New US debt plans unveiled: Democrats offer to cut more than twice as much as Republicans and not to
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• Both US parties have unveiled new deficit reduction plans with the deadline for raising the debt ceiling just over a week away.
• The Democrats appear to have fallen back to their last resort, offering to cut $2.7 trillion over a decade and not to raise taxes. Their plan is endorsed by the White House.
• The Republican plan cuts just $1.2 trillion, but includes cuts to Medicare and Medicaid.
• The Democrats have called their plan "an offer that Republicans can't refuse," and say that if they refuse it "it simply means they want a default."
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14285268[/url]
[quote=BBC News]Senate Democrats and House Republicans have unveiled competing plans to cut the US budget deficit and raise its debt limit to avoid a default.
The Democrats' plan would trim $2.7tn (£1.66tn) over a decade and the Republicans' would trim $1.2tr - but also cut programmes for the poor and elderly popular among Democrats.
Neither plan would raise new revenue.
The US risks default on its $14.3tn (£8.7tn) debt without a deal to raise the borrowing limit by 2 August.
Democratic President Barack Obama and Republican and Democratic leaders of the House and Senate have been engaged for weeks in intense protracted negotiations over legislation to raise the debt ceiling.
But talks have foundered over the details of ways to trim the US budget deficit in tandem with raising the debt ceiling.
The talks have broken down several times. In order to become law, any plan would require agreement from disparate factions within both parties and to pass both chambers of Congress.
In Monday's latest round of bargaining, Senate Democratic Whip Chuck Schumer of New York introduced a plan to trim agriculture subsidies and housing programmes. However, the plan would protect health programmes for the elderly and the poor and the Social Security pension scheme.
"This is an offer that Republicans can't refuse," Mr Schumer told reporters about the Senate Democrats' plan.
Republicans had agreed to all those cuts at one point or another during the protracted budget and debt limit negotiations, he said.
"If they refuse this offer it simply means they want a default."
That plan would increase the US debt limit enough to give the government borrowing authority through 2012.
The Senate Democrats' plan won immediate endorsement from the White House, which called it "a reasonable approach that should receive the support of both parties."
Meanwhile, Republican House Speaker John Boehner was expected to unveil his own plan later on Monday.
Aides said Mr Boehner's plan included $1.2tn (£736tn) in cuts and spending caps and offered a $1tn debt ceiling increase.
It would also include a second debt limit increase through 2012 contingent on cuts in the health programmes for the poor and elderly, and would not include new revenues, reports said.
Competing plans
In a sign of the growing urgency and concern in global financial markets, the International Monetary Fund (IMF) on Monday called on the US government to act urgently to raise the debt ceiling and for a "comprehensive solution" to reduce the US deficit over the medium term.
Without this, IMF directors warned, the markets could lose confidence in Washington's ability to pay its debts.
"These risks would also have significant global repercussions, given the central role of US Treasury bonds in world financial markets," the IMF said.
It went on to call for specific actions to reduce spending saying: "The strategy should include entitlement reforms, including additional savings in healthcare, as well as revenue increases."
But, warning that US growth was likely to remain subdued over the medium term, the IMF advised against fast cuts which could impact on consumer spending.
President Obama meanwhile pulled out of two fundraising events in Washington scheduled for Monday evening so that he could focus on the debt issue.
He told a Hispanic civil rights convention earlier in the day that the US could not solve its budget problem solely by reducing spending, in a riposte to Republicans who have vigorously opposed raising taxes.
"We can't just close our deficit by cutting spending," Mr Obama said, adding that revenue increases were also necessary.
Global markets were down slightly on Monday amid concerns about a lack of a deal as the 2 August deadline looms.
If the ceiling is not raised, the US Treasury could run out of money to pay all of its bills - which could lead to interest rate rises, threaten the US economy and in turn the global recovery.
US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton has said she is "confident" Congress will reach a deal to raise the US debt ceiling.
"Let me assure you we understand the stakes. We know how important this is for us and how important it is for you," Mrs Clinton told Hong Kong business leaders.
Mr Obama was joined by congressional leaders at the White House again on Saturday, but the deadlock continued.
On Friday, negotiations between Mr Obama and Mr Boehner collapsed, with each side blaming the other.
The US federal government is running a large budget deficit - equal to $1.3tn, or more than $4,000 per person, during the 12 months to June this year.
Mr Obama and fellow Democrats have been seeking a deal with Republicans, who control the House of Representatives, to cut the annual budget deficit in return for a rise in the total debt ceiling.
Mr Obama wants the debt reduction deal to include a combination of spending cuts and tax rises, but Republicans in both houses of Congress are strongly opposed to the latter.
Democrats, meanwhile, are against any cuts to healthcare and welfare programmes for pensioners and the poor.[/quote]
Republicans wont let it happen because they all despise this country.
That's right, I finally see it now, they don't do it for religion or for their own beliefs, they just hate america in all its forms, and want to see it destroyed.
I bet the republicans will refuse it.
Well I don't see a problem with the demo's plan. Atleast it there is compromise somewhere.
Here it is Republicans, now or never.
BREAKING NEWS: DEBT REDUCTION, OR SOCIALISM? THE DEMOCRAT'S PLAN TO WEAKEN THE NATION
REAGON RENEGADE NEWT GINGRICH STANDS UP TO COMMUNIST PLOT, TONIGHT AT 11
:foxnews:
Still fucking embarrassing how the repubs are acting to be fair. It's like they really don't care about the country or it's people.
The Republicans don't want to destroy the country, just their competition. They won't default, so now it's just a waiting game. They will eventually agree to the Democrats' plan.
lol nvm
I really hope they're not retarded enough to refuse this deal
What does the Democrat plan cut from?
[b][i]PLEASE TAKE THIS DEAL FOR CHRIST SAKE REPUBLICANS YOU'VE RUN OUT OF TIME.[/i][/b]
I want the democrats say "We will NOT kill everyone in England!" just so that the Republicans INSTANTLY decide "WE WILL KILL EVERYONE IN ENGLAND" just because that would be the exact opposite of what democrats want.
Result? Republicans get beat to shit.
What are they doing, you can't solve this with just less money going out, you need more money coming in too.
Thank God they've finally realized we need to curb federal money usage as opposed to giving them more money.
[editline]25th July 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Nerts;31331163]What are they doing, you can't solve this with just less money going out, you need more money coming in too.[/QUOTE]
The main source of income is taxes. Nobody wants higher taxes. Like a car, you make it more efficient so it works better without adding any fuel consumption. Or works just as well with reduced fuel consumption.
[QUOTE=Nerts;31331163]What are they doing, you can't solve this with just less money going out, you need more money coming in too.[/QUOTE]
[quote]"We can't just close our deficit by cutting spending," Mr Obama said, adding that revenue increases were also necessary.[/quote]
This is just as it says, the Democrats' last resort. They tried to get a tax raise with some spending cuts, then tried to go with just their original spending cuts, and now they just want to make sure that those who need the healthcare and aid from Medicare and Medicaid still get theirs when all this is said and done. For the Republicans to not accept this deal would be monstrous.
[QUOTE=Nerts;31331163]What are they doing, you can't solve this with just less money going out, you need more money coming in too.[/QUOTE]
Americans don't want to stop living above their means.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;31331172]Thank God they've finally realized we need to curb federal money usage as opposed to giving them more money.[/QUOTE]
You can't just have one or the other, you need aspects of both. Cutting spending in frivolous places as well as raises taxes on those who can take on the burden, is essential during times like these.
[QUOTE=Wam;31330813]Republicans wont let it happen because they all despise this country.
That's right, I finally see it now, they don't do it for religion or for their own beliefs, they just hate america in all its forms, and want to see it destroyed.[/QUOTE]
What are you talking about. They live here, they don't want the country destroyed.
Besides, it's a nice gesture coming from democrats, but it's not going to come out of their salary. Anything that could change how congressmen and women are getting paid will not go through.
If we're cutting "$2.7 trillion over a decade and not [raising] taxes" I want to know what their cutting first. Might be education, might be military, who knows.
[b]e:[/b] So we've got "$1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts". That sounds ominous.
[quote=BBC][img]http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/54236000/gif/_54236326_us_debt_464_corr.gif[/img][/quote]
Things aren't going well so far.
[QUOTE=Nerts;31331163]What are they doing, you can't solve this with just less money going out, you need more money coming in too.[/QUOTE]
The Democrats know that, but Republicans wouldn't accept any deal that include repealing the Bush Tax Cuts or raising taxes in any fashion, so this is the last resort.
[QUOTE=Chilean;31331124]What does the Democrat plan cut from?[/QUOTE]
$1 trillion in cuts from winding down wars, $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts, $30 billion in Fannie and Freddie changes, and $10 to $15 billion in agriculture savings, among other things.
[QUOTE=Super Muffin;31331274]What are you talking about. They live here, they don't want the country destroyed.
Besides, it's a nice gesture coming from democrats, but it's not going to come out of their salary. Anything that could change how congressmen and women are getting paid will not go through.
If we're cutting "$2.7 trillion over a decade and not [raising] taxes" I want to know what their cutting first. Might be education, might be military, who knows.[/QUOTE]
Yes, but the Republican's constituents are not the ones who are hurt most by a default.
[QUOTE=5killer;31331287][B]$1 trillion in cuts from winding down wars[/B], $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts, $30 billion in Fannie and Freddie changes, and $10 to $15 billion in agriculture savings, among other things.[/QUOTE]
Problem detected.
Holy shit
[url]http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20083100-503544.html[/url]
House Speaker John Boehner decried the plan as "full of gimmicks."
They're really going to do it...
[QUOTE=Miskav;31331323]Problem detected.[/QUOTE]
Smurfy's link to CBS News says that the $1.2 trillion includes cuts to defense spending as well.
Yeah, Republicans aren't going to vote for this unfortunately.
[QUOTE=smurfy;31331350]Holy shit
[url]http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20083100-503544.html[/url]
House Speaker John Boehner decried the plan as "full of gimmicks."
They're really going to do it...[/QUOTE]
Good game America, it's been nice.
Damn that is a tempting offer for the republicans.
[QUOTE=smurfy;31331350]Holy shit
[url]http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20083100-503544.html[/url]
House Speaker John Boehner decried the plan as "full of gimmicks."
They're really going to do it...[/QUOTE]
[img]http://i55.tinypic.com/10efuh1.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Miskav;31331323]Problem detected.[/QUOTE]
"You know what, Republicans? Fuck it. 2.7 trillion in spending cuts. Is that enough for you?"
"What's the catch?"
"You don't cut money to saving lives and you cut money from predator drones and missiles."
"[b]HUFFHUFFHUFFHUFF INCONCEIVABLE![/b]"
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;31331268]You can't just have one or the other, you need aspects of both. Cutting spending in frivolous places as well as raises taxes on those who can take on the burden, is essential during times like these.[/QUOTE]
We've gotten to the point where we've just been adding on to the government, and things like welfare, social security, medicare and medicaid are being so abused that it's a giant outflow of money that should be corrected asap. The spending limit needs to be raised situationally, I agree, but it builds up to a point where we need to step back and say "Alright, where's the leak in the pipe?"
[QUOTE=Last or First;31331493]"You know what, Republicans? Fuck it. 2.7 trillion in spending cuts. Is that enough for you?"
"What's the catch?"
"You don't cut money to saving lives and you cut money from predator drones and missiles."
"[b]HUFFHUFFHUFFHUFF INCONCEIVABLE![/b]"[/QUOTE]
I know that was meant as a joke, but part of me can actually see that being... a real conversation.
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