rules of the country, I'd say that should warrant a ban yes. [editline]08:49PM[/editline] [QUOTE=starpluck;21718190]That applies everywhere and doesn't warrant a ban. I could say I never seen a Dutch person speaking Arabic in Dubai.[/QUOTE] Most of the Dutch in Dubai are tourists, while the people here are actually Citizens of the Netherlands. And most of them got into the country under the rule of that they're married to a citizen of the Netherlands, so they never had to do anything to get allowed into the Country.

Can we just turn belgium into an anti islam rightwing shithole in europe and close the borders?