So, after someone was kind enough to share their cold with me, I thought now was as good a time as any to do a little side-by-side audio quality comparison of the XLR & PreAmp set up versus the Condenser USB set up.
[url]https://soundcloud.com/kamran-nikhad/xlr-vs-condensor-usb[/url]
This is mainly for those who contemplate doing anything in the voice acting world. A USB Mic (depending on the mic) is sufficient in and of itself for web videos and commentary. And with a lot of post treatment as well as some additional gear like a VoxGuard, a Kaotica Eyeball, or being in a REALLY well insulated area without hardwood floor, it's passable for video games as well, but at the risk of sounding artificial. Whereas an XLR; while exponentially more expensive, gets pristine audio quality on all volumes (depending on your PreAmp), and is professional grade. Which is why you'll never see any "Behind-The-Scenes" videos of voice actors behind USB mics.
This is also the standard for those who look to make Podcasts or anything along those lines.
A lot of people also don't know how to properly position a microphone for vocal work. Many times they'll use this standard [t]http://therecordingrevolution.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Fig1.gif[/t]
However, even with a pop filter you'll still get plosives.
As much of a cheap MSpaint picture as this is, it's actually correct in how to properly set up your microphone. If you're doing podcast work or whatever and it's next to your desk, you can still have it set up like this as well.
[t]http://theproaudiofiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/IMG_1314-e1429060588283.jpg[/t]
When I record vocals and voice in general, if I'm not supplying a realistic 'raw' sound, I enjoy using [URL="http://www.waves.com/plugins/aphex-vintage-aural-exciter#aphex-vintage-aural-exciter-tutorial"]aphex vintage aural exciter[/URL] which will bring presence and character to my voice.
Thanks for showing this. The sound quality difference between the USB and the mic w/ preamp is HUGE.
Doakes you always make me feel insufficient in my voice work, I wish I had a little more talent to work with. [sp]as well as not having a deviated septum :c[/sp]
[QUOTE=Toats MaGoats;47625009][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sjZJ9i_mH0[/media][/QUOTE]
this dude's video is well made and gets the main point across but he's wrong on so many things, especially the audio engineering side of things. all those people he showed with XLR mics are blatantly rich and famous people who have thousands of dollars to throw on pro gear. the amateur voice actor AND the director in the market for an amateur voice actor will not be demanding 48.1KHz rich audio out of you.
so while the premise of the video is good, there were so many points that, okay maybe he wasn't necessarily wrong, but misguided on the meaning. your Blue Yeti will indeed be good enough for most of your uses (especially if you can get one on sale or otherwise super cheap) because unless you miraculously land a voice acting job that demands super-high-quality audio, it's all going to get mixed down anyway
[QUOTE=FFStudios;47626166]this dude's video is well made and gets the main point across but he's wrong on so many things, especially the audio engineering side of things. all those people he showed with XLR mics are blatantly rich and famous people who have thousands of dollars to throw on pro gear. the amateur voice actor AND the director in the market for an amateur voice actor will not be demanding 48.1KHz rich audio out of you.
so while the premise of the video is good, there were so many points that, okay maybe he wasn't necessarily wrong, but misguided on the meaning. your Blue Yeti will indeed be good enough for most of your uses (especially if you can get one on sale or otherwise super cheap) because unless you miraculously land a voice acting job that demands super-high-quality audio, it's all going to get mixed down anyway[/QUOTE]
You're honestly wasting money on a USB microphone though. You saw the video, it doesn't cost much to get a cheap preamp and an XLR microphone. You don't have to be rich to get this equipment.
Literally every big name gaming mod ALWAYS suffers from poor audio design because they think they can get away with using a usb microphone. [B]IT ALWAYS SOUNDS BAD[/B].
Granted I'm fortunate enough to work with insanely priced, state of the art equipment, but getting good sound with an XLR condenser microphone isn't a hefty investment.
What if I'm looking at getting the Yeti Pro, which is basically a Yeti with an XLR output? Would that be any good or is it tainted by being associated with the Yeti?
[QUOTE=Jamsponge;47626931]What if I'm looking at getting the Yeti Pro, which is basically a Yeti with an XLR output? Would that be any good or is it tainted by being associated with the Yeti?[/QUOTE]
Stick with something without a built in gain knob. Get a XLR audio technica with an interface and you'll be gold.
I have a blue snowball. All I use it for is Skype calls and gaming but damn if I ever needed to do real audio work you can be sure as hell I'm never using that again.
[QUOTE=Toats MaGoats;47627122]Stick with something without a built in gain knob. Get a XLR audio technica with an interface and you'll be gold.
I have a blue snowball. All I use it for is Skype calls and gaming but damn if I ever needed to do real audio work you can be sure as hell I'm never using that again.[/QUOTE]
I'm not planning to do anything professional (maybe some videos of playing games with my friends and some very casual covers or songs, that's it), so do you think not using an interface would be okay? It's just quite a lot of money to spend for now, especially since it's a birthday present (which has probably already been ordered).
[QUOTE=Jamsponge;47627268]I'm not planning to do anything professional (maybe some videos of playing games with my friends and some very casual covers or songs, that's it), so do you think not using an interface would be okay? It's just quite a lot of money to spend for now, especially since it's a birthday present (which has probably already been ordered).[/QUOTE]
Does your soundcard support XLR?
I would recommend an interface because of the low latency, higher bit- & sampling rate (kHz,) a pre-amp and midi support if you need it.
But if you won't actually use any instrument and only use it for some small stuff, you won't need one.
[QUOTE=Toats MaGoats;47625009][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sjZJ9i_mH0[/media][/QUOTE]Haha, that was actually the video that convinced me it was time for an upgrade. However, that said, there is one key point he misses (I don't fault him though, because few people are aware of NCH Suite WavePad Sound Editor's Noise Removal quality), namely Post-Treatment. For example, he notes that you'll never get professional work with a USB mic or any projects of note, and I not only landed a RENOWN client with just the AT2020 USB, but continued landing plenty of work for a number of video games.
[QUOTE][video=youtube;0dAQnuAmpt0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dAQnuAmpt0[/video]
[video=youtube;ev-82CLxMUI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ev-82CLxMUI[/video][/QUOTE]
^For example, all of those were recorded from the AT2020 in the SC link I posted. The video is incredibly insightful and 100% on the money with most points, and especially the technical side of things. However, it neglects how far solid post treatment can take certain mics. (Not the Blue Yeti, mind you.) Because it's not just the USB Mic itself, but it's backed by a VoxGuard *which I eventually traded out for a Kaotica Eyeball*, recorded in a well insulated part of my office, and given extensive Noise Reduction with WavePad Sound Editor. That's why I was initially reluctant about picking up an XLR to begin with; I was naive and didn't think I needed one with the amount of work I was already getting, despite my new location. Then I watched that video, spoke with a number of peers (all of which are full time actors who exceed me), and decided to see just how big a difference in quality there was.
...And as soon as I did, my mind just went blank. All I could think was "Why the HELL didn't I pick this up 7 years ago?!" Yeah, I got plenty of work, but there was an undeniable quality gap. More importantly, post treatment has become a MINIMAL effort, and that's what you need above all else; a microphone that requires the least amount of post-treatment to give you a decent sound.
[QUOTE]It doesn't cost much to get a cheap preamp and an XLR microphone. You don't have to be rich to get this equipment.[/QUOTE]
The AT2035 XLR ran about $150 at Guitar Center, the Scarlett 2i2 PreAmp ran about $200, the Kaotica Eyeball is $200 on the dot, my Aurulex Insulated Foam was $150, and my pop filter was about $30.
So, that XLR Set Up in total, ran me about $730 dollars (not including my old VoxGuard, AT2020 USB, C-Stand or Shockmount, none of which, I use anymore.) The end result is that I get pristine audio quality, and that's paramount when auditioning. However, the LAST thing I would recommend is a "cheap" PreAmp. The PreSonus, for example, only runs for about $90, I believe, and its' input gain is horrendously limited, to where even at its' lowest volume, if you're screaming, you're peaking. I don't have that problem with the Scarlett 2i2, because its' input gain has a far wider margin to choose from, to where I can be screaming at point blank into my mic and it'll sound just fine.
To anyone concerned about the price, the saying "You have to spend money to make money" is an accurate one in the world of Freelance Voice Over. This isn't money you're just spending on a good mic. This is an investment, because the better your audio quality, the likelier you are to land work. I picked up all this equipment near the beginning of January, and already I've almost tripled what I spent. It ultimately falls under what reason you have to get behind the mic. If it's because you want to make a profit or a living, then the bare basics can only take you so far.
Lord knows, I certainly wouldn't have landed 'The Fuse' in Dead Island: Epidemic, if I were still using the AT2020.
Well you literally just shat all over the microphone I use so now I know what's up, I guess it's time to start thinking about upgrading I suppose. I'm glad to hear you're sticking to Audio Technica equipment though, I refuse to use any other gear since I got speakers from them back when they were Acoustic Research years ago. Would it be worth getting a preamp and using the 2020 for the time being before eventually selling it for the AT2035? Or would that just be a waste of time?
I generally had good results with 1/4" jack microphones like the Audio Technica AT9100 even though they are generally in the $30-$70 range. If you get a cheap pop filter, vibration mount and a shitty table lamp you can also make a good stand that mounts anywhere.
[IMG]http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/ballsandy/IMG_6735.jpg[/IMG]
That Matthews rig clamp costs more than the whole setup combined.
Never used a serious external DSP other than the Live! external sound box but I found that the front input jacks on the Audigy 2 ZS were decent enough at the expense of proper preamplification.
Also, I found the best way to make a cheap recording booth was to take the cardboard box from a water heater, line it with cardboard egg cartons and talk away while hiding inside.
[QUOTE=BANNED USER;47632076]Well you literally just shat all over the microphone I use so now I know what's up, I guess it's time to start thinking about upgrading I suppose. I'm glad to hear you're sticking to Audio Technica equipment though, I refuse to use any other gear since I got speakers from them back when they were Acoustic Research years ago. Would it be worth getting a preamp and using the 2020 for the time being before eventually selling it for the AT2035? Or would that just be a waste of time?[/QUOTE]It depends. Like I said, the AT2020 is quite reliable depending on your equipment and treatment. If you're looking to actually make a profit from voice over, definitely look into a proper PreAmp with a wide Gain, but you CAN still make do with the 2020 for as long as you have it.
My advice is look into NCH Suite's WavePad Sound Editor. It should still be freeware and it cleans up lower frequencies like background static MASTERFULLY. It's been my greatest ally with both mics, and made my AT2020 passable enough for a number of great projects.
Also, rather than pick up a PreAmp for when you eventually upgrade to an XLR, I'd instead recommend picking up a Kaotica Eyeball. It's a Godsend with any mic.
[QUOTE=Doakes;47632402]It depends. Like I said, the AT2020 is quite reliable depending on your equipment and treatment. If you're looking to actually make a profit from voice over, definitely look into a proper PreAmp with a wide Gain, but you CAN still make do with the 2020 for as long as you have it.
My advice is look into NCH Suite's WavePad Sound Editor. It should still be freeware and it cleans up lower frequencies like background static MASTERFULLY. It's been my greatest ally with both mics, and made my AT2020 passable enough for a number of great projects.
Also, rather than pick up a PreAmp for when you eventually upgrade to an XLR, I'd instead recommend picking up a Kaotica Eyeball. It's a Godsend with any mic.[/QUOTE]
So get the eyeball for sound isolation and deadening with a nice mic, and then wait on the amp? Sounds like a good plan! I'm downloading the wavepad sound editor now to see how it compares to my setup in audacity, no doubt it'll be better/high quality from what you've told me. Hopefully my deep and gritty voices can find work somewhere in the future.
I recently got an ART Tube MP pre-amp (thanks to a friend here, Kirby2112), and I've been having huge buzzing issues with it. Basically, I'm sure the problem comes from the fact that I've got it plugged into the computer's default motherboard 1/8th inch input from the box's 1/4th inch, but I've been reading that people have had problems with buzzing under different inputs.
Hey thought I would bust in on this discussion with my current low budget setup.
As of right now I am using an MXL 990 with the inner most layer of mesh removed (soon to rebuild the internal board and replace the capsule) along with a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 sitting on a typical telescoping boom with a cheap $15 pop filter. The MXL 990 would never be my first choice in the studio (obviously I would probably pick one of our RE20's, 414's, or our U87 but for a budget mic at the price I got it ($45) I can't complain at all. My only issue which is very minimal thanks to how dead my room is is that I have a little bit of reflections coming back into the mic from my wall but it is not enough to write home about. All in all a cheaper setup that yields nice results.
I wish I had a hobby I could really get into
[QUOTE=BANNED USER;47632479]So get the eyeball for sound isolation and deadening with a nice mic, and then wait on the amp? Sounds like a good plan! I'm downloading the wavepad sound editor now to see how it compares to my setup in audacity, no doubt it'll be better/high quality from what you've told me. Hopefully my deep and gritty voices can find work somewhere in the future.[/QUOTE]I should add that I only use WavePad for Noise Removal, everything else is still recorded either in Audition or Audacity. Basically, I export all raw files in .wav (48KHz) and apply Noise Removal from there for the final product. The reason I export as .wav initially is because .wav is a lossless format that doesn't compress with each passing export the way mp3 does.
Regarding reflection; if your walls are fairly bare, I'd recommend getting Aurulex or any insulated foam and taping them into every corner of your room, since that's where a lot of noise reflects the most.
my videomic pro does well enough for voice communication considering it's a shotgun. no need for xlr or usb, makes for a sweet little portable videocamera setup
[QUOTE=pentium;47632130]I generally had good results with 1/4" jack microphones like the Audio Technica AT9100 even though they are generally in the $30-$70 range. If you get a cheap pop filter, vibration mount and a shitty table lamp you can also make a good stand that mounts anywhere.
[IMG]http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/ballsandy/IMG_6735.jpg[/IMG]
That Matthews rig clamp costs more than the whole setup combined.
Never used a serious external DSP other than the Live! external sound box but I found that the front input jacks on the Audigy 2 ZS were decent enough at the expense of proper preamplification.
Also, I found the best way to make a cheap recording booth was to take the cardboard box from a water heater, line it with cardboard egg cartons and talk away while hiding inside.[/QUOTE]
do not listen to this man
So was getting a AT2020 USB mic a bad choice for when I need to voice my own youtube video's / usage for talking during gaming? I got it when it was going for 149.00 on Amazon.
[QUOTE=Doakes;47633617]I should add that I only use WavePad for Noise Removal, everything else is still recorded either in Audition or Audacity. Basically, I export all raw files in .wav (48KHz) and apply Noise Removal from there for the final product. The reason I export as .wav initially is because .wav is a lossless format that doesn't compress with each passing export the way mp3 does.
Regarding reflection; if your walls are fairly bare, I'd recommend getting Aurulex or any insulated foam and taping them into every corner of your room, since that's where a lot of noise reflects the most.[/QUOTE]
I have plans to get insulation from a local hardware store and making my own bass traps for the corners, and then the bare sections of wall would get some insulating 'pyramid' foam squares I found for cheap online. Good to know wavepad is great for noise removal though, because I'm still much more comfortable with audacity as of right now. Your help is greatly appreciated man.
[editline]30th April 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=nomad1;47634528]So was getting a AT2020 USB mic a bad choice for when I need to voice my own youtube video's / usage for talking during gaming? I got it when it was going for 149.00 on Amazon.[/QUOTE]
For gaming and youtube it's more than adequate, here's a [url=https://soundcloud.com/bannedvoiceworks/have-some-dignity-witcher-antagonist]small sample[/url] of what I've done with it. It's basically me trying to mimic the antagonist from the Witcher 3. I'm no pro but I think it's acceptable for what it is.
[QUOTE=Eric95;47634346]do not listen to this man[/QUOTE]
Do not accept drinks form this man either.
[QUOTE=nomad1;47634528]So was getting a AT2020 USB mic a bad choice for when I need to voice my own youtube video's / usage for talking during gaming? I got it when it was going for 149.00 on Amazon.[/QUOTE]Not at all. It's not only perfectly sufficient for youtube videos and personal usage, but with the right equipment, it works for professional gigs as well. But without them, the compression is a bit more noticeable.
It's ultimately dependent on what you aim to get out of voice over.
@BANNED USER: My pleasure!
If you plan on doing serious work you should get in the habit of not using audacity
Meh, I record in audacity and do everything after that into Audition. Reason being that Audition is really fucky with all my audio hardware.
[QUOTE=redBadger;47641445]If you plan on doing serious work you should get in the habit of not using audacity[/QUOTE]
audacity does what it does well though?
[editline]2nd May 2015[/editline]
i mean, if you're going to be using industry std tools then don't use audacity. but if you're working from home...whatever works for you is good.
decent plugin support, free, plenty of community resources available at also no cost
[QUOTE=.Lain;47641570]audacity does what it does well though?
[editline]2nd May 2015[/editline]
i mean, if you're going to be using industry std tools then don't use audacity. but if you're working from home...whatever works for you is good.
decent plugin support, free, plenty of community resources available at also no cost[/QUOTE]
I think if you're just trying to do a quick recording, but for nothing else really.
[QUOTE=redBadger;47641714]I think if you're just trying to do a quick recording, but for nothing else really.[/QUOTE]Not necessarily. If you're talking JUST Audacity, then yes, it's as reliable to voice actors as Windows Movie Maker is to film editors, because; unless you're using a multi-thousand dollar XLR, you're still going to have background static, and Audacity is utterly incapable of removing it. And the fact that you can't just drag your wavelength around the way you can Audition or Premiere makes the trimming process exponentially more tedious than it should ever have to be.
It's absolutely true that the industry standard is Audition, which clients have specifically requested a lot of times. However, Audacity works just fine in regards to basic recording and plug-in effects. I've used it on nearly every video game and commercial I've been a part of, and the audio quality is ultimately the same as what I'd get from Audition, because I don't use EQ on either or or DARE tamper with Audacity's God awful Noise Reduction. Straight recording and plug-ins used specifically for effects and not for the sake of adjusting the audio quality and Audacity is more than sufficient (courtesy of outstanding Noise Removal from NCH Suite's WavePad Sound Editor.)
The user interface is the bare basic, however, whereas Audition's interface is as smooth and seamless as Premiere. But 9.9 times out of 10, that's irrelevant, because most clients who direct you personally will want a raw export without any tampering anyway. The rest will usually just want the cleanest audio you can get, and you can get crystal clean audio with the Audacity and NCH Suite WavePad Sound Editor combo.
Audition is absolutely worth the investment, but you CAN get away without using it. I have it and I'd say only 20% of any of my work ever came from it.
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