• Second world war bombers changed the weather
    35 replies, posted
[QUOTE=New Scientist]Allied bombing raids during the second world war inadvertently experimented on the weather by producing huge contrails over south-east England. A study of one 1944 raid offers a rare opportunity to check our models of how contrails change temperatures.After listening to a radio programme in which an elderly woman recalled seeing a wartime sky "turn white with clouds" as fleets of bombers took off,[URL="http://www.lec.lancs.ac.uk/people/Roger_Timmis"]Roger Timmis[/URL] of Lancaster Environment Centre in the UK realised that the planes could have affected the weather. Contrails are known to have [URL="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2926-aircraft-vapour-trails-are-climate-scourge.html"]several effects on climate[/URL]. On the one hand, they act as a blanket, trapping heat that would otherwise escape into space. On the other, during the day they reflect incoming sunlight, cooling the Earth below more than it is warmed by the other effect. But overall, the consensus among climatologists is that [URL="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20304-contrails-warm-the-world-more-than-aviation-emissions.html"]they warm the planet[/URL]. In the 1940s – unlike today – there was hardly any civilian air traffic, so historical records offer an opportunity to test the daytime effects. "Pilots cared about contrails a lot," says [URL="http://www.es.lancs.ac.uk/people/robmck/"]Rob MacKenzie[/URL], formerly of Lancaster University, and now at the University of Birmingham, UK. "Aircraft were tracked using contrails and shot down. So pilots would report them." Using operational records from the US Army Air Force and the British Royal Air Force, and archived weather data, Timmis and MacKenzie realised they could compare temperatures immediately beneath a raid's flight path to those several kilometres upwind, where there would have been no contrails. [h=3]Clear May morning[/h]Conditions were ideal as one particular raid took off on the morning of 11 May 1944, with clear skies and enough moisture for contrails to form. Timmis and MacKenzie found that where the aircraft circled and assembled into formation it was significantly cloudier and 0.8 °C cooler than the area upwind of the bases. "It's innovative to use these historical records," says [URL="http://www.cate.mmu.ac.uk/staffpage.asp?chg2=staff&chg=who&id=3"]David Lee[/URL] of Manchester Metropolitan University, UK. He says the documented cooling due to daytime contrails is "entirely consistent" with what is already known. Field studies of contrails are rare, says [URL="http://facstaff.uww.edu/travisd/"]David Travis[/URL] of the University of Wisconsin-Whitewater. Most of our understanding of their effects is based on model studies. Travis says studies like this MacKenzie's study could help change that. He previously found that temperatures were more variable [URL="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2642-jet-trails-make-climate-milder.html"]when planes were grounded in the aftermath of 9/11[/URL], but faced criticism because the contrail effect couldn't be separated from natural variability in the weather. By comparing temperatures on the same day, but some kilometres apart, the bomber raid study was able to get around this problem.[/QUOTE] Source: [URL="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20667-second-world-war-bombers-changed-the-weather.html"]http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20667-second-world-war-bombers-changed-the-weather.html D[/URL]AMN BOMBERS
So war pretty much brings its climate conditions upon the battlefield... poetic and cool
Oh wow
This was uncalled for... Interesting phenomena I must say
Thats pretty cool.
That's certainly interesting.
Hold the fucking phone... Your telling me that aircraft may be responsible for some climate change? With due respect... Thats fucking awesome.
Farting cows are responsible for climate change. Everything is responsible for climate change. The climate is constantly changing.
[QUOTE=Ridge;31049860]Farting cows are responsible for climate change. Everything is responsible for climate change. The climate is constantly changing.[/QUOTE] And if you're a farmer in NY you get taxed on how many cows you have due to the methane emissions. I hate my state.
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;31049835]Hold the fucking phone... Your telling me that aircraft may be responsible for some climate change? With due respect... Thats fucking awesome.[/QUOTE] your posts just keep getting shittier.
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;31049835]Hold the fucking phone... Your telling me that aircraft may be responsible for some climate change? With due respect... Thats fucking awesome.[/QUOTE] Of course they do? How could you not realise? Also, there was a similar thing but in reverse following 9/11. In the subsequent days following the attack when all air-traffic in the US was grounded, there was a rare opportunity to study what happens to the climate without any contrails. Temperatures rose nationwide on those days then dropped again when planes started flying again, confirming that contrails produce a cooling effect. However, this cooling effect is smaller than the warming effect produced from greenhouse emissions, so the solution is not to just fly more planes.
[QUOTE=Ridge;31049860]Farting cows are responsible for climate change. Everything is responsible for climate change. The climate is constantly changing.[/QUOTE] and the current bout is man-made. anything else is scientific revisionism + ignorance + go away
[QUOTE=Ridge;31049860]Farting cows are responsible for climate change. Everything is responsible for climate change. The climate is constantly changing.[/QUOTE] Ha! Exactly! It's just nature. I mean, who breeds this massive amount of cows solely for our consumptio- Oh.
[QUOTE=MrEndangered;31055258]Ha! Exactly! It's just nature. I mean, who breeds this massive amount of cows solely for our consumptio- Oh.[/QUOTE] To be fair, we raise them for more than meat. There's also leather, wool, farm labour, etc. Plus, the whole "it's more efficient to farm just crops rather than grow crops then have animals eat them, then eat the animals" is more complicated than it seems. Humans can't process a large portion of most grains, so you may as well extract the parts we can eat then feed the rest to livestock, which we can harvest as well.
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;31049835]Hold the fucking phone... Your telling me that aircraft may be responsible for some climate change? With due respect... Thats fucking awesome.[/QUOTE] look at me i can swear every other sentence. its a sign of maturity!
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;31055319]To be fair, we raise them for more than meat. There's also leather, wool, farm labour, etc. Plus, the whole "it's more efficient to farm just crops rather than grow crops then have animals eat them, then eat the animals" is more complicated than it seems. Humans can't process a large portion of most grains, so you may as well extract the parts we can eat then feed the rest to livestock, which we can harvest as well.[/QUOTE] I know, and you're right - I was just making fun of morons who think cows farting = natural cycles of climate change.
The USA manages to do it again :downs:
[QUOTE=Maximo13;31055849]The USA manages to do it again :downs:[/QUOTE] Yeah good thing the US was the only nation in WWII that had invented the bomber, which is why USA won WWII!! God bless!!
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;31054969]and the current bout is man-made. anything else is scientific revisionism + ignorance + go away[/QUOTE] Explain the global record highs during the middle ages. Must have been all the knights cruising around in their SUVs....
[QUOTE=KorJax;31056449]Yeah good thing the US was the only nation in WWII that had invented the bomber, which is why USA won WWII!! God bless!![/QUOTE] Why do people understand YOUR sarcasm? :saddowns:
What's worse to the weather, a farting elephant or your average family sedan?
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;31054601]Of course they do? How could you not realise? Also, there was a similar thing but in reverse following 9/11. In the subsequent days following the attack when all air-traffic in the US was grounded, there was a rare opportunity to study what happens to the climate without any contrails. Temperatures rose nationwide on those days then dropped again when planes started flying again, confirming that contrails produce a cooling effect. However, this cooling effect is smaller than the warming effect produced from greenhouse emissions, so the solution is not to just fly more planes.[/QUOTE] Maybe the government did 9/11 just to test the affects of aircraft on the weather
Well who wouldn't have thought that some big-ass nuclear bombs don't affect the environment, or atmosphere for that matter.
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;31069241]Well who wouldn't have thought that some big-ass nuclear bombs don't affect the environment, or atmosphere for that matter.[/QUOTE] You could have at least read the first line of the article before posting.
[QUOTE=Tetracycline;31068226]Maybe the government did 9/11 just to test the affects of aircraft on the weather[/QUOTE] I can't see why not.
Interesting article. Also I thought the conspiracy theorists would be in this thread by now.
[QUOTE=Rage.;31070697]Interesting article. Also I thought the conspiracy theorists would be in this thread by now.[/QUOTE] I recall reading that older plane engines spat out more solid matter and/or reacted differently with the atmosphere, producing more notable "persistent" contrails. Hence why some people are calling out the ones seen today as something else (not to mention many of the jets I/they have seen are clearly too low to produce contrails). Before anyone asks the question about "hurp durp after 9/11 why we see none?!?", assuming there's something to the chemtrail theory, it would kind of be conspicuous to have a bunch of jets running to and fro doing that when air traffic is supposed to be grounded.
[QUOTE=Ridge;31061384]Explain the global record highs during the middle ages. Must have been all the knights cruising around in their SUVs....[/QUOTE] Don't be stupid. The knights had motorcycles. How else are they going to joust?
[QUOTE=eatdembeanz;31075285]Don't be stupid. The knights had motorcycles. How else are they going to joust?[/QUOTE] sunroofs
[QUOTE=Ridge;31061384]Explain the global record highs during the middle ages. Must have been all the knights cruising around in their SUVs....[/QUOTE] [quote]and the [B]current bout[/B] is man-made. anything else is scientific revisionism + ignorance + go away [/quote] Derp
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.