[video=youtube;bIfWmriQR1s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIfWmriQR1s[/video]
I think he sums up my feelings quite well regarding the secrets.
I had more of a problem with this in TNO where you had to stop in your tracks either because of bulletsponges or so you could [I]mash e to collect tiny bits of ammo/health/armor[/I] (not optional) as opposed to looking for [I]optional collectible upgrade points[/I].
George is usually on point but these criticisms are mostly a [I]him [/I]problem if he's the one that wants to die X times so he can fill out a checklist. Granted those checklists shouldn't be there in the first place and the secrets should be a little more natural to stumble upon but dude come on :v:
Getting hung up on the codex entries in Doom is the silliest thing I've heard in a while.
Super Bunnyhop has become the poor man's Game Maker's Toolkit
I played through paying minimal attention to the collectibles because I thought they were boring. It's really not difficult to just ignore them, especially if you don't like them as much as this dude.
Usually I love superbunnyhop but I think it's ridiculous that he can fault a game for his own obsessive need to 100% things.
The codex entry issue is a little ridiculous considering in this game they are entirely optional. It's not like Doom 3 where you had to scour logs for codes.
I read like 4 of them, found 2 of those interesting, and ignored the rest.
As for the upgrades, i don't know about how it is for lower difficulties but on nightmare I was swimming in upgrade points, I can't really recall a time where I was required to do a challenge to get them, with the exception of the weapon masteries.
Not to mention, you can disable the codex popups in the options IIRC.
George really is nitpicking at this point.
[QUOTE=Dirf;50631525]I played through paying minimal attention to the collectibles because I thought they were boring. It's really not difficult to just ignore them, especially if you don't like them as much as this dude.
Usually I love superbunnyhop but I think it's ridiculous that he can fault a game for his own obsessive need to 100% things.[/QUOTE]
Well if a game has bad 100% completion then that's a fault of the game, is it not?
[QUOTE]"...plus they weren't clearly marked on your map, blatantly telling you where they were and teasing you to come and find them."[/QUOTE]
Hey it's almost like the map is there to prevent secret upgrades from being gated too heavily by exploration.
"Also here's a clip of me jumping around at walls like an idiot even though I just said that all of the secrets are clearly marked. This was okay and more fun in Doom '93 because reasons."
I think his complaints are perfectly valid. The mechanics of the game incentive futzing around looking for collectibles, and since game systems are systems of incentive, then hunting for collectibles becomes inextricable from the design of Doom itself.
Besides, it's a pretty tepid defense of a game to say "Well you can just ignore all the boring and poorly designed parts."
[QUOTE=Hamaflavian;50631765]I think his complaints are perfectly valid. The mechanics of the game incentive futzing around looking for collectibles, and since game systems are systems of incentive, then hunting for collectibles becomes inextricable from the design of Doom itself.
Besides, it's a pretty tepid defense of a game to say "Well you can just ignore all the boring and poorly designed parts."[/QUOTE]
I can see someone not liking having to do the combat challenges to unlock upgrades, but
[QUOTE]"At least during the second playthrough I didn't have to read all this flavor text."[/QUOTE]
if you've been reviewing games for a few years shit like this should be setting off alarm bells while you're making the video.
I prefer George being a completionist nut because his reviews are almost always better than the idiots at Game Reviewing sites who just lazily play through the game on easy and then give it a score in the range of 7-9 out of 10.
In all honesty, I didn't know upgrade points came from challenges. I figured they came from something but I didn't bother to figure out what. Didn't really slow me down.
if the game encourages completionism and then actually trying to complete everything is a bad experience then it deserves to be criticized. it's like if dark souls had a bunch of optional areas that were absolute shit and people said "well you don't HAVE to go there". if it's in the game it's fair to review it
[QUOTE=TheHydra;50632224]if the game encourages completionism and then actually trying to complete everything is a bad experience then it deserves to be criticized. it's like if dark souls had a bunch of optional areas that were absolute shit and people said "well you don't HAVE to go there". if it's in the game it's fair to review it[/QUOTE]
optional areas with gameplay =/= collectibles and secrets
[editline]2nd July 2016[/editline]
man lmao "on my second playthrough I didn't [B]have to[/B] read the flavor text"
Like, the weapon upgrades are barely necessary and they're there for the sake of a reward, I finished the game on ultra violence without fully getting everything and went back and got 100%. Besides, you get a shitton of points by just playing anyway and if systems like that weren't there you would be stripping the game completely down to "fight demons and have nothing else whatsoever".
[QUOTE=Jericho_Rus;50633046]optional areas with gameplay =/= collectibles and secrets[/QUOTE]
collecting shit ingame is not gameplay? :P
I mean it's 100% tied with the game, is it not? It's silly not to acnkowledge that it's a part of the game that preferably shouldn't be a bad/boring/useless experience
If it's a boring collectible/achievement - remove it from the game. Less is more. Many developers sure need to learn to restrict themselves using that basis. Sure it makes the game "longer" but who gives a fuck about that unless you're the publisher
essentially the nitpicks come across as "I'm not going to play the way I would like to because the game has secrets and flavor text that I must find and read for reasons unknown"
[editline]2nd July 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Mooe94;50633097]collecting shit ingame is not gameplay? :P[/QUOTE]
with the DS optional area comparison, which would involve enemies, bosses, a covenant, gear and whatnot - finding a secret doomguy figurine for an upgrade point that you get by playing the game anyway is something I would call a major gameplay feature
[QUOTE=Dirf;50631525]I played through paying minimal attention to the collectibles because I thought they were boring. It's really not difficult to just ignore them, especially if you don't like them as much as this dude.
Usually I love superbunnyhop but I think it's ridiculous that he can fault a game for his own obsessive need to 100% things.[/QUOTE]
I tried to collect everything for the first two levels or so, then just went "Nah, fuck it. I'll kill demons! Ooh, I found a collectible by accident? Nice."
[QUOTE=Mooe94;50633097]collecting shit ingame is not gameplay? :P
I mean it's 100% tied with the game, is it not? It's silly not to acnkowledge that it's a part of the game that preferably shouldn't be a bad/boring/useless experience
If it's a boring collectible/achievement - remove it from the game. Less is more. Many developers sure need to learn to restrict themselves using that basis. Sure it makes the game "longer" but who gives a fuck about that unless you're the publisher[/QUOTE]
I think the point is that the issue of bad collectibles is more of a footnote than a major flaw; Sure you can finger it out, but to do that for an entire paragraph is a bit much. It's like making the skulls in Halo out to be a significant detractor of gameplay.
The design behind the collectibles is debatable sure, and I get that this is more of a quirky personal-nitpick essay than a review, but like come on :v:
I think his complaints are fair but that is as far as it goes. Nitpicks if anything, not really something that should detrimentally affect your overall impression on the game.
I absolutely loved getting all of the challenges and collectibles. They gave me a reason to play through all of the levels again, and finding those well hidden secrets was always satisfying. They ground the action to a halt, sure, but it was still fun.
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