Transgender wrestler Mack Beggs identifies as a male. He just won the Texas state girls title. - Polidicks

[QUOTE]CYPRESS, Tex. — Booed and bloody, Mack Beggs dropped to his knees to celebrate. He was, after four wins and two days and all the rest, a state champion. In a 12-2 victory against Chelsea Sanchez in the 110-pound classification, Beggs ended a highly controversial and dramatic weekend by becoming the first transgender participant to win a Class 6A girls’ state championship in Texas high school wrestling. “I just witnessed my sport change,” a longtime Texas wrestling coach said moments after Beggs, a 17-year-old junior at Trinity High in Euless whose transition from girl to boy began two years ago and now includes testosterone injections, won a championship. The victory was seen as equal parts unavoidable — quick and noticeably strong, he entered the tournament unbeaten in 52 matches against girls — and contentious. [B]The University Interscholastic League, which oversees sports in Texas public schools, ordered Beggs to continue competing in the girls’ division despite heavy uproar and a lawsuit earlier this month in a Travis County district court.[/B][/QUOTE] [QUOTE]On behalf of the father of one opponent, Baudhuin sent a certified letter in January petitioning the UIL to move Beggs to the boys’ division. This month he filed a lawsuit that asked for Beggs to be allowed to wrestle boys or removed from the championship tournament. For now, he said, the court has made no decision. The UIL issued a statement Friday that said the birth-certificate rule could change in the future (its legislative council meets in June), and Beggs’s school district determined his testosterone was “well below the allowed level.” Beggs has one year of high school eligibility remaining and could face additional scrutiny and potential courtroom battles next season. “You’ve got a kid who’s either going to quit the sport entirely or she has got to wrestle against girls, which she doesn’t want to do,” said Baudhuin, who said he still refers to Beggs by the female pronoun because he struggles to see his daughter’s old friend as a boy. “She’s in a no-win situation.”[/QUOTE] [url]http://wapo.st/2mxCFoT[/url] At NCAA level Beggs would compete in the male division. Long article. A real sad situation.

ridiclously unfair for a man to compete in a girls wrestling tournament

they should've reclassified him into the boys as soon as they found out he was on testosterone he's essentially on PEDs and makes it completely unfair for those who are competing in his weight class

[quote]“She’s standing there holding her head high like she’s the winner,” said Patti Overstreet, a mother of a wrestler in the boys’ division. “She’s not winning. She’s cheating.”[/quote] Well shit, if you and more people were willing to accept him as a male, he wouldn't have BTFO the girls and would have competed where he should. this quote is confusing as fuck because she recognizes he should be competing with the rest of the boys, but still insists on treating him as a girl.

[QUOTE=Dr.C;51880283]Well shit, if you and more people were willing to accept him as a male, he wouldn't have BTFO the girls and would have competed where he should. this quote is confusing as fuck because she recognizes he should be competing with the rest of the boys, but still insists on treating him as a girl.[/QUOTE] she's reached the point where sheer salt overrides logic

[QUOTE=Dr.C;51880283]Well shit, if you and more people were willing to accept him as a male, he wouldn't have BTFO the girls and would have competed where he should. this quote is confusing as fuck because she recognizes he should be competing with the rest of the boys, but still insists on treating him as a girl.[/QUOTE] I think it's far more likely she sees him as a freak, and doesn't think he should be wrestling at all. With people like that, nothing's going to be good enough. They'll always find something to whine about. I feel sorry for the kid, I really do. What he's doing takes courage, and I hope he can turn this humiliating situation into something positive for himself and the league.

[quote]“You’ve got a kid who’s either going to quit the sport entirely or she has got to wrestle against girls, which she doesn’t want to do,” said Baudhuin, who said he still refers to Beggs by the female pronoun because he struggles to see his daughter’s old friend as a boy. “She’s in a no-win situation.” [/quote] this isn't helping his situation at all if he is a man he is a man - it's people like this person that are contributing to why he's in this situation in the first place

It's like the exact opposite of the Fallon Fox thing

[QUOTE=PILLS HERE!;51880309]this isn't helping his situation at all if he is a man he is a man - it's people like this person that are contributing to why he's in this situation in the first place[/QUOTE] Hey at least he's got a somewhat legit reason to still refer to him as her. If you've always known someone as a her, it's difficult to switch to him just like that.

Yeah, he definitely shouldn't have kept fighting girls. Kinda surprised they didn't do anything about it despite going undefeated for so long. Shame he has to go through so much shit now.

Its pretty unsurprising that many of the ones unhappy about the situation are the ones misgendering him. If you want him to fight in the boys division, how about first acknowledging that he's a boy?

Lets be honest, I would agree if he would look like your typical woman athlete but with simply masculine physical traits. However, this guy, and I'm saying guy while I am quite skeptical of some cases, looks nothing like a girl now. [t]https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/styles/article_small/public/thumbnails/image/2017/02/26/13/mack-baggs.jpg[/t] This is pure disrespect and disgusting.

I consider myself an ally of trans individuals, but I still think that in the interests of sportsmanship, it's unfair that he was allowed to compete in a women's wrestling championship while on testosterone, which could be considered a PED. Was there no way he could've gotten into a/the men's tournament?

[QUOTE=archangel125;51880903]I consider myself an ally of trans individuals, but I still think that in the interests of sportsmanship, it's unfair that he was allowed to compete in a women's wrestling championship while on testosterone, which could be considered a PED. Was there no way he could've gotten into a/the men's tournament?[/QUOTE] This is the reality of not having transgender rights you treat trans people as though they aren't their gender and suddenly you see a lot of manly men wrestling women and hanging out in their bathrooms, and girly girls being forced to go to the men's bathroom

[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;51880936]This is the reality of not having transgender rights you treat trans people as though they aren't their gender and suddenly you see a lot of manly men wrestling women and hanging out in their bathrooms, and girly girls being forced to go to the men's bathroom[/QUOTE] Except this is not the case, this person is taking peds you fool.

[QUOTE=Tasm;51880969]Except this is not the case, this person is taking peds you fool.[/QUOTE] PED's = Hormonal Replacement Therapy in this case. It is literally a core element in the process of transitioning from female to male. The effects it is having on his body are the intended effects, as they are symptoms of higher testosterone levels required to assist the body in the process. The administration ordered him to continue competing in the girl's division regardless of this fact because they refuse to acknowledge that he has switched classes in an otherwise fairly arbitrary system, and that pitting him against girls in his weight class is disrespectful at the very least, both to him and the young women who worked hard to end up pitted set up against someone who is as you said, effectively on performance enhancing drugs when the same substances are taken by a woman who isn't being treated for gender dysphoria. Don't you think the best solution would be to let him try his hand against people of his gender, as both he prefers and his performance seems to imply he would be better suited? He might not come out on top every time but at least he would get to fight a competitor without the headlines being "non-woman (but also non-man) beats up woman, gets medal." The HRT might provide a slight edge for class benefit in the male division, but it'd be balanced out by being against people who have been supping testosterone their whole lives. Should MTF transgender people be required to continue competing in male divisions as well?

[QUOTE=archangel125;51880903]I consider myself an ally of trans individuals, but I still think that in the interests of sportsmanship, it's unfair that he was allowed to compete in a women's wrestling championship while on testosterone, which could be considered a PED. Was there no way he could've gotten into a/the men's tournament?[/QUOTE] Read the article. The rules the governing body set say you have to wrestle against people the same gender as your birth certificate says. They had 2 years to change the rules or otherwise do something about this, but instead sat on their asses and forced a man on testosterone injections to win against a bunch of women.

[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;51880936]This is the reality of not having transgender rights you treat trans people as though they aren't their gender and suddenly you see a lot of manly men wrestling women and hanging out in their bathrooms, and girly girls being forced to go to the men's bathroom[/QUOTE] you dont need transgender rights infact trans rights are another form of discrimination you need public acceptance

[QUOTE=archangel125;51880903]I consider myself an ally of trans individuals, but I still think that in the interests of sportsmanship, it's unfair that he was allowed to compete in a women's wrestling championship while on testosterone, which could be considered a PED. Was there no way he could've gotten into a/the men's tournament?[/QUOTE] He applied to compete in male wrestling and got refused by the governing body, this is on Texas UIT. And yes, for either FtM or MtF to compete in womens sports can be very unfair, testosterone is a massive advantage in building strength.

Honestly, if you're taking hormones you shouldn't compete in a physical competition, period. Kind of a catch-22, but he should've withdrawn untill his transition is completed, just out of fair play. In this situation, kinda feels like nobody (could've) won. The girls didn't win, because they got an unfair matchup. The boy didn't win, because he had to compete against girls. If he competed against boys, then those matchups would've been considered unfair. Really, in this position, you have to ask yourself, what is more important, yourself, or the sport.

[QUOTE=waylander;51881036]trans rights are another form of discrimination[/QUOTE] uh

[QUOTE=waylander;51881036]you dont need transgender rights infact trans rights are another form of discrimination you need public acceptance[/QUOTE] discrimination against [I]who?[/I]

I think we all need time to reflect on the outrage. If it was anything else, the parents would be trying to put ftms into female categories and saying "SHE WAS BORN FEMALE SO SHE'S A FEMALE. PUT HER WITH THE FEMALES!" Now that it involves an advantage (?), now they want to put him with the boys.

[QUOTE=ZuXer;51881066]Honestly, if you're taking hormones you shouldn't compete in a physical competition, period. Kind of a catch-22, but he should've withdrawn untill his transition is completed, just out of fair play. In this situation, kinda feels like nobody (could've) won. The girls didn't win, because they got an unfair matchup. The boy didn't win, because he had to compete against girls. If he competed against boys, then those matchups would've been considered unfair. Really, in this position, you have to ask yourself, what is more important, yourself, or the sport.[/QUOTE] I'm not super well informed on transitioning, so I wonder if you have a metric that you're judging this by. Since biological men naturally produce a good bit testosterone, how much was this guy taking as part of his transition and how much of a measurable advantage over biological men does this transition period give? Obviously, my point being that if a [I]very [/I]clear advantage can't be shown then transitioning has no bearing.

What did they expect would happen? Why was he not put in with the male contenders? The only risk in putting him with the male contenders is maybe to himself? where as there might've been an unfair advantage with him competing as if he had been a normal athletic girl who hadn't been transitioning for the past 2 years.

These people still referring to him as "she" are a real class act. "She needs to be wrestling boys" "But you just called this person 'she', so shouldn't 'she' be wrestling girls?" "NO BUT, UH" You can't have your bigot cake and eat it too. Either he's a guy and should be wrestling guys, or he's a girl and should be wrestling girls, you could at least be consistent.

This is why I really hate the transgender debate. The biggest problem with the negative side is they'd just prefer transgender people don't exist based off feeling and conjecture, rather than actually doing serious research. That's not going to happen, so we have to think about what happens when we apply their ideas. And what happens is stupid shit like this, over and over.

[QUOTE=DOG-GY;51881112]I'm not super well informed on transitioning, so I wonder if you have a metric that you're judging this by. Since biological men naturally produce a good bit testosterone, how much was this guy taking as part of his transition and how much of a measurable advantage over biological men does this transition period give? Obviously, my point being that if a [I]very [/I]clear advantage can't be shown then transitioning has no bearing.[/QUOTE] The entire goal is to get hormone levels that are roughly the average level of a biological man's. Too high and there will be health problems, too low, and there will be minimal effects. A good endocrinologist isn't going to put a FtM on a dose that's too high. So, there really isn't going to be an advantage. If anything a FtM will be at a disadvantage due to his slimmer skeletal structure (it takes time for calcium to build up, but T can only do so much). In general, a good ballpark for T levels for FtM is going to be 700ish ng/dL.

[QUOTE=waylander;51881036]you dont need transgender rights infact trans rights are another form of discrimination you need public acceptance[/QUOTE] the hell are you smoking? [editline]27th February 2017[/editline] how about both of those? trans rights are there to PROTECT trans people from discrimination against them, which even today is common place. if they are somehow discriminating against someone, then please enlighten me because I've never heard of trans right being discriminatory except against the vocal opposition.

[QUOTE=SadisticGecko;51881379]The entire goal is to get hormone levels that are roughly the average level of a biological man's. Too high and there will be health problems, too low, and there will be minimal effects. A good endocrinologist isn't going to put a FtM on a dose that's too high. So, there really isn't going to be an advantage. If anything a FtM will be at a disadvantage due to his slimmer skeletal structure (it takes time for calcium to build up, but T can only do so much). In general, a good ballpark for T levels for FtM is going to be 700ish ng/dL.[/QUOTE] This is what I figured intuitively. Thanks for the insight! Going off this in no way could anyone in good faith call it a PED when matched up to a male. He should have been allowed to compete with the boys.