A Guide to Ending "Gamers" - "Fun is a neurological trick."
182 replies, posted
This week on I Can't Believe It's Not [URL="http://www.p4rgaming.com/"]P4RGaming,[/URL] some self-congratulatory hogwash
[QUOTE]As such, I’d like to postpone our back-patting and think about solutions for bringing this change about sooner than later, as I think that ending the regular harassment of women in games is better achieved today than tomorrow.
We can’t just Twitter-block the problem away. Even a video series critical of the medium is only a partial solution. Games culture needs to change at a grassroots level, and each of us have a part to play in that revolution if we want it to happen. It’s not only the worst of us who need to change. None of us are outside of this system. None of us are completely above its effects. None of us are entirely innocent. We all need to work to make our role in games culture more positive (which absolutely does not mean “less critical”).
So here are some preliminary tactics I propose for transforming games (feel free to propose your own in the comments, and offer revisions to mine):[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][B]We maintain a critical eye towards the e-sports scene and its accompanying machismo.[/B] We’ve been trying to make careers out of playing what seem like the videogame equivalents of American football (MOBAs) and mixed martial arts (fighting games), in a warped attempt at gaining legitimacy for our pastime.
[B]We stop upholding “fun” as the universal, ultimate criterion for a game’s relevance.[/B] It’s a meaningless ideal at best and a poisonous priority at worst. Fun is a neurological trick. Plenty of categorically unhealthy things are “fun”. Let’s try for something more. Many of the alternatives will have similarly fuzzy definitions, but let’s aspire to qualities like “edifying”, “healing”, “pro-social”, or even “enlightening”. [/QUOTE]
[url]http://gamasutra.com/blogs/DevinWilson/20140828/224450/A_Guide_to_Ending_quotGamersquot.php[/url]
While not actually being written by a [I]Professional Games Journalist[/I], this is a post that someone who works for Gamasutra thought was worthy of featuring.
Should probably use [url=http://www.donotlink.com/bdxd]this link[/url] so you don't contribute to their traffic for clicking this shit.
Someone made a blog post.
snip didn't read the OP
Dont bring your politics into my video games.
Well, I mean, fun is just a buzzword after all.
[quote]None of us are entirely innocent.[/quote]
Projecting pretty hard here aren't we?
Now that's what I call bullshit Volume 5.
[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;45856550]Dont bring your politics into my video games.[/QUOTE]
why not
My hobbies are my hobbies because they are fun
Activities that aren't fun won't become my hobbies
And since I'm 100% sure that the video games I play, I play as a hobby, I can thus conclude that those video games are fun.
If he wan'ts people to stop using fun as a descriptor of an engaging hobby that yields pleasure, then why don't we rate games in volume of dopamine released in ml/hr.
Oh wait, that would be impractical to measure, and would vary across people just like every other subjective experience. So unless he has a better method of objectively rating a subjective experience, people will continue to argue that something was fun as a reason to try something
[QUOTE=Karmah;45856612]My hobbies are my hobbies because they are fun
Activities that aren't fun won't become my hobbies
And since I'm 100% sure that the video games I play, I play as a hobby, I can thus conclude that those video games are fun.
Wow all it took was 3 sentences to debunk that blog post[/QUOTE]
Writing a bunch of pointless bullshit isn't fun either but you seem to have a knack for it.
[sp]I'm kidding though you're right.[/sp]
[QUOTE=Karmah;45856612]My hobbies are my hobbies because they are fun
Activities that aren't fun won't become my hobbies
And since I'm 100% sure that the video games I play, I play as a hobby, I can thus conclude that those video games are fun.
Wow all it took was 3 sentences to debunk that blog post[/QUOTE]
I've watched films which I would not describe as being "fun" films but which I have still enjoyed immensely. If you want to exclusively play fun video games that is fine but isn't there room under the sun for other sorts of games as well?
Why are video games like video games? I don't like video games!
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;45856653]I've watched films which I would not describe as being "fun" films but which I have still enjoyed immensely. If you want to exclusively play fun video games that is fine but isn't there room under the sun for other sorts of games as well?[/QUOTE]
Fun is a subjective experience
One can have fun experiencing an adrenaline rush, while another can have fun relaxing, and another can have fun doing dangerous things
All 3 involve different neurotransmitters which utilized under the right circumstances can invoke pleasure
So you can see how calling something fun is better than saying "Aw man, that game really upped my serotonin, noradrenaline and dopamine levels during those fight scenes."
That was my point.
Why does spaghetti need noodles? Italians are so done, we no longer need noodles in order to have spaghetti.
Just give us sauce, okay?
[QUOTE=Karmah;45856682]Fun is a subjective experience
One can have fun experiencing an adrenaline rush, while another can have fun relaxing, and another can have fun doing dangerous things
All 3 involve different neurotransmitters which utilized under the right circumstances can invoke pleasure
So you can see how calling something fun is better than saying "Aw man, that movie really upped my serotonin and dopamine levels"
That was my point.[/QUOTE]
A movie can be good without being exciting or relaxing or whatever. What about The Road?
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;45856653]I've watched films which I would not describe as being "fun" films but which I have still enjoyed immensely. If you want to exclusively play fun video games that is fine but isn't there room under the sun for other sorts of games as well?[/QUOTE]
One of the problems is that you're so vague too, what is this "enjoyment" you got out of it? Fun is a vague term that simply means the stimulation and enjoyment out of a product. Hell this entire thing is just so vague in general.
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;45856607]why not[/QUOTE]
Why are you THE literal devil's advocate for everything awful and terrible ever on this forum.
[QUOTE=Qwerty Bastard;45856697]A movie can be good without being exciting or relaxing or whatever. What about The Road?[/QUOTE]
Of course there are more emotions than just pleasure, and different types of it
My debate is with the article, it has a moot point. Fun is a valid descriptor
I've often played with the idea that some of the more advanced paradigms of game technology could be applied in areas other than mental masturbation or finger twitching, but if you remove the fun from it, you will be limiting it to an academic environment as no one will buy that shit.
[QUOTE=doommarine23;45856698]One of the problems is that you're so vague too, what is this "enjoyment" you got out of it? Fun is a vague term that simply means the stimulation and enjoyment out of a product. Hell this entire thing is just so vague in general.[/QUOTE]
It's not hard to distinguish "fun" from just "enjoyment". "Fun" implies some level of excitement and liveliness and possibly an adrenaline rush.
games don't have to be fun but i would rather a majority of games be fun
[QUOTE=Karmah;45856732]I'm pretty sure the road falls under an exciting and the 'whatever' category you posted[/QUOTE]
uh...
every shitty news site and their psuedo blogger writers are trying to cash on "video games" now
rip.
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;45856736]games don't have to be fun but i would rather a majority of games be fun[/QUOTE]
That should only matter if you actually play a majority of games released and there aren't enough hours in the day.
[QUOTE=Mr. N;45856729]Why are you THE literal devil's advocate for everything awful and terrible ever on this forum.[/QUOTE]
I don't see what's so awful about asking why games should necessarily be apolitical? Plenty of great films (even some popular films) or books or paintings are highly political so I don't see why video games can't be as well.
I don't really see the point of this article anyway. Whats wrong with a game or movie or book just being fun? I'm not even going to entertain things like economics/business (how a product must appeal and related topics), I am simply going to argue on a level of art/culture.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with a game being nothing more than "mindless" fun, ala Doom/Quake. They do not need an "Artistic Meaning" to be meaningful. The fact that around 6-8 guys, our ages; got together and built something like they did; that it became a cultural icon, and bred several new concepts for gaming? That;s beautiful, the fact that those games brought so much fun and enjoyment to people around the world, communities formed, people inspired? That's fucking breath taking, I am in awe of the amazing things we can do when we work together, the communities that form and the art that gets created. Things like Doom are still outlets for people's artistic energy even to this day, and so many people share so many cool and creative, innovative and fun ideas, learning and growing together as people and as a community.
This article is nothing, it is rubbish, it is garbage, it is an insult to my very core as a person, someone who is truly intelligent will not need something to force feed them ideas; they will appreciate, respect, and find ideals within the things they cherish.
There is nothing wrong with a "mindless" game and nothing wrong about "intelligent" games either, but there is everything wrong with casting aside people's works and art as lesser simply because it does not appeal to your desires.
[editline]31st August 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;45856765]
I don't see what's so awful about asking why games should necessarily be apolitical? Plenty of great films (even some popular films) or books or paintings are highly political so I don't see why video games can't be as well.[/QUOTE]
There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with games being political or having opinions or messages in them, but there is EVERYTHING wrong with standing on a stone of pretension. (Not saying you are)
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;45856765]
I don't see what's so awful about asking why games should necessarily be apolitical? Plenty of great films (even some popular films) or books or paintings are highly political so I don't see why video games can't be as well.[/QUOTE]
I think they tend not to be for simplicity sake; so that the user doesn't have to think too hard
However I like games with a huge story because in some cases it allows for varying stories on multiple playthroughs, like The Witcher series for example, as it forces the player to make decisions
gaming as an actual art reached its peak when Deus Ex came out and it's all downhill from there so idgi
gaming as an actual competitive sport reached its peak with CPMA so still idgi
[QUOTE=wari65;45856854]gaming as an actual art reached its peak when Deus Ex came out and it's all downhill from there so idgi
gaming as an actual competitive sport reached its peak with CPMA so still idgi[/QUOTE]
Why does it need certain elements like a story or deep commentary to be art?
Spec Ops: The Line says, 'Why not both?'
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