[IMG]http://www.livemint.com/rf/Image-621x414/LiveMint/Period1/2014/03/03/Photos/Russia_troops--621x414.JPG[/IMG]
[QUOTE]SLOVYANSK, Ukraine — Amid fresh warnings from Russian President Vladimir Putin, pro-Russia separatist leaders of the so-called Donetsk People's Republic announced a mobilization of its forces in eastern Ukraine on Thursday in response to an anti-terrorist operation by Ukrainian authorities that has left five militants dead, Interfax Ukraine reports.
Ukraine's Interior Ministry said on its website that the militants were killed at a checkpoint in Slovyansk, which is held by forces loyal to Kiev. The Interior Ministry described the dead as "terrorists."
A spokeswoman for the Slovyansk insurgents, Stella Khorosheva, told the Associated Press she could confirm only that at least two pro-Russia fighters were killed during clashes.
The Interior Ministry has distributed leaflets in the city advising the local population to stay calm and not carry out the orders issued by self-proclaimed separatist authorities.
According to the ministry, the city's self-proclaimed mayor and local separatist leader, Vyacheslav Ponomaryov, has said those seen with the leaflet will be shot.
The push back by Ukraine's government against separatist strongholds in the Donetsk region comes in response to pro-Russia protesters and masked gunmen seizing government buildings and setting up checkpoints along roads 100 miles from the border with Russia.
Ukraine's State Security Service claimed Thursday it had recordings of phone conversations between separatists linking Ihor Strelkov, a Russian special forces officer who is wanted in Ukraine for allegedly leading the separatist riots in the east, to the murder of Volodymyr Rybak, a city council deputy found dead near Slovyansk on Saturday.
The new standoff has emerged despite an agreement signed last week between Russia and Ukraine to ease tensions in the region.
U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry said Thursday night that Russia continues to take "provocative actions" in Ukraine.
"Only one side — one country — is keeping its word," Kerry said in remarks at the State Department in Washington, D.C.
While Ukraine is acting in "good faith," Russia has "put its faith in distraction, deception, and destabilization," Kerry said.
Kerry stopped short of announcing new sanctions on Russia, but he and President Obama both indicated that day is rapidly approaching if Russia does not change tactics.
During his trip to Tokyo, Obama told reporters that "we have been preparing for the prospect that we're going to have to engage in further sanctions — those are teed up."
Kerry accused the Russian of fomenting anti-government violence in eastern Ukraine, and of seeking to disrupt elections set for next month.
"Nobody should doubt Russia's hand in this," Kerry said.
New sanctions would continue to damage Russia's economy, just as earlier ones have, Kerry said.
"The window to change course is closing," Kerry said.
Meanwhile, Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu has ordered several military units to start military exercises near Ukraine's border, according to Russia Today.
Putin's latest warnings, carried by Interfax, were delivered on Russian TV.
"If the Kiev government is using the army against its own people this is clearly a grave crime," Putin said. He noted that recent events in eastern Ukraine proved that Russia's decision to annex the Ukrainian region of Crimea was the correct one.
At a secessionist checkpoint on the road to Slovyansk on Thursday, 60-year-old Alexander Malinovsky was helping check cars on the main artery. Dressed in faded camouflage fatigues but carrying no weapon, he said the people here want peace and protection from Kiev which they accuse of aggression.
"We're not terrorists," he said. "We just want to live on our own land."
At a former livestock feed plant, members of a heavily armed militia manned a smoking barricade they said was attacked by Ukrainian forces earlier Thursday. Holding up a glossy photo of a dark-haired youth, Ponomaryov, the self-proclaimed people's mayor of Slovyansk, said the man had been killed and another wounded.
"Now get away from here," Ponomaryov warned reporters before hopping into a sedan with bodyguards. "You're disturbing us."
Some in the east said the Kiev government's reaction to the protests in the area that is heavily populated by ethnic Russians was hypocritical.
"I think this operation (by the Ukrainian army) is bad for civilians," said Tetiana Liubashenko, 21, who lives in Konstantinovka, a small city in the Donetsk region about 30 miles from Slovyansk, where Ukrainian police forces attacked pro-Russia protesters.
"When Kiev had its EuroMaidan protest, people from the east didn't go there to stop it," said Liubashenko, a student at a university in Slovyansk. "Now it looks like the rest of Ukraine can have democracy and freedom to decide its future — like they did at Maidan — but the east can't. It's wrong. I want to live in united Ukraine, but I think the east must be allowed to hold a referendum."
She was referring to protests in Kiev that ousted the pro-Russian government of then-president Viktor Yanukovych in February.
For some like Liubashenko the possibility of intervention by Russian troops is not a bad prospect.
"It won't do any good for anyone, but out of the possible bad scenarios, this may be the best one," Liubashenko said.
Speaking from Japan on Thursday, President Obama accused Moscow of failing to abide by the "spirit or the letter" of the agreement reached last week in Geneva. He also warned Moscow that the U.S. has more economic sanctions "teed up."[/QUOTE]
[url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/04/24/ukraine-russia-crisis/8085459/[/url]
Oh For Fucks Sake.
[QUOTE=theevilldeadII;44639335]Oh For Fucks Shake.[/QUOTE]
I love when a first post sums up everybody's reaction.
wow putin can you not
I think they are testing waters honestly.
[b]EDIT:[/b]
[url]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=774_1398351150[/url]
[QUOTE=theevilldeadII;44639335]Oh For Fucks Shake.[/QUOTE]
I prefer my shake not to have any fucks, thank you
I'm starting to get the urge to start a fast thread where Posters guess what russia/putin's next excuse'll be
Fuck Putin, seriously, now former comrades have begun killing each other openly thanks to Putin controlling the pro-russian militants.
How far will we let this go?
This is really starting to get out of hand.
[QUOTE]According to the ministry, the city's self-proclaimed mayor and local separatist leader, Vyacheslav Ponomaryov, has said those seen with the leaflet will be shot.
[/QUOTE]
You go ahead and do that. Certainly a boon to your case, Ponomaryov.
Lets see what a $100bn military does to a $3bn military.
I don't like how Ukrainian government calls the separatists terrorists. Not that they aren't a rogue agent Ukraine shouldn't deal with but it further shows what how little the term means besides "people the particular government doesn't like".
Russia wants this to happen, they're looking for any excuse to invade.
[QUOTE=laserguided;44639426]Lets see what a $100bn military does to a $3bn military.[/QUOTE]let's not
[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;44639457]I don't like how Ukrainian government calls the separatists terrorists. Not that they aren't a rogue agent Ukraine shouldn't deal with but it further shows what how little the term means besides "people the particular government doesn't like".[/QUOTE]
The lack of information they feed their troops is disturbing enough, watching the VICE documentary of them admitting they had no idea what they were there for was sad.
In the next 5 years everything will either go to shit, or seemingly fix itself.
[QUOTE=Zenreon117;44639506]In the next 5 years everything will either go to shit, or seemingly fix itself.[/QUOTE]
How insightful
tbh Im seeing a resembalance to pre-ww2 with the new developments in Russia, its like germany with the sudetland but instead its Russia with the Ukraine
It could be argued that we should just drone strike the entire Russian hierarchy and dismantle them.
Really, if they're going to angle to lock down the internet and spray propaganda everywhere and make their status as totalitarian dickbags quite obvious, I say take them out. When there's an uproar, just take more out. Humble the oligarchs.
I'm sick of all the posturing. I'm sick of the dick-waving. I'm sick of arrogant throwbacks like Putin undermining humanity finally coming together in such a way that could result in some common good getting done.
[QUOTE=Native Hunter;44640087]tbh Im seeing a resembalance to pre-ww2 with the new developments in Russia, its like germany with the sudetland but instead its Russia with the Ukraine[/QUOTE]
Crimea was the Sudetenland. Ukraine is Czechoslovakia. This is further paralleled by division of Czech/Slovakia and regional split between western and eastern Ukraine.
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44640205]It could be argued that we should just drone strike the entire Russian hierarchy and dismantle them.
Really, if they're going to angle to lock down the internet and spray propaganda everywhere and make their status as totalitarian dickbags quite obvious, I say take them out. When there's an uproar, just take more out. Humble the oligarchs.
I'm sick of all the posturing. I'm sick of the dick-waving. I'm sick of arrogant throwbacks like Putin undermining humanity finally coming together in such a way that could result in some common good getting done.[/QUOTE]
You do realize "arrogant throwbacks" and people who "undermine humanity" will always exist, and they exist everywhere, right?
Attacking Russia outright would result in horrendous amounts of death on a scale much larger than even a full scale invasion of ukraine by russia.
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44640205]It could be argued that we should just drone strike the entire Russian hierarchy and dismantle them.
Really, if they're going to angle to lock down the internet and spray propaganda everywhere and make their status as totalitarian dickbags quite obvious, I say take them out. When there's an uproar, just take more out. Humble the oligarchs.
I'm sick of all the posturing. I'm sick of the dick-waving. I'm sick of arrogant throwbacks like Putin undermining humanity finally coming together in such a way that could result in some common good getting done.[/QUOTE]
[quote]Humble the oligarchs.[/quote]
Start at home?
The US has the exact same policy cept its done by the NSA. If you post online odds are they know who you are or roughly where you are from. If they don't know who you are and want to shut you down they can DDos you, threaten your provider or get you taken off the search lists. They use spyware and exploits.
What Russia is doing here is bad but just a formalisation of what is happening everywhere else.
Now for your
[quote]It could be argued that we should just drone strike the entire Russian hierarchy and dismantle them.[/quote]
Give a valid argument for that, find someone willing to give one, baring in mind the number of deaths from such an action would be staggering. You don't just nuke somebody. This isn't cod.
Reading your post again to try and work out if its irony.
This for example
[quote]coming together in such a way that could result in some common good getting done[/quote]
Is just pure naivety. Starting a nuclear war is not "some common good".
[QUOTE=lifehole;44640260]You do realize "arrogant throwbacks" and people who "undermine humanity" will always exist, and they exist everywhere, right?
Attacking Russia outright would result in horrendous amounts of death on a scale much larger than even a full scale invasion of ukraine by russia.[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying attack Russia outright. I'm saying decapitate the government and showcase, much like the atomic bomb did, that conventional military power is an obsolete relic.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;44640283]Is just pure naivety. Starting a nuclear war is not "some common good".[/QUOTE]
It's not going to start a nuclear war. Much like Putin, I understand you can effectively do whatever you want in the world and people will let you in fear of awakening that genie. So the effectiveness of nuclear weapons as a deterrent against conventional warfare and invasion is gone until someone actually does use them. And then they vanish from the face of the Earth and the status quo tries to resume.
I never once mentioned using nuclear weapons. I just want to play by the rules currently on the table. We clean house with a few hellfires, you see some people getting upset and waving their fists and crying crocodile tears for the cameras. And that's it.
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44640289]I'm not saying attack Russia outright. I'm saying decapitate the government and showcase, much like the atomic bomb did, that conventional military power is an obsolete relic.
It's not going to start a nuclear war. Much like Putin, I understand you can effectively do whatever you want in the world and people will let you in fear of awakening that genie. So the effectiveness of nuclear weapons as a deterrent against conventional warfare and invasion is gone until someone actually does use them. And then they vanish from the face of the Earth and the status quo tries to resume.
I never once mentioned using nuclear weapons. I just want to play by the rules currently on the table. We clean house with a few hellfires, you see some people getting upset and waving their fists and crying crocodile tears for the cameras. And that's it.[/QUOTE]
That's it. You know, except for the massive breakdown of society, administrative breakdown, riots, civil war, etc. Do you realize the implications of removing an entire government from power? The implications that would have on the nationalistic side of the russian people? There'd probably be a military coup and everyone would think that a foreign power is invading, and they'd fight back; hard.
This is a chain of events you do NOT want to start, period.
[QUOTE=Native Hunter;44640087]tbh Im seeing a resembalance to pre-ww2 with the new developments in Russia, its like germany with the sudetland but instead its Russia with the Ukraine[/QUOTE]
Putin confirmed for "literally Hitler".
[QUOTE=lifehole;44640350]That's it. You know, except for the massive breakdown of society, administrative breakdown, riots, civil war, etc. Do you realize the implications of removing an entire government from power? The implications that would have on the nationalistic side of the russian people? There'd probably be a military coup and everyone would think that a foreign power is invading, and they'd fight back; hard.
This is a chain of events you do NOT want to start, period.[/QUOTE]
When the alternative is a global war that ends in the same anyway? Yes, I do.
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44640205]It could be argued that we should just drone strike the entire Russian hierarchy and dismantle them.
Really, if they're going to angle to lock down the internet and spray propaganda everywhere and make their status as totalitarian dickbags quite obvious, I say take them out. When there's an uproar, just take more out. Humble the oligarchs.
I'm sick of all the posturing. I'm sick of the dick-waving. I'm sick of arrogant throwbacks like Putin undermining humanity finally coming together in such a way that could result in some common good getting done.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, we'll cut the head off the Russian Government, cause panic and chaos, resulting in Nuclear retaliation.
Yeah how about no thanks we'll just post joke pictures of Putin.
[editline]25th April 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44640386]When the alternative is a global war that ends in the same anyway? Yes, I do.[/QUOTE]
No.
No you don't.
Do you even understand how the Modern world stage works?
[Quote]According to the ministry, the city's self-proclaimed mayor and local separatist leader, Vyacheslav Ponomaryov, has said those seen with the leaflet will be shot.[/Quote]
They're not even trying to act Legit anymore
[QUOTE=laserguided;44639426]Lets see what a $100bn military does to a $3bn military.[/QUOTE]
uh the taliban was like, a 2 cent 'military', coupled with insurgents
and they did some pretty brutal damage
I could only imagine well trained, well positioned strike areas, and the impact that it would have
the US army, if they fought russia, would have a severe amount of loses, double more than the losses in Afghanistan/Iraq.
This whole thing gives me hope that if I join the army after uni there is a good chance that this will still be brewing
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
