Couple found guilty of murder after using Christian parenting book "To Train Up a Child" - Polidicks

[url]http://www.examiner.com/article/another-couple-found-guilty-of-murder-for-parenting-by-to-train-up-a-child[/url] [quote]The New York Times reported: Late one night in May this year, the adopted girl, Hana, was found face down, naked and emaciated in the backyard; her death was caused by hypothermia and malnutrition, officials determined. According to the sheriff’s report, the parents had deprived her of food for days at a time and had made her sleep in a cold barn or a closet and shower outside with a hose. And they often whipped her, leaving marks on her legs. The mother had praised the Pearls’ book and given a copy to a friend, the sheriff’s report said. Hana had been beaten the day of her death, the report said, with the 15-inch plastic tube recommended by Mr. Pearl. Some of the discipline techniques the Pearls teach include: Using plastic tubing to beat children, since it hurts a lot but leaves fewer marks to alert authorities Wearing the plastic tubing around the parent's neck as a constant reminder to obey "Swatting" babies as young as six months old with instruments such as "a 12-inch willowy branch," thinner plastic tubing or a wooden spoon "Blanket training" babies by hitting them with an instrument if they try to crawl off a blanket on the floor Beating older children with rulers, paddles, belts and larger tree branches "Training" children with pain before they even disobey, in order to teach total obedience Giving cold water baths, putting children outside in cold weather and withholding meals as discipline Hosing off children who have potty training accidents Inflicting punishment until a child is "without breath to complain."[/quote] [quote]Michael Pearl tells one mother on his website, "I could break his anger in two days. He would be too scared to get angry. On the third day he would draw into a quiet shell and obey." "The Schatzes followed, to a "t", a system of child rearing which came from Michael and Debi Pearl... The Pearls are not professionally trained or educated in child development. They came up with this darkness out of the abundance of their hearts... [b]It is one of the most hate-filled, wicked and evil systems I've encountered in my life, all with a sheen of 'Christian' and 'happy families.'[/b]"[/quote] It's the third murder in which this book is associated with, who knows how many others there are in reality. How do people get so religious they just turn into stupid non thinking shits? Oh wait.

How the fuck can you call yourself christian while you do such shit? It's completely against anything the Bible says

[img]http://wp.patheos.com.s3.amazonaws.com/blogs/nolongerquivering/files/2010/03/michael-pearl.jpg[/img] This guy clearly knows how to properly raise children

The book directly describes - and encourages - child abuse. how the hell is something like that legal

This is over a year old bro. Doesn't change the fact that it's terrible/disgusting/an affront to all rational people, regardless of faith. [editline]19th November 2013[/editline] [url]http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/07/us/deaths-put-focus-on-pastors-advocacy-of-spanking.html?_r=3&[/url]

I really don't understand how people can think this kind of treatment would do anything other than irreparably damage their child

[QUOTE=Last or First;42919662]The book directly describes - and encourages - child abuse. how the hell is something like that legal[/QUOTE] because it's meant to only be used for informational purposes

[QUOTE=Lonestriper;42919689]I really don't understand how people can think this kind of treatment would do anything other than irreparably damage their child[/QUOTE] To set a bone you sometimes have to re-break it. If you only put on a cast and let it heal on its own, it will be disformed. The same thing applies to children: you have to break them before they can grow up to be proper and good adults. [sp]this is my interpretation of the mindset and is in no way my actual belief[/sp]

[QUOTE=ionuttzu;42919650]How the fuck can you call yourself christian while you do such shit? It's completely against anything the Bible says[/QUOTE] Actually, the Bible pretty much loves telling parents to be violent against their children. Proverbs 13:24 Whoever spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is diligent to discipline him.

I hope the parents can be rehabilitated

[QUOTE=valkery;42919677]This is over a year old bro. Doesn't change the fact that it's terrible/disgusting/an affront to all rational people, regardless of faith. [editline]19th November 2013[/editline] [url]http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/07/us/deaths-put-focus-on-pastors-advocacy-of-spanking.html?_r=3&[/url][/QUOTE] My mistake, the article on the examiner was dated Nov 15 of this year.

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42919716]Actually, the Bible pretty much loves telling parents to be violent against their children. Proverbs 13:24 Whoever spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is diligent to discipline him.[/QUOTE] You know you could take that as a metaphor that you have to punish your children(and not you have to punish your children physically).

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42919716]Actually, the Bible pretty much loves telling parents to be violent against their children. Proverbs 13:24 Whoever spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is diligent to discipline him.[/QUOTE] It also tells parents not to be complete dicks to their kids.

[QUOTE=ASIC;42919812]You know you could take that as a metaphor that you have to punish your children(and not you have to punish your children physically).[/QUOTE] Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell. -- Proverbs 23:13-14 I can do this all day.

[QUOTE=ASIC;42919812]You know you could take that as a metaphor that you have to punish your children(and not you have to punish your children physically).[/QUOTE] Back when the bible was written, physical punishment was SOP.

as shitty as the they were, I am pretty sure the people in the Bible who advocated using the rod did not mean "starve your kid and beat your child to death"

What the fuck How are these values Christian at all [editline]19th November 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Shark Bones;42919829]Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell. -- Proverbs 23:13-14 I can do this all day.[/QUOTE] "He shall not die"

[QUOTE=Last or First;42919662]The book directly describes - and encourages - child abuse. how the hell is something like that legal[/QUOTE] Books are almost always legal, at least in the states, falling under Freedom of Expression. There are very few exceptions, and even then there are usually legal ways to get around those.

[QUOTE=BFG9000;42919834]What the fuck How are these values Christian at all[/QUOTE] And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him ... Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.... And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. -- Genesis 22:1-2,10 Killing your child in the name of God is something most Christians believe they ought to be ready to do at any point.

Disregarding how fucked up the book is, how can you even let a single book dictate how your children will be raised? You'd think, considering the process of obtaining your baby and the physical implications of bearing a child, let alone putting it out, that parenting would at least boil down to instinct, plus some other things that you can't guess on your own and have a talk with your doctor about. But then there's the gullible parents who let a single book, not even a good one, put itself between the product of their flesh and themselves, as if it even deserved that place to begin with. And they just take the advice, beat the shit out of their kids and ultimately destroy it. And now you know there's actual people who do this. The lesson here is, life doesn't come with an instruction manual. While there's probably lots of books that teach about how to have fun, how to be healthy or how to cook well, sometimes you need to pull your head out of your ass and see for yourself how good you're doing. Now regarding the book, what's the catch? Can using this book lead to succesful parenting at all? I'm perplexed that anyone could believe this educational tool holds any legitimacy. I wouldn't do any of this to my worst enemy if I had one, heck i don't even think i'd give this treatment to a sim... It's just a recipe for post-expectancy abortion, why would you entrust that old beardy man with your parenting anyways? He's not fucking epicurus or anything, he's just a nigga with a throwing knife.

[QUOTE=person11;42919833]as shitty as the they were, I am pretty sure the people in the Bible who advocated using the rod did not mean "starve your kid and beat your child to death"[/QUOTE] idk that it can be said what what they "meant" since there was no specific rules for how to properly beat your child. the best you can get is that it is alright with your child, at least as long as a rod is used.

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42919846]And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him ... Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.... And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. -- Genesis 22:1-2,10 Killing your child in the name of God is something most Christians believe they ought to be ready to do at any point.[/QUOTE] You can't be serious.

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42919846]And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him ... Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.... And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. -- Genesis 22:1-2,10 Killing your child in the name of God is something most Christians believe they ought to be ready to do at any point.[/QUOTE] And right after that verse: "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son." Genesis 22:12 I can do this too.

I find something strange in the phrase 'train a child', as if they're a dog you need to teach tricks. You should be [i]raising[/i] a child - a distinction these parents would have done well to remember.

[QUOTE=F T;42920026]And right after that verse: "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son." Genesis 22:12 I can do this too.[/QUOTE] And yet God still told Abraham to do so, as a test of his faith. Just because that story didn't end in a dead child doesn't mean Christians don't willingly do unbelievably stupid things in the name of their God.

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42920113]And yet God still told Abraham to do so, as a test of his faith. Just because that story didn't end in a dead child doesn't mean Christians don't willingly do unbelievably stupid things in the name of their God.[/QUOTE] There are three kinds of atheists. [B]Passive[/B] ones that coexist with religion because people are entitled to believe what they want. [B]Defensive[/B] ones that defend their points when pressed, but leave well enough alone most of the time. [B]Dickhead[/B] ones that needlessly bash religions in order to get attention. Which one do you think you are being right now?

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42920113]And yet God still told Abraham to do so, as a test of his faith. Just because that story didn't end in a dead child doesn't mean Christians don't willingly do unbelievably stupid things in the name of their God.[/QUOTE] dude everytime the bible tells you to do something awful it's just a metaphor okay!

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;42920113]And yet God still told Abraham to do so, as a test of his faith. Just because that story didn't end in a dead child doesn't mean Christians don't willingly do unbelievably stupid things in the name of their God.[/QUOTE] Every major religion has that kind of people. And as you can see here, Christianity is no exception. However, the way you phrased your post made it seem as if you believed that every Christian thinks it's perfectly ok to kill their kids, even though one of the 10 commandments is "thou shall not kill."

[QUOTE=valkery;42920164]There are three kinds of atheists. [B]Passive[/B] ones that coexist with religion because people are entitled to believe what they want. [B]Defensive[/B] ones that defend their points when pressed, but leave well enough alone most of the time. [B]Dickhead[/B] ones that needlessly bash religions in order to get attention. Which one do you think you are being right now?[/QUOTE] coexist aka never EVER criticize religion or outdated religious texts

[QUOTE=valkery;42920164]There are three kinds of atheists. [B]Passive[/B] ones that coexist with religion because people are entitled to believe what they want. [B]Defensive[/B] ones that defend their points when pressed, but leave well enough alone most of the time. [B]Dickhead[/B] ones that needlessly bash religions in order to get attention. Which one do you think you are being right now?[/QUOTE] I'm not an atheist. I'm an agnostic, who bashes on ALL religions, INCLUDING atheism, because it's ALL stupid to me. These made up gods/lack thereof provide way too much potential for people to abuse them for their own sick ways. Nobody knows if God exists or not, that's a proven fact. I'm sick of seeing shit like this, abused children, because the Bible says it's ok.