U.S. debt just $417 billion below the debt ceiling; expected to hit limit in December; Likely ceilin - Polidicks

[QUOTE]NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Republicans are trying to make political hay of the fact that the federal gross debt this week crossed the $16 trillion mark. But reaching that milestone was expected. And while notable, it overshadows the number that is of more immediate concern to Congress: the amount of debt subject to the legal borrowing limit. The debt ceiling is currently set at $16.394 trillion. At the end of August, the amount of debt subject to that limit -- which excludes certain types of debt -- was $15.977 trillion, roughly $417 billion below the cap. [B]Since the government typically borrows between $100 billion and $125 billion a month, that means it's on track to hit the ceiling sometime in December.[/B] But the Treasury Department will likely be able to use "extraordinary measures" to keep the debt just below the legal limit for a couple of months. [B]Bottom line: Congress will likely need to raise the ceiling in early 2013 or Treasury will risk defaulting on the country's legal obligations by failing to pay all of its bills in full and on time.[/B] If the past is any guide, lawmakers will wait until the last possible moment to do so. The issue has long been used as a political bludgeon by the minority party to paint those in the majority as irresponsible spendthrifts. Last year's histrionics were the most dramatic example. Despite all the noise to come, the fact is the debt is the result of both parties' decisions over the years to commit to higher spending -- either because they approved new or expanded government programs or large tax cuts. House Speaker John Boehner warned in the spring that Republicans would not approve another increase to the debt ceiling if it wasn't matched by a greater amount in spending cuts. That will prove difficult since the House had a hard time coming up with $15 billion to pay for the highway bill, noted former Capitol Hill staffer Pete Davis. If lawmakers want to raise the debt ceiling to cover another year of expenses, they would likely have to increase it by more than $600 billion. So Davis, who now runs Davis Capital Investment Ideas, expects Congress will instead pass a series of smaller, short-term increases to the debt ceiling as lawmakers duke it out. ast year's debt ceiling grudge match ended up with a three-part debt ceiling increase that was matched by $2.1 trillion in spending cuts. But $1.2 trillion of those cuts -- set to go into effect in 2013 -- are also the subject of much debate. They are mostly across-the-board cuts that many in both parties believe are a thoughtless way to go about reducing deficits. Yet they can't agree on how to replace them with a more sensible plan. Add in disagreements over the expiration of the Bush tax cuts and other measures that threaten the economy, and it's clear Congress will have a lot of fights on tap after Election Day[/quote] Source: [url]http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/05/news/economy/federal-debt/index.html[/url]

wow that's a lot of debt

how are we going to get out of this one?

[QUOTE=Laferio;37638933]how are we going to get out of this one?[/QUOTE] Bickering and screaming all they way, just like last time. Except probably worse.

Like they care, who's going to try and collect debts from the most powerful country in the world? Rest of world, stay mad.

The solution is obviously cut taxes

[QUOTE=Lonestriper;37638959]The solution is obviously cut taxes[/QUOTE] Health of the economy and federal income are not synonymous. Republicans know that cutting taxes would not help manage the national debt at all. That's why they propose budget cuts to help control the debt.

[QUOTE=D.W;37638956]Like they care, who's going to try and collect debts from the most powerful country in the world? Rest of world, stay mad.[/QUOTE] most of the debt is owed to American entities, not other countries (which is why the whole "China owes our debt!" is actually subtly veiled racism)

Remember folks Debt depends on faith As long as we remain politically stable (which we are) and economically stable (which we are), and as long as we remain one of the largest economies in the world, nobody is going to seriously worry about our debt besides Ron Paul people.

In a dream world we could remove the Bush tax cuts and decrease military spending, in a good world we could compromise with republicans, in reality we can bicker and do nothing until intrest rates go up and the US ends up bankrupt.

[QUOTE=The Baconator;37639132](which is why the whole "China owes our debt!" is actually subtly veiled racism)[/QUOTE] I don't think it's racism, just a common misconception that a lot of Americans have. Probably because China owns more US debt than any other foreign entity.

[QUOTE=DamagePoint;37639166]I don't think it's racism, just a common misconception that a lot of Americans have. Probably because China owns more US debt than any other foreign entity.[/QUOTE] it's just the modern day implementation of the [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_Peril"]Yellow Peril [/URL]we have always had

[QUOTE=dvondrake;37639161]What's the point of a debt ceiling if they just keep raising it?[/QUOTE] There is a lot of things in the world of money that doesn't have a point. In fact probably about half the shit related to money could be scraped and done in a much easier and simpler way.

[QUOTE=person11;37639150]Remember folks Debt depends on faith As long as we remain politically stable (which we are) and economically stable (which we are), and as long as we remain one of the largest economies in the world, nobody is going to seriously worry about our debt besides Ron Paul people.[/QUOTE] I would say the US is only sound compared to other crappier economies (ie, Europe). As long as there are the Greeks and Spaniards to backstop the US, the dollar's global reserve currency status should not be threatened. However, this is not to say all is fine and dandy. We could potentially see a domino-like run on sovereign debt much like what happened to the banks in 2008. In fact, the debt situation in Germany and Japan are not good at all, people just haven't shifted attention to them yet. Once serious concern is voiced over these countries' national debt, the US won't be that much further away.

[QUOTE=dvondrake;37639161]What's the point of a debt ceiling if they just keep raising it?[/QUOTE] To know when their next meeting is.

[QUOTE=dvondrake;37639161]What's the point of a debt ceiling if they just keep raising it?[/QUOTE] Maybe a third party should handle it, rather than the people actually in debt.

I wonder if I will get payed if they play fuck fuck games again. The last time the debt ceiling was an issue, there was a military pay freeze.

[QUOTE=mac338;37639152]In a dream world we could remove the Bush tax cuts and decrease military spending, in a good world we could compromise with republicans, in reality we can bicker and do nothing until intrest rates go up and the US ends up bankrupt.[/QUOTE] It's that fucking pledge that the Republicans have to sign in order to remain in the party. If they don't sign Grover Norquist's pledge to never raise taxes and never compromise with the Democrats, then you get destroyed politically by your own party, hence why the Republicans will never compromise in any way, and why the American economic system is so fucked.

So is America just going to ignore the debt and hopes it goes away? Like counting on inflation to reduce the amount of debt they owe? That 1% inflation really adds up if you owe everyone else 417 billion.

I'm beginning to think that the people who are running this country want it to go bankrupt, so they could catch a plane at the last second with a big briefcase and a few thousand-dollar bills popping out from the corners of it. Not that I'm a professional of all this.

Debt Ceiling Round [insert total number of debt ceiling increases to date here]: Electric Boogaloo.

[QUOTE=Laferio;37638933]how are we going to get out of this one?[/QUOTE] Stop spending money we don't have, for a start. But nobody seems interested in doing that.

Is it already time for our annual "Republicans hold the economy hostage to force abortion concessions" fight?

Man-made concepts holding Man's world by the throat? Yes, they are.

I'm curious to see what happens if they don't raise it, sequestration happens, and the Bush tax cuts expire. let's drive right off the fiscal cliff mothafuckaaa~

This is a disaster waiting to happen.

[QUOTE=dvondrake;37639161]What's the point of a debt ceiling if they just keep raising it?[/QUOTE] if we don't raise it the consequences are worse than raising so that's probably why??? fun fact: like a third of the debt is held by the US government.

obviously the only thing we can do is take money from the schools and other important services to pay for it. [sp]Sarcasm[/sp]

That's like my country's GDP. I mean, half my country's GDP.

Really great article on government debt everybody should read because nobody understands how this shit works. [url]http://seekingalpha.com/article/317527-the-burden-we-leave-our-grandchildren[/url] [quote]Remember, for a nation that is sovereign in its currency in a floating exchange rate system there is no such thing as that country being able to “run out of” money (see here if you’re confused already). The USA has a printing press. It can’t run out of US dollars. And it doesn’t borrow dollars that it can create at will. Like the scorekeeper at a football game, the US government is just changing points on the board when it spends and taxes. Spending adds points. Taxing removes points. The point is, there isn’t a big bowl of points that the scorekeeper reaches into before putting points on the board. Likewise, the governments deficit is the non-governments surplus. This is an accounting identity. If the US government creates no money then there are no dollars for the private sector to use. If the government spends $100 into the economy then the government has a $100 deficit and the non-government has a $100 surplus (excuse the simplicity of the example here). This is why you never hear your grandmother say “I wish Uncle Sam would pay off the national debt so I could get rid of my damn savings bonds!” No, grandma’s savings bonds are the government’s deficit.[/quote]