[video=youtube;AaJXXSaFziU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaJXXSaFziU[/video]
[editline]a[/editline]
Really not sure where the dumbs are coming from, because the explanation is on point. Maybe not get swayed by the title alone?
no
[QUOTE=timz9;51028351]no[/QUOTE]
Slightly longer TL;DR: The movie gets really confusing if you try to make it a story about racism, and confusingly, the movie sometimes makes you believe, that it's about racism.
But if you treat it like a movie about racism, it's actually a movie about glorifying and justifying racism.
[QUOTE=nikomo;51028385]Slightly longer TL;DR: The movie gets really confusing if you try to make it a story about racism, and confusingly, the movie sometimes makes you believe, that it's about racism.
But if you treat it like a movie about racism, it's actually a movie about glorifying and justifying racism.[/QUOTE]
Some people just see what they want to see, don't forget that.
No, zootopia is actually really feminist
[video=youtube;VrJ5keORfrE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrJ5keORfrE[/video]
maybe zootopia, like all stories, is open to interpretation, and you can take whatever message away from it you want to
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51028486]maybe zootopia, like all stories, is open to interpretation, and you can take whatever message away from it you want to[/QUOTE]
I think the message is not to be prejudiced but it's not trying to create analogous situation to real world races and racism.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028530]I think the message is not to be prejudiced but it's not trying to create analogous situation to real world races and racism.[/QUOTE]
that's exactly it. It's obviously inspired by the plights of real world race issues, but isn't trying to force feed it to you. it might've originally been that but that inspiration serves as a foundation of the story and conflicts, not a driving force.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028530]but it's not trying to create analogous situation to real world races and racism.[/QUOTE]
It clearly does and has numerous scenes that draw a connection to specific real world things.
-"It's okay when a bunny calls another bunny (...) it's weird when a non-bunny calls a bunny (...)"
-"Token bunny"
-Some animals being treated like in the Apartheid because some businesses won't serve them (the ice cream scene)
[editline]a[/editline]
The message could be solely about prejudice in general, but it is taking things from real world races and racism.
[QUOTE=RaptorJGW;51028571]It clearly does and has numerous scenes that draw a connection to specific real world things.
-"It's okay when a bunny calls another bunny (...) it's weird when a non-bunny calls a bunny (...)"
-"Token bunny"
-Some animals being treated like in the Apartheid because some businesses won't serve them (the ice cream scene)[/QUOTE]
So which ones are the white people and which ones are the black people?
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028575]So which ones are the white people and which ones are the black people?[/QUOTE]
If you watched the video you would know that can't be clearly said. It's still making statements on real life racism with real world examples though. But those examples have been lumped together. It's not entirely coherent that you could say "Predators are all white/black people".
What I'm trying to say is that questions like "is zootopia racist" are pointless because zootopia, like literally [I]everything[/I], can be interpreted in multiple ways
interpreting it one way, it's racist
interpreting it another way, it isn't
that's what confuses me so much about these videos because the philosophy they rely on for this kind of analysis to make sense necessitates that nothing has an objective meaning, but they're always about finding the "true" meaning of shit and the "messages" hidden in media
Back in ye olde days of childhood we would call it "not judging a book by it's cover".
[QUOTE=RaptorJGW;51028584]If you watched the video you would know that can't be clearly said. It's still making statements on real life racism with real world examples though. Those examples have been lumped together though. It's not entirely coherent that you could say "Predators are white/black people".[/QUOTE]
So it portrays issues of racism and prejudice analogous to real world issues of racism and prejudice [I]without trying to be analogous to real world [B]races[/B] and racism then[/I]?
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;51028486]maybe zootopia, like all stories, is open to interpretation, and you can take whatever message away from it you want to[/QUOTE]
Not all stories are open for interpretation. They can have a specific message. That's not even uncommon.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028597]So it portrays issues of racism and prejudice analogous to real world issues of racism and prejudice [I]without trying to be analogous to real world [B]races[/B] and racism then[/I]?[/QUOTE]
It's not 1:1, yeh.
Is it just me or are some of these Wisecrack titles starting to become on the same shit-tier ideas as GameTheory.
[QUOTE=RaptorJGW;51028661]It's not 1:1, yeh.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, that's what I was getting at with the post that you disagreed with.
Individual issues are supposed to be analogous but races and race relations are not.
[QUOTE=RaptorJGW;51028571]It clearly does and has numerous scenes that draw a connection to specific real world things.
-"It's okay when a bunny calls another bunny (...) it's weird when a non-bunny calls a bunny (...)"
-"Token bunny"
-Some animals being treated like in the Apartheid because some businesses won't serve them (the ice cream scene)
[editline]a[/editline]
The message could be solely about prejudice in general, but it is taking things from real world races and racism.[/QUOTE]
The movie uses a mismatch of themes on purpose, because it is not about one specific form of prejudice, but it has a overarching message that prejudice and discrimination is bad. There's really no way to call it racist using our real world view of it unless you're very overly sensitive.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028530]it's not trying to create analogous situation to real world races and racism.[/QUOTE]
what? of course it is
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;51028870]what? of course it is[/QUOTE]
Lets do it again then.
Which real life races are represented by who in the movie?
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028913]Lets do it again then.
Which real life races are represented by who in the movie?[/QUOTE]
[quote=Analogous]
a·nal·o·gous
adjective
comparable in certain respects, typically in a way that makes clearer the nature of the things compared.
"they saw the relationship between a ruler and his subjects as analogous to that of father and children"[/quote]
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;51028932]semantics game[/QUOTE]
Which real life races are [I]comparable in certain respects[/I] to who in the movie?
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028954]Which real life races are [I]comparable in certain respects[/I] to who in the movie?[/QUOTE]
Racism is an idea that one race can be superior to another.
It is not making allusions to concrete races as they exist in our world. It is making up different types of animals as being different races. It's taking the idea, not the concrete application.
It's similar as the previous Deus Ex games and their sci-fi dystopian setting illustrating class warfare. We don't have augmented superpeople in our world, but the idea still applies and the moral is the same.
[QUOTE=Drury;51029008]Racism is an idea that one race can be superior to another.
It is [U]not making allusions to concrete races as they exist in our world[/U]. It is making up different types of animals as being different races. It's taking the idea, not the concrete application.
It's similar as the previous Deus Ex games and their sci-fi dystopian setting illustrating class warfare. We don't have augmented superpeople in our world, but the idea still applies and the moral is the same.[/QUOTE]
That is the exact point I'm making here so I don't know what exactly are you disagreeing with here.
But Zukriuchen rated dumb my post that specifically said: [I]Individual issues are supposed to be analogous but races and race relations are not.
[/I]So I take it that he is trying to say that the movie [U]is[/U] making allusions to concrete races as they exist in our world. And I'm trying to make him tell me what analogy he's talking about exactly but instead he's going to shitpost dictionary definitions.
Being about racism doesn't equal being racist, same with sexism Miss Sarkeesian...
I love when people want to see hard 1:1 comparisons over complex ideals, [i]especially[/i] when the moral of the topic is literally that not everything is as black and white as it seems on the surface
The sheep is clearly an analog for the Jews who control our government
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;51028954]Which real life races are [I]comparable in certain respects[/I] to who in the movie?[/QUOTE]
analogous doesn't mean 'exactly the same' or else an analogy would just be called an explanation
[QUOTE=Jmir 54;51029059]The sheep is clearly an analog for the Jews who control our government[/QUOTE]
wait a second
[t]http://i.imgur.com/IdpKHDX.jpg[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/XxAiXiz.jpg[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/it5LqVt.png[/t]
follow the money
let's investigate the sheep
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNv0AoWLMKY[/media]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/ISNkgdy.png[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/vmo1vL6.png[/t]
[url=http://wikipunch.com/Doug][img]http://i.imgur.com/pK5ClkH.png[/img][/url]
dougtopia confirmed
Here's a really good video about Zootopia and the whole anti-racism message it's pushing, as well as why it doesn't work as a way to preach.
[video=youtube;Ii7q2IZXM2Q]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ii7q2IZXM2Q[/video]
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