Teenagers disgusted by Bristol police giving out 'R U Asking 4 It?' leaflets at sexual consent talk - Polidicks

[QUOTE]Teenagers said they were left disgusted after being given a "horrifying" leaflet titled 'R U Asking 4 It?' by police at a sexual consent talk. Pupils from the North Bristol Post 16 Centre attended the 'Only Yes Means Yes' event and left with the out of date leaflets branded "shocking". Police have since apologised for the brochure blunder, which left the talk "spiralling out of control" and needing teachers to step in. Kizzie Tims, 16, said she and nearly 50 of her classmate went to the talk and she said at one point she felt the need to stand up and explain that alcohol, nor clothing, caused raped - but rapists did. "The leaflet was about personal safety - robberies and muggings - but were not appropriate when taking about rape. [/QUOTE] [url]http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/teenagers-disgusted-by-bristol-police-giving-out-r-u-asking-4-it-leaflets-at-sexual-consent-talk/story-29498443-detail/story.html[/url]

[QUOTE]at one point she felt the need to stand up and explain that alcohol, nor clothing, caused raped - [B]but rapists did.[/B][/QUOTE] for some, this is a very difficult concept to grasp. but no, let's blame it on the clothing they wear, on the substances they consume, let's put the weight on the [I]victims[/I] and not on the [I]criminals[/I]. I find that very abhorrent. glad she stood up to it.

wow just wow

'R U asking 4 it' Jesus Christ. Can just imagine the type of bell end who would be responsible for this leaflet.

"R U asking 4 it?" [I]Yikes.[/I]

[QUOTE=Limed00d;50701910]for some, this is a very difficult concept to grasp. but no, let's blame it on the clothing they wear, on the substances they consume, let's put the weight on the [I]victims[/I] and not on the [I]criminals[/I]. I find that very abhorrent. glad she stood up to it.[/QUOTE] I agree with you I really do but at the same time rapists will always be out there so it's pretty naive to think there shouldn't be appropriate precautions taken to minimise the risk of being attacked. We wear seat belts when driving and high visibility clothing when walking in the dark after all. This leaflet is completely insensitive though and I'm glad it caused backlash.

How do we push victim blaming to the new generation? I know, out it in text speak!

[QUOTE=Buck.;50701981]I agree with you I really do but at the same rapists will always be out there so it's pretty naive to think there shouldn't be precautions taken to minimise the risk of being attacked. We wear seat belts when driving and high visibility clothing when walking in the dark after all. This leaflet is completely insensitive though and I'm glad it caused backlash.[/QUOTE] I really don't agree with this comparison, there is a big difference between seat belts that exist for the one purpose to reduce chances of serious injury in case of an accident and clothing or alcohol.

Can a mod fix the title? its ambiguous and could mean 2 entirely different things, if not more. Teenagers disgusted by Bristol police (start) giving out 'R U Asking 4 It?' leaflets at sexual consent talk Teenagers (become) disgusted with Bristol police giving out 'R U Asking 4 It?' leaflets at sexual consent talk. On topic, rapists dont care about clothing, research actually shows that most recidivist rapists look for what they perceive as prudish targets. However dressing in a tight pants still does make it harder to get raped.

[QUOTE=Buck.;50701981]I agree with you I really do but at the same rapists will always be out there so it's pretty naive to think there shouldn't be precautions taken to minimise the risk of being attacked. We wear seat belts when driving and high visibility clothing when walking in the dark after all. This leaflet is completely insensitive though and I'm glad it caused backlash.[/QUOTE] I share the same sentiment. While it would be ideal to be able to act unreservedly without regard to your own safety at any place and any time, the reality is that there will always be hormone-driven guys somewhere without self control who might harrass you as a woman. At present I think it would be better to strike a good balance between acting upon what is ideal and what is real, which involves taking precautions. The leaflet is of poor taste both in its message and delivery but I wouldn't really use the words HORRIFYING and SHOCKING to describe it lol.

[QUOTE=Buck.;50701981]I agree with you I really do but at the same rapists will always be out there so it's pretty naive to think there shouldn't be precautions taken to minimise the risk of being attacked. We wear seat belts when driving and high visibility clothing when walking in the dark after all. This leaflet is completely insensitive though and I'm glad it caused backlash.[/QUOTE] "Rapists will be always out there" yeah they will always be out there as soon as we shift focus from rapists to telling people to take "precautions to minimize risk". I mean, like you said either way, if it's naive to not wear a seat belt, like it's common sense, then we hardly need to say that shit in the first place? We lose too much from shifting the focus, there's no point with doing that at all. Time is lost discussing how to prevent rape from happening instead of actually talking about how to solve this shit, for example talking about how masculinity and macho ideals work, why we need to change them, etc.

[QUOTE=Buck.;50701981]I agree with you I really do but at the same rapists will always be out there so it's pretty naive to think there shouldn't be precautions taken to minimise the risk of being attacked. We wear seat belts when driving and high visibility clothing when walking in the dark after all. This leaflet is completely insensitive though and I'm glad it caused backlash.[/QUOTE] Difference is that seatbelts and high-vis vests protect (mostly) against accidents, rape and sexual assault is premeditated by people who decide that it'll be easier if the girl in question is drunk. If I'm walking home hammered and get beaten up and mugged because some lads decide I'm an easy target because I'm drunk, nobody will tell me "Well mate you only have yourself to blame there". Of course there are always ways you can make yourself safer, but when incidents are consciously perpetrated by individuals, rather than being an accident that could have been prevented by a seatbelt, or high-vis vest, it doesn't make sense to blame the victims.

What precautions do you think are relevant that girls don't already take? I mean it's already common sense not to walk home alone in the middle of the night, but you can't expect girls to never drink on nights out and I would like to see a single study about clothing actually affecting chances of getting raped.

Did that guy had meme school back in 2005?

absolute morons... couldn't be more moronic if you tried. basically "it's your fault you're raped, you asked for it".

[QUOTE=MrJazzy;50702092]What precautions do you think are relevant that girls don't already take? I mean it's already common sense not to walk home alone in the middle of the night, but you can't expect girls to never drink on nights out and I would like to see a single study about clothing actually affecting chances of getting raped.[/QUOTE] IIRC I saw an interview of a rapist in jail that said he targeted girls in skirts because it's easier than trying to fiddle someone's pants off when they're struggling. Just anecdotal but I assume more people think the same way.

[QUOTE=Limed00d;50701910]for some, this is a very difficult concept to grasp. but no, let's blame it on the clothing they wear, on the substances they consume, let's put the weight on the [I]victims[/I] and not on the [I]criminals[/I]. I find that very abhorrent. glad she stood up to it.[/QUOTE] There's two sides of everything, and sure a complete psychopath may go about raping without reason. .. but animals will go for the easiest target, and we've only been civilized for a few thousand years, so both are responsible.

[QUOTE=MrJazzy;50702092]What precautions do you think are relevant that girls don't already take? I mean it's already common sense not to walk home alone in the middle of the night, but you can't expect girls to never drink on nights out and I would like to see a single study about clothing actually affecting chances of getting raped.[/QUOTE] I've edited my post to say "appropriate precautions". I would consider those things like being familiar with your alcohol tolerance so you're not becoming too vulnerable, not accepting drinks or lifts from strangers, organising transport in advance so you do not have to walk far and stay on well lit main roads or not stay out too late if you must walk, making sure to stay with a group of people you trust, etc. Common sense things like that. I don't consider not drinking at all or changing the way you dress as the appropriate solution to not getting raped. All I'm saying is that in a perfect world no one should have to worry getting raped, but statistically it's impossible to get rid of rapists the same way it's impossible to get rid of drunk drivers, alas the car analogies. I doubt very many people teach their kids that raping someone is a valid tactic of getting sex, yet people still rape. Rapists are just rapists you can't make them stop by asking them nicely, that's the whole point. I don't see how this is changing the subject or victim blaming or distracting from the topic at hand, we can punish rapists and spread awareness of the dangers at the same time can we not?

[QUOTE=Blind Weasel;50701972]"R U asking 4 it?" [I]Yikes.[/I][/QUOTE] I can only imagine some old baby boomer going "is this how tem kids communicate these days? Lets use it"

[QUOTE=SirJon;50702261]I can only imagine some old baby boomer going "is this how tem kids communicate these days? Lets use it"[/QUOTE] Honestly it probably wasn't a baby boomer who came up with it, it was probably some 25 year old marketing executive who thinks he's young enough to be considered part of the Youth

[QUOTE=Dr. Ethan Asia;50702269]Honestly it probably wasn't a baby boomer who came up with it, it was probably some 25 year old marketing executive who thinks he's young enough to be considered part of the Youth[/QUOTE] But 25 year olds are youth

[QUOTE=SirJon;50702291]But 25 year olds are youth[/QUOTE] Which is why it's a fucking problem.

[QUOTE=Buck.;50701981]I agree with you I really do but at the same time rapists will always be out there so it's pretty naive to think there shouldn't be appropriate precautions taken to minimise the risk of being attacked. We wear seat belts when driving and high visibility clothing when walking in the dark after all. This leaflet is completely insensitive though and I'm glad it caused backlash.[/QUOTE] There is a difference between someone doing something horrible, to not wearing a seatbelt. A seat belt stops massive injury and possible death of multiple people because you don't turn into a high speed flying object. Where someone doing something horrible to someone isn't the person's fault in anyway. Unless they actually went around telling people to rape them, which doesn't make much sense. [editline]13th July 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=SirJon;50702291]But 25 year olds are youth[/QUOTE] Nah age is irrelevant, it's just stupid people being stupid.

[QUOTE=DELL;50702301]There is a difference between someone doing something horrible, to not wearing a seatbelt. A seat belt stops massive injury and possible death of multiple people because you don't turn into a high speed flying object. Where someone doing something horrible to someone isn't the person's fault in anyway. Unless they actually went around telling people to rape them, which doesn't make much sense. [/QUOTE] But that's implying that all car accidents are caused by the drivers themselves. You could be driving in perfect accordance to the traffic regulations yet a drunk or suicidal driver may slam into you as is very often the case. It wouldn't be your fault for dying in that car crash, but you may have prevented your death by following the appropriate safety procedures. It may not have been the perfect comparison but the point still stands, you must protect yourself even if the dangers are out of your control.

I think the problem is people don't view accidents in the same way as premeditated acts, with regards to prevention, for whatever reason. Both are ultimately random occurrences from the victim's point of view; just as you can't predict if you're going to be hit by lightning, nor can you predict if you're going to be mugged. But, what you can do in both cases is take precautions to reduce the likelihood of either occurring.

[QUOTE=Buck.;50702324]But that's implying that all car accidents are caused by the drivers themselves. You could be driving in perfect accordance to the traffic regulations yet a drunk or suicidal driver may slam into you as is very often the case. It wouldn't be your fault for dying in that car crash, but you may have prevented your death by following the appropriate safety procedures. It may not have been the perfect comparison but the point still stands, you must protect yourself even if the dangers are out of your control.[/QUOTE] Like I said a high moving projectile is possible if you don't wear a seatbelt. Someone in the backseat not wearing a seatbelt can kill the person in the front seat from flying from the seat due to lack of seatbelt. It's to protect others as well as yourself. Everything is outside of your control as the amount of forces in the world is massive. I could go stab someone right now, do I think it would be fun? Why yes I think it would be a fantastic time. Am I going to do that the answer is no because I make a choice not to be a horrible person. Doesn't matter what why you spin it, if someone wants something bad enough they will get it at any cost. So no matter what you do someone is gonna get the short straw as life is unfair unless you've got luck on your side.

You can definitely give people safety advice without falling into victim blaming. As much as rapists are to blame for rape occurring that doesn't mean you can ignore that they exist. Sounds like they did a horrible job at it in this case though.

It's not the victims fault and government authorities, most of all, should defend that - but it's also very important for parents (or people with similar roles) to teach about taking certain precautions. One does not invalidate the other and definitely doesn't mean it's the victims fault - stop with that nonsense. For the same reason you should lock your door, avoid walking dark and dangerous streets at night etc there are certain precautions that people can take that might reduce the chances of something bad happening, such as: Try to walk in groups, avoid getting blackout drunk (especially with people you don't know too well), don't accept random drinks - and yes, while controversial, dressing with less provocative clothes will make you stand out less and avoid getting attention etc Most of these apply to men and people don't give a damn because they know it's valid advice. A drunk, alone, man walking in a dangerous neighborhood with expensive clothes and visible items (e.g. iphone) is much more likely to get mugged. Teaching these things doesn't mean you're blaming the victim, it means you're teaching the ugliness of the world. Ultimately, you can do whatever you want, and it's definitely not your fault, but to imply there isn't absolutely no possible way to reduce the likelihood of something happening is disingenuous and might end up making things worse.

lmfao holy fuck this sounds like something from The Onion

The UK would probably benefit more from a "Don't U think it's time 2 stop drinking" pamphlet. Nothing makes it easier to rape a girl than finding her unconscious in the alleyway she went for a piss in.