How bad are the bad guys in Mali? The answer, in four powerful paragraphs - Polidicks

[quote]As the French military expands its campaign to halt the Islamist rebels who have already seized half of Mali, it’s worth asking: what makes these guys so bad that France intervened against them? Mali’s Islamist rebels have earned a record for cruelty and barbarity since seizing the northern half of the country. That’s probably not the only reason France intervened (more on this in a later post), but it’s an important – and disturbing – part of the picture. The Post’s Sudarsan Raghavan visited Mali recently, where he discovered just how brutal the Islamists’ rule had become. Here, from his December 11 story, is a glimpse into life under their rule: SEGOU, Mali — On a sweltering afternoon, Islamist police officers dragged Fatima Al Hassan out of her house in the fabled city of Timbuktu. They beat her up, shoved her into a white pickup truck and drove her to their headquarters. She was locked up in a jail as she awaited her sentence: 100 lashes with an electrical cord. “Why are you doing this?” she recalled asking. Hassan was being punished for giving water to a male visitor. … [R]efugees say the Islamists are raping and forcibly marrying women, and recruiting children for armed conflict. Social interaction deemed an affront to their interpretation of Islam is zealously punished through Islamic courts and a police force that has become more systematic and inflexible, human rights activists and local officials say. Life in Mali, after just a few months of the Islamists’ rule, is already changing dramatically. Music, long at the center of Malian culture (it also happens to be very good), is now banned. To many Malians, Raghavan wrote after spending time with recent exiles, it feels like “a shattering of their culture.” None of this means that France’s intervention is necessarily the right decision for Mali or that it will work, but it helps convey the sense of urgency, and why the French government seems determined not to allow the Islamists to reach the capital in Mali’s south.[/quote] [url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/01/14/how-bad-are-the-bad-guys-in-mali-the-answer-in-four-powerful-paragraphs/[/url] I'm amazed that this isn't getting more coverage.

Christ, these guys are vicious.

this wouldn't have happened if mali were still a colony

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;39220302]this wouldn't have happened if mali were still a colony[/QUOTE] It's like the train crash is coming right through my screen.

Here are some more examples- [quote]They were told to assemble in Gao's market place at dusk. A man accused of using tobacco was escorted before the crowd by several members of the al-Qaida splinter group Movement for Tawhid and Jihad in West Africa. "Then they chopped off his hand. They wanted to show us what they could do," said Ahmed, 39, a meat trader from the town in northern Mali. That was not the end of it. The severed hand was tossed into a vat of boiling water. Then, according to Ahmed, the man was pinned down and over the next hour the bent, misshapen hand was sewn crudely back onto his stump. Ahmed, too terrified to disclose his full name, fled Gao the next day, 8 November: "I had to go. I could not live my life." Fresh witness accounts such as this, from people arriving smothered in the red Sahel dust that clogs every pore at the refugee camps straddling the border with Burkina Faso, suggest that the situation in northern Mali is deteriorating fast. Given the dangerous situation in the region, it was impossible to verify the accounts, but they were numerous and disturbing. Islamist militants who seized control of an area larger than the UK six months ago have imposed their ultra-conservative brand of sharia law. The tales recounted suggest a population subjugated by a regime well versed in appalling brutality. Allegations of war crimes include summary executions, mass rape, racism and the targeting of elders by child soldiers recruited by the extremists. Some allege that child soldiers are being forced to rape women.[/quote] [url]http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/dec/15/rape-killings-terror-mali?intcmp=239[/url] Good god, it's like they deliberately set out to become the most evil "bad guy" stereotypes on the entire planet. Fucking horrifying.

[QUOTE=Glorbo;39220374]Here are some more examples- [url]http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/dec/15/rape-killings-terror-mali?intcmp=239[/url] Good god, it's like they deliberately set out to become the most evil "bad guy" stereotypes on the entire planet. Fucking horrifying.[/QUOTE] Did they just cross the line [b]twice[/b]? Not cool man, not cool!

Shit like that happen all the time. If you want to make sure shit's bad in an African country or rebel group, check its name and find the "democratic" part in it.

Well on the upside [url=http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/spotlight/2012review/2012/12/20121228102157169557.html]they fixed someone's car this one time[/url] It pretty much balances out

i'm serious, france may as well just re-annex the country and re-establish law and order; the malian government is clearly incompetent

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;39220567]i'm serious, france may as well just re-annex the country and re-establish law and order; the malian government is clearly incompetent[/QUOTE] What is it with you and colonies and ethnic removal. You're a nut.

There's just something about France doing what they are doing so out of the blue that I like. Makes a change. Viva la France!

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;39220575]What is it with you and colonies and ethnic removal. You're a nut.[/QUOTE] Dain is basically a Nazi but you grow to appreciate that side of him over time <3

[QUOTE=Scrimp;39220605]There's just something about France doing what they are doing so out of the blue that I like. Makes a change. Viva la France![/QUOTE] They're not doing this out of the blue, Mali is a former colony of France, whose government requested military aid recently because of the extremist Islamist expansion in the north of the country.

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;39220575]What is it with you and colonies and ethnic removal. You're a nut.[/QUOTE] what the hell i've never said anything about ethnic cleansing [editline]14th January 2013[/editline] it's basically indisputable that former colonies are more dangerous places to live in than when they were under european rule. [editline]14th January 2013[/editline] at least, former colonies where the europeans didn't stay - see the difference between say, canada and rhodesia [editline]14th January 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Patriarch;39220614]Dain is basically a Nazi but you grow to appreciate that side of him over time <3[/QUOTE] why do people keep thinking i'm a nazi ;_;

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;39220686]what the hell i've never said anything about ethnic cleansing [editline]14th January 2013[/editline] it's basically indisputable that former colonies are more dangerous places to live in than when they were under european rule. [editline]14th January 2013[/editline] at least, former colonies where the europeans didn't stay - see the difference between say, canada and rhodesia [editline]14th January 2013[/editline] why do people keep thinking i'm a nazi ;_;[/QUOTE] because its creepy and revanche

[QUOTE=Zambies!;39220749]because its creepy and revanche[/QUOTE] I wouldn't really say revanchism - I don't really hold much special affection for the various European empires of the 19th century, just that they were leagues more competent in administration than the sorry excuses for government they left behind. I don't want a restoration of the British Empire in africa, I want a restoration of [I]stability, law and order[/I] in africa, and whichever state or company can achieve this, I'd be happy with and so would the citizens of africa. The Chinese could do it, DeBeers could do it, Luxembourg could do it.

These guys are the prime examples of giving islamics a bad name

[QUOTE=TheSporeGA;39220873]These guys are the prime examples of giving islamics a bad name[/QUOTE] Every religion has idiots, some as extreme as these guys.

[QUOTE=TheSporeGA;39220873]These guys are the prime examples of giving islamics a bad name[/QUOTE] They're just dicks justifying their actions with a popular religion.

alternative source for you guys. if you're gonna read a spin article ya might as well read one from a different perspective too. [url]http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/01/14/283503/france-invasion-of-mali-preplanned/[/url]

Former colonies tend to be fucked up because they're former colonies. European nations didn't exactly focus on infrastructure and development when they were busy hauling cargo back to the mainland. There was law and order, sure. But it was just as draconian and inhumane as the militant law the rebels are enforcing now. France didn't exactly turn Mali into a paradise when they arrived, quite the contrary. They faced active, armed resistance from rebel groups, partly because the prevailing idea at the time was that everyone in Africa was subhuman and the only way to make them submit was strict rule of law that bullshitted the locals in favor of the colonialists. Basically, the colonies may have been an awesome place for the French or European. It sucked if you were a local because you had practically zero rights in your own country. The reason we see this shit today is underdevelopment and lack of education. Religious extremism thrives in miserable conditions and when you're starving, out of money and options, 72 virgins don't seem so bad. It is good that France is offering aid to Mali when they need it the most, but to understand the issue you have to look at the root cause. Extremism isn't the root cause. It's poverty, hunger and desperation that cause religious extremism and after Mali and France are done shitstomping the rebels, they can dig into the real issue.

[B]Mali 2013[/B] campaign guys?

Islam. RELIGION OF PEACE. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitposting" - Megafan))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=DrugUnit;39221857]Islam. RELIGION OF PEACE.[/QUOTE] Without getting all Mass Debate in here, it's just a small extremist minority doing these things. But yeah, what they do is terrible.

Wow, this makes the shit I saw in Afghanistan look like a fucking Disney cartoon. Like, holy shit, is it even possible to be that bad?

I hate how these monsters call themselves Islamist, bringing shame and bad rep to muslims everywhere. I hope france could sort this out. [editline]15th January 2013[/editline] I hate how these monsters call themselves Islamist, bringing shame and bad rep to muslims everywhere. I hope france could sort this out. I was gonna make a surrender joke but im too pissed.

[QUOTE=Glorbo;39220139]I'm amazed that this isn't getting more coverage.[/QUOTE] Oh their destruction of cultural monuments got plenty of coverage. But when you mention intervention, oh boy does the world community and public opinion shit down your throat.

[QUOTE=Deadman;39221043]Former colonies tend to be fucked up because they're former colonies. European nations didn't exactly focus on infrastructure and development when they were busy hauling cargo back to the mainland. There was law and order, sure. But it was just as draconian and inhumane as the militant law the rebels are enforcing now. France didn't exactly turn Mali into a paradise when they arrived, quite the contrary. They faced active, armed resistance from rebel groups, partly because the prevailing idea at the time was that everyone in Africa was subhuman and the only way to make them submit was strict rule of law that bullshitted the locals in favor of the colonialists. Basically, the colonies may have been an awesome place for the French or European. It sucked if you were a local because you had practically zero rights in your own country. The reason we see this shit today is underdevelopment and lack of education. Religious extremism thrives in miserable conditions and when you're starving, out of money and options, 72 virgins don't seem so bad. It is good that France is offering aid to Mali when they need it the most, but to understand the issue you have to look at the root cause. Extremism isn't the root cause. It's poverty, hunger and desperation that cause religious extremism and after Mali and France are done shitstomping the rebels, they can dig into the real issue.[/QUOTE] actually no the law imposed on the natives by the europeans was much more humane than what they're doing to each other right now yes, the locals were bullshitted, and yes, the laws were strict. that's what you need in order to completely crush any resistance. when the force is so overwhelming that potential rebels perceive no actual chance of winning, there will be no resistance. when the tactics are more soft (ie the "hearts and minds" policies in afghanistan and iraq) it shows that the occupying force simply does not have the will to impose order. only once the place has been civilized can things like rule of law and human rights and representative government be successful. we tried imposing a democracy on semi-anarchic iraq and look what happened. [url]http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.co.uk/2008/09/how-to-occupy-and-govern-foreign.html[/url]