• 3-HO-PCP (3-[1-(1-piperidyl)cyclohexyl]phenol)
    15 replies, posted
Apparently this substance has been forgotten for 20 years or so and only just recently started popping up on the RC market. It seems to have [B]enormous [/B]potential as a dissociative hallucinogen with strong opioid/morphine-like effects and euphoria reported at higher doses. The mere thought of this substance gives me a raging boner. I'm predicting it will take the market by storm in the coming months/years so I decided to start this thread for discussion and information and whatnot. I have yet to try it as I currently only know of one source that stocks it and it's rather expensive (as with all brand-new RCs). Maybe someone else here has tried and would like to share his/her experiences? Below is a very detailed trip/substance report from Flashback (Swedish forums). It was posted by friman1987 in [URL="https://www.flashback.org/t2100084"]this thread[/URL] and translated by me. Note that some things might not make much sense as the original author (friman1987) isn't exactly a master of prose and mixed many details up, with highly questionable structure and grammar in some places. I tried to fix the worst parts but I kept many flaws as well in order to maintain the stylistic element presented in the original report. It's really worth a read if you're into dissociatives, opiates and/or hallucinogens. [B]Here I present the first trip report of this substance on Flashback. Probably the most formal report that's up on the internet.[/B] [U][B]General Information[/B][/U] [B]Name:[/B] 3-HO-PCP [B]Class:[/B] Dissociative [B]Compound:[/B] Arylcyclohexylamine [B]Sort of drug:[/B] Hallucinogen [B]Duration:[/B] 7-12 h [B]Peak:[/B] 40-70 min [U][B]Dosing scale[/B][/U] [B]Threshold:[/B] 1 mg [B]Light: [/B]1-3 mg [B]Common:[/B] 3-7 mg [B]Strong:[/B] 7-14 mg [B]Heavy:[/B] +14 mg [U][B]Effects I have observed and read about[/B][/U] [B]Positive:[/B] Enhanced sense of smell Feeling of being extremely calm Euphoria Visual Hallucinations in the form of OEVs and CEVs Cognitive/Perceptual change Enhanced focus and consciousness Emotional, empathetic feelings [B]Neutral:[/B] Analgesia and anesthesia Difficulties with focusing thoughts/confusion Worsened coordination (disorientation) Loss of balance Feeling of being disconnected from the surroundings Dilated pupils [B]Negative:[/B] Dysphoria Paranoia Dizziness, confusion, nausea Difficulties with perceiving or understanding what's going on Blurred long distance vision Cramps [U][B]Neuroscience [/B][/U] A lot of research has been made into the mechanisms of action of 3-HO-PCP. Most tests are made with rats and not humans. The most recent registered article that I have found is from 1996. In the research rats were subjected to a certain IV dose of 3-HO-PCP, and were later on dissected to see how the 3-HO-PCP had been allocated in the brain. Simply put they wanted to see the density of the binding distribution in the brains of rats. They used a technique called autoradiography where x-ray film is used to visualize molecules or fragments of molecules that are radiolabeled. High amounts of 3-HO-PCP was found in the sense of smell (the outer layer of the cerebral cortex, amygdala and thalamus) as well as hippocampus, especially in stratum and CA1. Low amounts were found in the cerebellum and the brainstem. These finding show that 3-HO-PCP binds to discrete areas in the rat's brain. When they later on compared the tests with other PCP-analogues they found that the distribution was almost identical to the localization of TCP (Tenocyclidine) and MK-801 (Dizocilpine) at the binding points in the rat's brain. Antagonism for glutamate, glycine and polyamine with 3-HO-PCP were similar or identical to TCP and MK 801. This means that 3-HO-PCP is an NMDA receptor antagonist and also has an effect on the PCP ion-channel-complex for glutamate receptors. Sources: 1. [URL="http://www.deepdyve.com/lp/elsevier/autoradiographic-study-on-the-pharmacological-characteristics-of-3-h-3-NnOJR6Lh3m"]Autoradiographic study on the pharmacological characteristics of ( 3 H)3-OH-PCP binding sites in rat brain (1995).[/URL] 2. [URL="http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/277/3/1823.abstract"]Regional distribution and characterization of [3H]dextrorphan binding sites in rat brain determined by quantitative autoradiography.[/URL] 3. [URL="http://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/handle/2027.42/28911/0000748.pdf?sequence=1"]Glycine Binding In Rat Brain[/URL] 4. [URL="http://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/handle/2027.42/29627/0000716.pdf;jsessionid=E483DF378D04D01B6A5E0819CC62D3AB?sequence=1"]REGIONAL DISTRIBUTION AND PROPERTIES OF [3H]MK-801.[/URL] 5. [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8884223"]Autoradiographic study on the pharmacological characteristics of [3H]3-OH-PCP binding sites in rat brain (1996).[/URL] 6. [URL="http://www.fasebj.org/content/3/7/1868"]([3H]PCP-3-OH; sigma p and PCP sites)[/URL] [U][B]My report:[/B][/U] --------------------------------------------------- [B]Substance:[/B] 3-HO-PCP [B]Dose:[/B] 15 mg [B]Age: [/B]25 [B]Body weight:[/B] 105 kg [B]Date of consumption:[/B] 28/2/2013 [B]Previous experiences: [/B]LSD, LSA, HBW, DMT, Ayahuasca, Cubensis, 4-Aco-Det, 4-Aco-DMT, 4-Ho-Met, 5-Meo-Mipt, Mescaline, 2C-P, 25C-Nbome, 25I-Nbome, Cannabis, 3-HO-PCP, bk-MDMA. [B]I have written my report during the trip and fixed some things afterwards.[/B] [B][I]Consumption:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- [B][U]16:15[/U][/B] I ingest 15 mg of the substance orally. I do not swallow it at once, but try to observe the taste first. It tastes very weak, nothing in comparison to tryptamines/phenethylamines. I was quickly anesthetized where I had it in the mouth. A few minutes afterwards it was not possible to trace any form of aftertaste, the anesthesia lasted for 15 min. [B][I]Onset:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- [B][U]After a quarter hour:[/U][/B] I experience the feeling of that something is wrong/odd, you are more attentive to things which also seems to bring with it a strong placebo effect. [B][U]After 20 minutes:[/U][/B] Experiencing: - It's going to set in soon? - This looks familiar! - What's going on? - Maybe I took too little? [B][I]Start:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- [B][U]After half an hour:[/U][/B] Now it's starting to kick in, I'm noticing transitions in the visual field. Exactly like psychedelics it starts with an amazingly detailed vision. I notice that my visual acuity is rising and I have a deeper sight, seeing air particles, pixels.. I feel an accelerating sensation of love and other pleasant feelings enter my world. I'm in a calm and pleasant universe. Everything feels so much more than the usual. The experience isn't frightening at all which can create potential for abuse, you're very happy with yourself. [B][U]After 40 minutes:[/U][/B] I feel it more now. It feels very weird, I'm not able to formulate the feeling. I'm unusually disconnected, both from body and mind. I'm appreciating this state and am fascinated by my presence in the room. - I can feel something is interesting, but I can't understand why I feel that? Do I really want to know why? I find no answer, and maybe that is how it's supposed to be. So I let the answer remain unanswered! [B][U]After 45 minutes:[/U][/B] I'm easily able to get lost in the room, not knowing what I was supposed to do or what I'm doing there anyway. Feeling that I'm going to enter a dream-like state any time now. The sense of smell on 3-HO-PCP is supposedly different so I try to smell different perfumes I have, one of them smells like summer, reminds me of a sunny day in some exotic final fantasy beach, the other reminds me of the first Godfather movie! It feels like you've just gotten out of the shower, everything smells fresh now. Suddenly I see my chair that's beside my desk, it looks like everything behind it is blurry and zoomed out while the chair itself is zooming in towards me. Very queer hallucination, I almost feel dizzy, so I decide to lie down "somewhere" on my bed. [B][I]Peak:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- [B][U]After an hour and 10 minutes:[/U][/B] Enhancement of sound. All sounds are much clearer. I feel intoxicated, anesthetized. I'm lying down in bed and taking it easy, feeling weirdly relaxed but still lively and alert. There aren't many thoughts that could destroy the calm, you're just fascinated over the situation. There is absolutely nothing to say right now at this point in time, you're satisfied and complacent. I can hear the silence speak to me and it feels wonderful. [B][U]After 2 hours:[/U][/B] I'm still lying in bed. It looks like my room has grown. Perceptional change? Everything looks zoomed out. I'm lying in bed and feel that I'm several meters from the roof. When I look at the curtains in my room they look like large gates to a castle. For some weird reason I started feeling like I was a fish, my room looks like an aquarium. What am I breathing anyway? Is it oxygen, it might as well be called something else in fish-language? When I close my eyes I don't feel the closed eye visuals on this drug are anything special, I see no geometries, no similarities with psychedelics. I see a silvery fluid that's floating around my field of view. [B][U]After 2 hours and 30 minutes:[/U][/B] Trying to get up from the bed, woow, now I'm starting to understand what people mean with feeling intoxicated. I feel very drunk/anesthetized in both my body and my head. [B][U]After 3 hours:[/U][/B] There are some emotional effects that you can associate with 5-meo-mipt/bk-MDMA but then again not really, it's hard to compare. On psychedelics I usually experience that time goes slow, with this it can be both, sometimes it feels like the time is flying straight ahead without you understanding anything, sometimes it's slow. [B][U]After 3 hours and 30 minutes:[/U][/B] It looks like I'm flying across the apartment. Feels like my room is a painting that I've entered, everything looks like a Waking Life-kind of world. [B][U]After 4 hours and 40 minutes:[/U][/B] It's not that hard to focus, but sometimes you still don't understand anything, you disappear for a few seconds and then come back again! Things do not look that clear, a bit blurry, also sometimes it felt like my eyes were 2 separate cameras. [B][U]After 5 hours and 30 minutes:[/U][/B] Trying to play video games now. I had heard that a demo had been released of the new God of War game, so I tried to download it. It was a crazy game to play on 3-HO-PCP. Something that's worth mentioning is that it felt slightly unusual and that it felt like my whole room was swinging up and down when the camera angle in the game was changed. It looked like the camera angle in the game decided how the room I was sitting in would turn like a cube. It felt like riding a rollercoaster. Sometimes it was really hard to see what was happening as you couldn't concentrate on long-distance sight. I felt completely dizzy when the demo had ended. It triggered nausea. [B][U]After 6 hours and 40 minutes:[/U][/B] Not so much to say now, nothing new is happening except for what is already mentioned. Everything repeats like a spiral only in different sequences. I'm just trying to chill in front of the computer and listen to some nice music. [B][I]Landing:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- [B][U]After 8 hours:[/U][/B] It slowly started going down now but not completely. It took about an hour until I returned to baseline. But somewhere here the end of the trip is located. So you trip for a total of 8-9 hours. [B][I]Sleep:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- I slept excellently. There was a whole lot of vivid dreams that I could remember after I had awoken, in the morning I felt a huge sense of relief, there was a lot of childhood feelings that had surfaced that I had forgotten about entirely. Experienced some form of antidepressant effect during the day. Was happy the entire next day. [B][I]Afterglow:[/I][/B] --------------------------------------------------- I could feel some effects days after ingestion, could be a form of bodily response from the trip. Everything was normal and restored 2-3 days after ingestion. [B]Personal opinions on the philosophy behind dissociatives:[/B] On dissociatives the ego becomes disconnected from the room, you avoid accepting new input from the outer world and you put all focus on yourself. This may feel surreal like some form of dream state. Everything is a projection and references from the memory, you dissociate away the surroundings and focus on processing everything within you. The inner world view is enhanced, you see your own fantasy-world that you've built since much earlier more clearly. Dissociatives can be useful if you're trying to reach your subconscious without being disturbed by external stimuli. You process things rather than try to change them. It's like a form of dating with your inner self but then again it's not. Naturally the experience can be frightening if you're inexperienced and don't know what you've embarked on. On psychedelics you receive information all the time, the ego is independent from the past, you're aware of your subconscious and at the same time there's a lot of pressure to change since you have no references from the past when you're in the now. Like being thrown into a stormy ocean without having learned how to swim and attempting to get out of it. There's a big focus on the now and you're bombarded with a lot of external stimuli. Psychedelics can give you a new childhood. On dissociatives it seems more like you're reunited with your own childhood. [B]Can you experience empathy on dissociatives?[/B] I experienced some form of empathy during the trip, similar to 5-meo-mipt. So I ask myself why? Is there empathy in dissociatives? I have read about NMDA modulators, for example a piracetam derivative that's called pramiracetam. It supposedly removes all empathy, so there may be empathy that's related to the NMDA receptor and since this substance blocks and doesn't activate it an opposite effect, that is heightened empathy, is probably experienced with most dissociatives. [B][U]Different Routes of Administration:[/U][/B] I've tried ingesting it in two ways, by swallowing and snusing (absorption through gums). I felt the strongest effects when snusing it. Just make sure to brush your gums beforehand. It's possible to administrate in any form, it's probably even possible to smoke it like you used to do with PCP, where you dipped a fag in the PCP-fluid and after it had dried you smoked it. [B]EXTRA READING: (Some basic chemistry)[/B] [B][U]The chemical structure of dissociatives:[/U][/B] --------------------------------------------------- What forms all dissociative molecules is arylcyclohexylamine. This is the skeleton to building a dissociative molecule. [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dc/Acha_markush.png[/IMG] The picture illustrates the arylcyclohexylamine skeleton that is the basis for a dissociative hallucinogen. R is used for substituents for the nitrogen that is present in the skeleton. R2 and R4 is for substituents for the cyclohexane-ring (the ring in the middle). Ar is used for aryl substituents, below is a list of all aryl groups that could be present: Phenyl (most common) Naphthyl Thienyl Indolyl You can put any of these where it says Ar on the skeleton. [B][U]Among the simplest molecules that you can make from this is the ketamine molecule:[/U][/B] --------------------------------------------------- Nitrogen substituent: methyl Aryl substituent: (phenyl + chlorine) Cyclohexane substituent (R2): ketone With this we get ketamine. Ket stands for the ketone group that's attached to R2 [B][U]If we want to build PCP:[/U][/B] --------------------------------------------------- Nitrogen substituent: piperidine Aryl substituent: phenyl Cyclohexane substituent: nothing With this we get PCP. [B][U]If we want to build 3-HO-PCP:[/U][/B] --------------------------------------------------- Nitrogen substituent: piperdine Aryl substituent: phenyl Cyclohexane substituent: OH-group (You can have OH groups in different positions, 3 stands for what position OH is attached to) Then we get 3-HO-PCP (3-HO-PCP = pcp molecule where the OH is attached to the 3rd position of the cyclohexane ring) [B][U]Substituting with OH and it's characteristic properties:[/U][/B] The only difference between PCP and 3-OH-PCP is that 3-HO-PCP has a substituted OH group on cyclohexane. Attempts have been made to observe the differences of effects on an OH-substituted PCP where OH is either on the cyclohexane or the phenyl or piperdine of the PCP molecule. [B]These are the results:[/B] When OH was attached to phenyl the activity was reduced. When OH was attached to piperdine a large variation in affinity for the morphine receptor was created. When OH was attached to cyclohexane, that is when you got 3-HO-PCP, there was a significant reduction of the affinity for the muscarinic receptor, which is an exception compared to the other OH-substituted PCP derivatives. 3-HO-PCP affinity for the muscarinic receptor was only 2 times lower than with PCP, [B]but its affinity for the morphine-receptor proved to be 430 times higher than PCP itself and only one magnitude from morphine.[/B] Attempts have also been made to change the position of OH on the phenyl and see what happens. Only 2 derivatives produced compounds with potent opioid analgesic actions. 1. 4-HO-PCP 2. 3-HO-PCP [B]Differences and similarities between PCP and 3-HO-PCP:[/B] It was observed that both PCP and 3-HO-PCP caused a dose dependency with rats among others. 3-HO-PCP, contrary to PCP, proved to have an opioid antagonistic effect. 3-HO-PCP also showed a high affinity for morphine receptors. Sources: 7-17-1981 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6273187"](On the opioid nature of phencyclidine and its 3-hydroxy derivative.)[/URL] 4-1-1982 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6279847"](Chemical synthesis and molecular pharmacology of hydroxylated 1-(1-phenylcyclohexyl-piperidine derivatives.)[/URL] 6-1-1984 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6088255"](Interaction of two phencyclidine opiate-like derivatives with 3H-opioid binding sites.)[/URL] 1-1-1986 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2828967"](High and low affinity psychotomimetic opioid binding sites: characterization by a novel 3H-PCP-analog.)[/URL] 4-14-1987 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3036548"]([3H]PCP-3-OH and (+)[3H]SKF 10047 binding sites in rat brain membranes: evidence of multiplicity.)[/URL] 1-1-1988 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2893238"](Pharmacological specificity of some psychotomimetic and antipsychotic agents for the sigma and PCP binding sites.)[/URL] 2-15-1988 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2834673"](Regulation of the binding of sigma- and phencyclidine (PCP)-receptor ligands in rat brain membranes by guanine nucleotides and ions.)[/URL] 1-1-1995 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7620917"](Quantitative autoradiographic localization of [3H]3-OH-PCP (1-(1(3-hydroxyphenyl)cyclohexyl)piperidine) binding sites in rat brain.)[/URL] 8-29-1996 [URL="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8884223"](Autoradiographic study on the pharmacological characteristics of [3H]3-OH-PCP binding sites in rat brain.)[/URL]
Looks very enticing, I will definitely keep my eye open for this
Looks awesome. Now, if only I had Bitcoins and the balls to use Silkroad...
I don't think it's on Silkroad. It's a pretty exotic substance as of yet it seems.
[QUOTE=Mindtwistah;39984051]What forms all dissociative molecules is arylcyclohexylamine.[/QUOTE] Not all of them.
[QUOTE=Reader;39988163]Not all of them.[/QUOTE] Yeah as I said I only did the translation. I noticed a few factual errors as well but kept most in.
Might be getting some of this.
Awesome, don't forget to share your experience! I'll probably get some pretty soon too.
The opiate effects sound interesting, but I'm guessing they would be pretty overwhelmed by the hallucinations and disassociation haha
So never mind about Silkroad. I have a chemistry master's friend who might be able to make it though. The visuals sound cool though.
[QUOTE=Steamswitch;40006329]So never mind about Silkroad. I have a chemistry master's friend who might be able to make it though. The visuals sound cool though.[/QUOTE] Many have died on this route (Look up MDMA synthesis with PMA). Theoretical chemistry doesn't translate fully into practical. Make sure if he attempts anything he gets it 3rd party verified by a lab and don't be a guinea pig. To the OP, look up 3-MEO-PCE it's been manufactured before and is similar to what you're describing.
[QUOTE=Titann;40011322]Many have died on this route (Look up MDMA synthesis with PMA). Theoretical chemistry doesn't translate fully into practical. Make sure if he attempts anything he gets it 3rd party verified by a lab and don't be a guinea pig. To the OP, look up 3-MEO-PCE it's been manufactured before and is similar to what you're describing.[/QUOTE] I'm almost positive Steamswitch is a troll, he posts many stories throughout DD which are very hard to believe.
[QUOTE=jonashappy;40005615]The opiate effects sound interesting, but I'm guessing they would be pretty overwhelmed by the hallucinations and disassociation haha[/QUOTE] A flashback user testifies to a good deal of euphoria produced by 3-HO-PCP: "The euphoria that came with this was one of the best things I have ever experienced. Imagine getting an orgasm mixed with tramadol but in a more subtle forum, and there you have the well-being produced from this. In addition, imagine that you feel as well as you could, but even better, then you have how you're feeling mentally" "But I'm happy as fuck! All music is awesome in any case. Feels like an overly-happy tramadol high sort of, without that knocked out feeling that opioids/opiates can give." "The euphoria is completely crazy. I could take this instead of codeine, tramadol etc since this trumps them all only that you don't become as slow and tired." Also, I have a theory of that 3-HO-PCP could essentially work as an opiate but without opiate tolerance and withdrawal. I recommend you to check out the discussion me and Memnoth had in the DD questions thread last night if you want to get some info regarding the effects of NMDA-antagonism on blocking and possibly reversing opiate tolerance: [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1250164&p=40001127&viewfull=1#post40001127[/url] [editline]23rd March 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Titann;40011322]To the OP, look up 3-MEO-PCE it's been manufactured before and is similar to what you're describing.[/QUOTE] 3-MEO-PCE doesn't have anything near the affinity for µ-opioid as this though, which is what makes it so incredibly interesting :o
Any knowledge of 3-HO-PCE? [editline]26th March 2013[/editline] From the limited amount of info I've been able to find on it, it should be even more potent than 3-ho-pcp in some ways, but a bad batch seems to have tarnished its reputation.
[QUOTE=Titann;40011322]Many have died on this route (Look up MDMA synthesis with PMA). Theoretical chemistry doesn't translate fully into practical. Make sure if he attempts anything he gets it 3rd party verified by a lab and don't be a guinea pig.[/QUOTE] A masters in chemistry would not make the mistake of using anethole instead of safrole (which produces PMMA instead of MDMA). That example has nothing to do with theoretical vs practical chemistry. Bad synthesis of MDMA usually just produces a weaker batch. People who make PMMA do so either purposely (because safrole is difficult to obtain, anethole is cheaper, and they think they can pass off the end result as the same drug), or because they know nothing about chemistry and assume that anethole and safrole are the same thing. But I do agree that the end product should be independently verified. EDIT: I read a post on bluelight that says that sassafras oil contains enough anethole to result in some PMMA contamination if not distilled properly, but I can't find any good sources of this. [URL="http://www.essentialoils.co.za/essential-oils/sassafras.htm"]This site[/URL] says it contains [b]traces[/b] of anethole. So I'm still inclined to believe that it's not caused by sloppy lab work.
[QUOTE=Mindtwistah;40004363]Awesome, don't forget to share your experience! I'll probably get some pretty soon too.[/QUOTE] Count me in!
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