• President Putin has confirmed the Russian military's participation in the Syrian civil war on behalf
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[quote]Russia is providing “serious” training and logistical support to the Syrian army, Vladimir Putin has said, in the first public confirmation of the depth of Russia’s involvement in Syria's civil war. Commenting on reports that Russian combat troops have been deployed to Syria, the Russian president said [B]discussion of direct military intervention is “so far premature,” but did not rule out that such a step could be taken in future.[/B] “To say we're ready to do this today — so far it's premature to talk about this. [B]But we are already giving Syria quite serious help with equipment and training soldiers, with our weapons,”[/B] the state-owned RIA Novosti news agency quoted Mr Putin as saying when asked about Russian intervention in Syria during an economic forum in Vladivostok. "We really want to create some kind of an international coalition to fight terrorism and extremism," Mr Putin said. "To this end, we hold consultations with our American partners — I have personally spoken on the issue with US President Obama." [B]Russia has repeatedly used its UN Security Council veto to support Bashar Assad throughout the four-and-a-half-year-long war[/B], which is believed to have claimed some 250,000 lives. Russia has also been a long-term supplier of arms to the Syrian government, something it now justifies by the need to fight Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil). [B]Speculation is growing that Russia has significantly expanded its involvement in recent months, including with deliveries of advanced weaponry, a raft of spare parts for existing machines, and the deployment of increasing numbers of military advisers and instructors.[/B] Last week [B]Syrian state television released images showing an advanced Russian-built armoured personnel carrier, the BTR-82a, in combat.[/B] Videos have also appeared in which troops engaged in combat appear to shout instructions to one another in Russian. Last week the Israeli daily Yedioth Ahronoth cited western diplomatic [B]sources saying that Russia was on the verge of deploying “thousands” of troops to Syria to establish an airbase[/B] from which the Russian air force would fly combat sorties against Isis. Russian analysts called the Yedioth report far-fetched, pointing to Russian wariness of repeating the American experience in Iraq and the current strain on the Russian military from a covert war in Ukraine . [img]http://static4.businessinsider.com/image/55ea4fba9dd7cc24008b86cb-1280-1094/screen%20shot%202015-09-04%20at%207.10.31%20pm%20(2)%20copy.png[/img][/quote] [url]http://www.businessinsider.com/putin-is-upping-military-intervention-in-syria-2015-9?utm_content=buffer5eb5d&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer[/url]
If they're ramping up involvement to take on ISIS I'm honestly not all that surprised seeing as most Islamist Chechens are starting to align themselves with ISIS now rather than Al Qaeda. I say let them at it, Spetsnaz are going to shit fury all over ISIS the likes of which they've never seen.
[QUOTE=Taepodong-2;48624600]If they're ramping up involvement to take on ISIS I'm honestly not all that surprised seeing as most Islamist Chechens are starting to align themselves with ISIS now rather than Al Qaeda. I say let them at it, Spetsnaz are going to shit fury all over ISIS the likes of which they've never seen.[/QUOTE] Only issue with this is, in the long run, these same Russian forces and hardware will be turned onto the FSA and the Kurdish forces. It's a double-edged sword here. Though it's likely the FSA will collapse without the help of the Russians anyway.
FSA are going to get destroyed either way, this will just accelerate that. Once they're gone ISIS will get sandwiched by an unlikely and informal coalition between east and west it seems. Very interesting developments.
Well, seems it's not just Ukraine we're involved in.
[QUOTE=gudman;48625287]Well, seems it's not just Ukraine we're involved in.[/QUOTE] Gotta save those Chechen minorities which somehow got within the ISIS. From themselves.
[QUOTE=gudman;48625287]Well, seems it's not just Ukraine we're involved in.[/QUOTE] Your government has been helping Assad since the beginning of the civil war, it just seems that now they're seriously increasing military aid for him.
This is excellent news.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;48626265]Your government has been helping Assad since the beginning of the civil war, it just seems that now they're seriously increasing military aid for him.[/QUOTE] Yeah I meant sort of more direct involvement, with military advisers and stuff.
Honestly, this is a really good thing. Syrian troops are running out of supplies and are doing quite poorly when it comes to ISIS.
The Government forces have actually been losing considerably to both FSA and IS, with losses on more or less all fronts. This is more of a balancing act to ensure that the government prolongs its life a bit longer. And to prolong the war, too.
[QUOTE=Conscript;48626294]This is excellent news.[/QUOTE] Yeah, liberal government must be resisted at all costs! (Including gas attacks and death camps)
[QUOTE=Explosions;48626623]Yeah, liberal government must be resisted at all costs! (Including gas attacks and death camps)[/QUOTE] Well what do you expect from the person who kisses Russia's ass unconditionally, past and present. In this situation whoever wins, everyone loses.
[QUOTE=N-12_Aden;48626644]In this situation whoever wins, everyone loses.[/QUOTE] That's pretty much war in a nutshell.
[QUOTE=Explosions;48626623]Yeah, liberal government must be resisted at all costs! (Including gas attacks and death camps)[/QUOTE] Same liberal government as in Libya? Not saying Assad is anything but a war criminal, but none of the sides has demonstrated any kind of civilized behaviour, there's no reason to believe that FSA and others are much better, hell, they only broke up with ISIS because they invaded a neutral country. Same militia as in Libya, different flag.
Assad is a war criminal, but the opposition isn't any better in many ways. The FSA doesn't mind Islamists, even though the Islamists literally want the opposite of a Secular Liberal country... The regime uses gas, as does ISIS and I think even the FSA has. While this Civil War started because Assad began bombing his own people who did want to make a liberal country, I sometimes wonder if that is even a goal anymore, and even if it is, if that's possible. Look at the massive fuck up Libya currently is. It will take at least a decade for that country to get back on its knees. Syria is a clusterfuck with no end in sight, etc.
[QUOTE=Conscript;48626294]This is excellent news.[/QUOTE] For someone who thinks calling cops "pigs" is okay because they are "state thugs" you sure do love supporting governments who slaughter their own people because they are protesting. [editline]6th September 2015[/editline] Who was that poster that had friedrich nietzsche as his avatar? Was that you?
This reeks of Afghanistan in the '80s.. and we all know how that turned out.
[QUOTE=gudman;48627019]Same liberal government as in Libya? Not saying Assad is anything but a war criminal, but none of the sides has demonstrated any kind of civilized behaviour, there's no reason to believe that FSA and others are much better, hell, they only broke up with ISIS because they invaded a neutral country. Same militia as in Libya, different flag.[/QUOTE]Yeah, the FSA either has stupid or weak leadership to have let the religious nuts gain traction as legitimate factions. Then when the FSA turned on them they weren't decisive and didn't completely crush them entirely which more or less caused ISIS to kick it into overdrive. I think it was only a few months before they invaded Iraq, and then not long after that the unspoken agreement with the Kurds was broken (I think by the Kurds who were sick of ISIS fucking with them and also sick of them being murderous shitheads) and that's when things got really intense with four major factions in Syria fighting it out.
[QUOTE=Explosions;48626623]Yeah, liberal government must be resisted at all costs! (Including gas attacks and death camps)[/QUOTE] ISIS doesn't qualify as "liberal government" no matter how you look at it
[QUOTE=Laserbeams;48627269]ISIS doesn't qualify as "liberal government" no matter how you look at it[/QUOTE]ISIS =/= FSA [editline]6th September 2015[/editline] stop barking at me you little shit get off that leaf
Every single dictatorship we've toppled in the middle east to put a democratic government in its place ended so well, i mean, iraq and libya are great examples
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48627336]ISIS =/= FSA[/QUOTE] The FSA will not win this, and I really doubt that it would be a "liberal government" if it won.
[QUOTE=Laserbeams;48627500]The FSA will not win this, and I really doubt that it would be a "liberal government" if it won.[/QUOTE]Well them winning isn't really relevant, Explosions was talking about the FSA when that comment was made and if they did somehow win the government would be a hell of a lot more tolerable than Assad's government. I have Kurdish friends who tell me some pretty fucked up stuff they had to endure and the really scary part is they act like it's not a big deal.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48627682] I have Kurdish friends who tell me some pretty fucked up stuff they had to endure and the really scary part is they act like it's not a big deal.[/QUOTE] It's always like that. People get used to anything no matter how bad it is. I remember my father's friend telling stories about the first chechen war which were scary as shit, but he was talking like it was some pretty usual stuff. Crazy things become normal to people if they get into extreme conditions, and the worst part is that they often continue to threat them as normal even if their environment changes for the best.
Even though Russia's involvement with the Ukraine Crisis catastrophe I completely agree with Russia doing this, since Syria needs it more than ever to take down ISIS.
A small update: Secretary of State Kerry has said the US is "concerned" with Russian build up in Syria [quote]John Kerry, the US secretary of state, has expressed US concern over reports of Russia's enhanced military build-up in Syria in a telephone call with his Russian counterpart, according to the US state department. The phone call came a day after media reports quoted US officials as describing an increase in Russian military activity in Syria, expanding the country's support for Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. "The secretary made clear that if such reports were accurate, these actions could further escalate the conflict, lead to greater loss of innocent life, increase refugee flows and risk confrontation with the anti-ISIL coalition operating in Syria," the state department said on Saturday, referring to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant. It said Kerry and Sergey Lavrov, the Russian foreign minister, agreed that discussions on the Syrian conflict would continue this month in New York, where the UN General Assembly meets. Quoting unidentified Obama administration officials, the New York Times said Russia has dispatched a military advance team to Syria and has sent prefabricated housing units for hundreds of people to a Syrian airfield and delivered a portable air traffic control station there.[/quote] [url]http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/09/questions-russia-moves-syria-150906031701354.html[/url]
[QUOTE=antianan;48628852]It's always like that. People get used to anything no matter how bad it is. I remember my father's friend telling stories about the first chechen war which were scary as shit, but he was talking like it was some pretty usual stuff. Crazy things become normal to people if they get into extreme conditions, and the worst part is that they often continue to threat them as normal even if their environment changes for the best.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I know, but it's still kind of disheartening to hear people go "yeah well Assad really wasn't that bad like what did he do wrong anyway???" and I just have to slowly blink in astonishment. What I'm wondering is if your country will challenge my country's influence in the Middle East using this as a starting point. Back Assad, push ISIS out, crush the FSA, maybe cut a deal with the Kurds and let them keep their own territory, and then maybe court other countries in the region. I'm sure you guys want to sell off your old hardware as the Armata comes into production.
Jihadists outnumber moderate rebels in Syria and the FSA has been mostly depleted to hard-line moderates while the bulk of their fighting force either rejoined the Syrian Arab Army or joined the Islamic State. So really there is no FSA and it's pretty dumb to think that if Assad goes down they'll take power instead of the innumerable jihadist groups infesting Syria, or worse yet the Islamic State who can most surely steamroll all these groups once Assad goes down and the SAA is no longer fighting. So really you've got a binary choice of who takes power - The Ba'athist dictator who had a lot of people killed and disappearified, but continues to be the only person protecting the Christian minorities of Damascus and the Alawites from whom he draws his support (these groups will surely be cleansed from the Earth if the Islamic State takes hold as anybody who is capable of escaping Syria has already done so.) -Or the Islamic State. There is really no other outcome to this. Syria dies with Assad. I mean I know it sounds harsh but realistically that's it :v: No developed country is going to full-scale send their military into a country like that to just 'retake control' for whoever they want to be leader. The cards will fall where they may.
As long as ISIS doesn't win there is hope for Syria. While Assad is a dictator he is still lesser evil than ISIS. Helping FSA now is already too late in my opinion, if someone wants FSA to win they should have helped them way earlier into the civil war. Prior to ISIS rise, now they are too small of an force to win both isis and government forces.
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