The ACCC’s specific demands Australian Stream - Polidicks

Providing that the ACCC wins the legal battle, this is what Valve will be asked to provide for Australian users [quote]The ACCC is asking that Valve: -Provide an email address that specifically deals with refunds as per Australian Consumer law. -Provide a 1800 number to help consumers address any refund issues. -Provide a PO Box address for consumers to deal with refunds. -Appoint representatives (the ACCC refer to this person as a contact officer) to reply to consumers regarding refunds. [/quote] Valve will also have 30 days to implement these changes. The first court hearing is scheduled for the 7th of October Source: [URL="http://games.on.net/2014/09/the-acccs-specific-demands-for-australian-valve-customers/"]games.on.net[/URL]

Your title is awful, you know that, right?

At the moment, it's an unlosable case for the ACCC. Valve are unlikely to have representation, as they're not contesting this. Only thing is, any judgement in ACCC's favor is completely unenforcable, as Valve are an American company with no entity in Australia.

And then suddenly Valve decide to not do business with Australia anymore.

[QUOTE=DogGunn;45888709]At the moment, it's an unlosable case for the ACCC. Valve are unlikely to have representation, as they're not contesting this. Only thing is, any judgement in ACCC's favor is completely unenforcable, as Valve are an American company with no entity in Australia.[/QUOTE] They're carrying on business here, so the ACCC is certainly able to enforce this.

[QUOTE=Bradyns;45888806]They're carrying on business here, so the ACCC is certainly able to enforce this.[/QUOTE] I disagree. Given the plain meaning of doing business, I would suggest there needs to be some sort of physical presence in Australia. It'll be an issue in contention if Valve do contest the matter - but they likely won't.

I wonder if this'll set some sort of precedent for any legal action in the EU.

[QUOTE=Bradyns;45888806]They're carrying on business here, so the ACCC is certainly able to enforce this.[/QUOTE] How so? It's not like ACCC or an Australian court can just rip money out of Valve's pockets. Sure, maybe they could start blocking Australian transactions to Steam, but that'd probably piss off consumers more than Valve's refund policy. Outside of that there's really no sanction they can enforce on Valve.

[QUOTE]-Provide a 1800 number to help consumers address any refund issues.[/QUOTE] Don't know how this'll go down, like actual steam representatives on the phone? Or it just dials straight into the department that deals with steam at valve HQ "Fuck it's those Australians again"

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;45888970]Don't know how this'll go down, like actual steam representatives on the phone? Or it just dials straight into the department that deals with steam at valve HQ "Fuck it's those Australians again"[/QUOTE] They could make it redirect to centrelink. It's not like they can leave the building after each work day and start caring about people.

[QUOTE=DemonElite;45888842]How so? It's not like ACCC or an Australian court can just rip money out of Valve's pockets. Sure, maybe they could start blocking Australian transactions to Steam, but that'd probably piss off consumers more than Valve's refund policy. Outside of that there's really no sanction they can enforce on Valve.[/QUOTE] If Valve ignores a court order and ignores Australian Consumer Law, they are only damaging their own reputation with other entities across the world. Eg 'look how reckless this company is choosing which laws it wants to follow with the nations it does business with, how can we trust giving this company a loan if we can't trust them to follow laws'. [editline]5th September 2014[/editline] Valve's no-refund policy is bullshit anyways.

Easiest out for valve is to not offer sales to anyone living in Australia.... There's no real way for them to forbid Aussies from purchasing so will rake in that cash regardless. What's prolly going to happen is that they will eventually minimumly comply- and use that as an excuse to charge more. So congratulations, your games will soon cost even more.

I'm awaiting to what steam store v6 will bring (other that blue interface) The inclusion of other currencies is confirmed, so it will hopefully be more than what we're expecting

[QUOTE=markg06;45888836]I wonder if this'll set some sort of precedent for any legal action in the EU.[/QUOTE] Why would it, VALVe already have an EU subsidiary that deals with everything here and is subject to EU law. Its why we (as in people in the UK and maybe other countries?) can return steam games with very little hassle. If anything, that was the precedent for this case.

[QUOTE=H8Entitlement;45889692]What's prolly going to happen is that they will eventually minimumly comply- and use that as an excuse to charge more. So congratulations, your games will soon cost even more.[/QUOTE] Publishers set the prices, not Valve.

[QUOTE=LuaChobo;45892828]yeah and then aus govt will come back and ask "why are you charging more" the reply "you made us offer refunds" will pretty much fuck valve and steam up hard[/QUOTE] Nah, the government will ask why prices are so different, Valve will say "Because they are", and that would be the end of it. Adobe claimed the reason why it was cheaper to fly to the USA, buy a copy of Photoshop in a store and fly back, was because they needed the extra money to offer a "personalised experience" via their website.

[QUOTE=TheDecryptor;45895749]Nah, the government will ask why prices are so different, Valve will say "Because they are", and that would be the end of it. Adobe claimed the reason why it was cheaper to fly to the USA, buy a copy of Photoshop in a store and fly back, was because they needed the extra money to offer a "personalised experience" via their website.[/QUOTE] The courts aren't dumb and won't accept that excuse. Besides I thought the courts ruled Adobe was ripping off Australians and needed to lower the price

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;45895777]The courts aren't dumb and won't accept that excuse. Besides I thought the courts ruled Adobe was ripping off Australians and needed to lower the price[/QUOTE] Courts won't accept what? They have no power to set the prices that companies are charging. And you're thinking of the Parliamentary inquiry? Doesn't do anything.

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;45895777]The courts aren't dumb and won't accept that excuse. Besides I thought the courts ruled Adobe was ripping off Australians and needed to lower the price[/QUOTE] Except as pointed out valve doesn't actually set any of the prices, those are at publisher discression with regional taxes and valves cut/markup I'm not sure which it is, but valve only sets the amount they take from each title [editline]5th September 2014[/editline] The funny thing is they are already able to refund stuff and revoke licenses, and keep track of how long you've owned a game, they just dont have these things hooked into a doodad saying you can refund till x date

I'm pretty sure that Australia has a law that allows refunds within a resonable amount of time, you just can't claim a refund for something that you've had for a stupidly long time.

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;45895777]The courts aren't dumb and won't accept that excuse. Besides I thought the courts ruled Adobe was ripping off Australians and needed to lower the price[/QUOTE] Nah, never went before the courts, and the courts don't really have that kind of power. They lowered the price of the cloud subscriptions, but that was it.