'Yes We Scan' - Germans protest at Checkpoint Charlie as Obama arrives in Berlin
47 replies, posted
[QUOTE=The Atlantic]
President Obama landed in Berlin Tuesday evening for his first official visit to the German capital, but his reception in the privacy-loving nation might have been warmer if not for the recent revelations about the National Security Agency's surveillance programs.
A few dozen demonstrators gathered at Checkpoint Charlie, the Berlin Wall crossing that became a historic symbol of Cold War tensions. Wielding signs reading "Yes We Scan" and "Privacy Ends Here," the [URL="http://en.europeonline-magazine.eu/lead-berlin-protesters-denounce-us-surveillance-before-obama-visiteds-releads-with-demo-epa-photos_286529.html"]group told reporters[/URL] that they see widespread data collection as a human rights violation.
Here are a few of the images from the demonstration, via [URL="https://secure.flickr.com/photos/digitalegesellschaft/"]Digitale Gesellschaft[/URL], a German advocacy group:
[IMG]http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/international/berlin1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/international/berlin3.jpg[/IMG]The protest was small, but it speaks to larger rifts over privacy between the U.S. and Germany, where memories of the Stasi still linger. It's estimated that [URL="http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2013/06/13/secret_police_state?page=full"]one in every seven[/URL] East Germans was once a Stasi informer, and the secret police monitored almost every form of communication there in an attempt to root out anti-Communist sentiment. Germans seem repulsed by anything that even resembles that level of surveillance, and in the past they've gone to great lengths in order to force [URL="http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2011/12/germanys-war-with-facebook-and-google-over-privacy/248914/"]Internet companies[/URL] to protect user data.
When the NSA story broke, German Chancellor Angela Merkel promised to raise the issue with Obama, and the country's justice minister [URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/06/11/cnews-us-usa-security-germany-idCABRE95A0T820130611"]wrote in an op-ed[/URL] that said, "The more a society monitors, controls and observes its citizens, the less free it is."
But it will be interesting to see if Obama's historic popularity in Germany, the close U.S.-German relationship, and the NSA's [URL="http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06/18/nsa-chief-defends-surveillance-says-helped-prevent-terror-more-than-50-times/"]recent claims[/URL] that its spying program prevented more than 50 terrorist plots since 2011 will make a difference in Germans' current anti-Obama sentiment.
On Monday, Bloomberg reported that Merkel herself had softened her stance toward PRISM on the eve of Obama's arrival in Berlin.
"It did surprise me to a certain extent, though on the other hand we recognize that the United States has taken up the fight against terrorism," [URL="http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-17/merkel-softens-criticism-of-u-s-spy-programs-before-obama-visit.html"]Merkel said[/URL] in an interview.
In fact, [URL="http://en.europeonline-magazine.eu/germany-to-spend-millions-to-expand-internet-surveillance—-report_286245.html"]Der Spiegel magazine recently reported [/URL]that Germany's own intelligence agency is expanding Internet surveillance with a $133 million program.
"With the new capabilities, the BND wants to ensure that cross-border traffic can be monitored as comprehensively as possible, just as is done in the United States by the National Security Agency," a [URL="http://en.europeonline-magazine.eu/germany-to-spend-millions-to-expand-internet-surveillance---report_286245.html"]German press agency[/URL] reported.
What's the German equivalent of "Yes We Scan" -- [I]Ich bin ein [/I]data miner? [/QUOTE]
Thank you Based Germany
"All your data [B]are[/B] belong to us."
Not is.
This is embarrassing that other countries protest more than us over NSA.
[QUOTE=Wiggles;41101494]"All your data [B]are[/B] belong to us."
Not is.[/QUOTE]
More like, "All your data are belong to U.S."
Im going to protest in my states capitol on July 4th. I would love to get signs like this
Hey, look. McDonalds.
[QUOTE=HkSniper;41101616]Hey, look. McDonalds.[/QUOTE]
Yes we have these too.
[QUOTE=DrTaxi;41101835][img]https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3819/9076855346_ed448b2c2e.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
Of course the american sector has a Mc. Donald's in it
[QUOTE=breakyourfac;41101595]Im going to protest in my states capitol on July 4th. I would love to get signs like this[/QUOTE]
Are you subscribed to /r/restorethefourth by chance?
[QUOTE=RocketSnail;41102187]Are you subscribed to /r/restorethefourth by chance?[/QUOTE]
No my friend who was very involved with the Occupy movement told me about this. It will be my first protest and any info sites about this would be greatly appreciated.
Yes we Scan protests in North America.
GO
I mean, I support Obama predominantly, through his gun control efforts, and social ideals, I'm usually behind the guy.
But overall, I still can't bring myself to feel sorry for him in this situation. He kind of brought this upon himself with the whole NSA data sharing scandal.
He fucked up.
Woo Germany. Good on you guys.
[editline]20th June 2013[/editline]
And the worst part is, this time he wasn't just invading the privacy of his own country's citizens, he was invading privacy on an international scale.
So I suppose Germany has every right-and maybe a bit more-to be pissed of. God knows I am.
[QUOTE=CAPT Opp4;41110916]I mean, I support Obama predominantly, through his gun control efforts, and social ideals, I'm usually behind the guy.
But overall, I still can't bring myself to feel sorry for him in this situation. He kind of brought this upon himself with the whole NSA data sharing scandal.
He fucked up.
Woo Germany. Good on you guys.
[editline]20th June 2013[/editline]
And the worst part is, this time he wasn't just invading the privacy of his own countries citizens, he was invading privacy on a national scale.
So I suppose Germany has every right-and maybe a bit more-to be pissed of. God knows I am.[/QUOTE]
I believe he had good intentions when campaigning for the presidency but once he became president his priorities changed drastically. He just became another politician in a sea of them. It's also understandable why he changed given that he probably learned many things that he never was told in his days during Congress which would easily influence his earlier promises.
[QUOTE=Amez;41110996]I believe he had good intentions when campaigning for the presidency but once he became president his priorities changed drastically. He just became another politician in a sea of them. It's also understandable why he changed given that he probably learned many things that he never was told in his days during Congress which would easily influence his earlier promises.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I suppose. He seemed noble, at first. And I believe his intentions legitimately were so. But then again, every politician fucks up badly at one point, and this was his occasion.
"The protest was small, but it speaks to larger rifts over privacy between the U.S. and Germany, where memories of the Stasi still linger. It's estimated that one in every seven East Germans was once a Stasi informer, and the secret police monitored almost every form of communication there in an attempt to root out anti-Communist sentiment. Germans seem repulsed by anything that even resembles that level of surveillance, and in the past they've gone to great lengths in order to force Internet companies to protect user data."
That truly puts their motivations for the fight against the NSA surveillance in perspective. The Stasi were one of the most hideously effective secret police forces in the history of the world. Conspiracy theories they seeded ([url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Infektion]America creating AIDS[/url], for example) still linger to this day, like landmines from a long gone war.
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;41111269]Conspiracy theories they seeded ([url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Infektion]America creating AIDS[/url], for example) still linger to this day, like landmines from a long gone war.[/QUOTE]
I live in the eastern part of germany, and even I never heard of this. So this is not true. Don't try to spread misinformation like the propaganda machines of the superpowers did and still do. (it makes us germans growing up in the eastern part look dumb, very very dumb.)
[QUOTE=SuddenImpact;41111568]I live in the eastern part of germany, and even I never heard of this. So this is not true. Don't try to spread misinformation like the propaganda machines of the superpowers did and still do. (it makes us germans growing up in the eastern part look dumb, very very dumb.)[/QUOTE]I didn't say the Germans still believe it, but it's a surprisingly common belief in the US.
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;41111583]I didn't say the Germans still believe it, but it's a surprisingly common belief in the US.[/QUOTE]
But Stasi was the national security of the eastern part of germany in the cold war, and they were not allowed to just travel to america back then. And they surely didn't have enough money working in piss poor eastern germany to just suddenly jump to america when the wall came down.
[QUOTE=SuddenImpact;41111618]But Stasi was the national security of the eastern part of germany in the cold war, and they were not allowed to just travel to america back then. And they surely didn't have enough money working in piss poor eastern germany to just suddenly jump to america when the wall came down.[/QUOTE]They didn't have to travel to America and plant the idea like a flag in the soil, it was a propaganda and disinformation campaign of the sort engaged in commonly by intelligence services on both sides of the Cold War.
EDIT: Should've clarified, the Stasi had an assisting role in that particular operation. Was probably a bad example to pick, especially considering the wiki source is a single book.
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;41111637]Just read the bloody wiki page. They didn't have to travel to America and plant the idea like a flag in the soil, it was a propaganda and disinformation campaign of the sort engaged in commonly by intelligence services on both sides of the Cold War.[/QUOTE]
If you would have read it, you would know that it was the KGB and not the Stasi who seeded these lies.
[QUOTE=meppers;41101971]Of course the american sector has a Mc. Donald's in it[/QUOTE]
the only mcdonalds ive been in that had a mcRib sandwich. they dont do them over here i dont think :(
Why would you protest? You ain't even got video games
[QUOTE=Amiga OS;41111736]Lmao, like any American would care enough to get off their ass and do something about this.[/QUOTE]
I'm an American and as much as I would like to do something my ass is firmly stuck to my seat.
No one had a "Yes We Drone" sign?
these nazis don't know real freedom dont listen to them
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Dumb reply" - SteveUK))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Bobsters34;41112096]these nazis don't know real freedom dont listen to them[/QUOTE]
They know oppression though.
[QUOTE=breakyourfac;41101595]Im going to protest in my states capitol on July 4th. I would love to get signs like this[/QUOTE]
Yes yes YES. It doesn't matter if you are going to be in the minority you have to at least TRY.
[QUOTE=Bobsters34;41112096]these nazis don't know real freedom dont listen to them[/QUOTE]
Oh yeah, look at me, all germans are nazis, i am so funny and clever, haha
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