No vote gains 8 point lead in Scottish Independence referendum. - Polidicks

[img]http://i.huffpost.com/gen/2056882/thumbs/o-ORANGE-ORDER-SCOTLAND-570.jpg[/img] [i]Members of the Orange Order marched against independence in Edinburgh today[/i] [quote]The latest Scottish independence poll published today has given the no campaign an eight-point lead. After last week's Yougov poll placed Yes support at 51%, Westminster has roared into action, with all three major party leaders rushing to Scotland to campaign for a No vote. Now, the latest Survation poll gives the No campaign a lead of 54% to 46% - when undecided voters are excluded. It comes after a Survation poll for the Daily Record on Tuesday found 53% of Scots plan to vote No on September 18, with 47% saying they will vote for independence, excluding undecided voters. The poll also found that 40% of voters believe they and their families would be financially worse off compared to 27% who believe they would be better off. The survey was conducted between September 10 and 12.[/quote] [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/09/13/scottish-independence-survation-poll_n_5815374.html[/url] It's damn close, I hope the No Vote wins out.

To be honest, no matter how the referendum is going to play out, half of Scotland is not going to be amused.

So what is facepunch's side of this ordeal so I can completely block out my own opinion and follow facepunch's.

[QUOTE=redBadger;45974485]So what is facepunch's side of this ordeal so I can completely block out my own opinion and follow facepunch's.[/QUOTE] No to independence because the cost of it outweighs the benefits it provides I suppose. That's what my view boils down to.

[QUOTE=Malos;45974477]To be honest, no matter how the referendum is going to play out, half of Scotland is not going to be amused.[/QUOTE] And in the long run a lot of people will still be disappointed in the government still.

[QUOTE=redBadger;45974485]So what is facepunch's side of this ordeal so I can completely block out my own opinion and follow facepunch's.[/QUOTE] Last time i consulted the Facepunch Elders they said we should all agree on independence being a bad idea.

[QUOTE=redBadger;45974485]So what is facepunch's side of this ordeal so I can completely block out my own opinion and follow facepunch's.[/QUOTE] It doesn't seem like there has been a consensus on whether or not Scotland should be independent.

[QUOTE=redBadger;45974485]So what is facepunch's side of this ordeal so I can completely block out my own opinion and follow facepunch's.[/QUOTE] I want Scotland to stay in the Union because I don't like drawing lines on my globe.

It's not really worth paying attention to any individual polls now. All we can say is that it's really really close. Also, this poll in particular was [url=http://blog.whatscotlandthinks.org/2014/09/survation-phone-poll-gets-much-result/]commissioned by the No campaign[/url] for what it's worth [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] I think this is the first political campaign I've followed where I really don't know what's going to happen. In a lot of cases if you just read a few polls and articles it's pretty clear who's going to win, but not here. If I had to choose I'd say No will probably edge it but really it's too close to call.

The idea of this being decided by a simple majority is so fucking stupid. I wouldn't be surprised at all if there're riots in Scotland, no matter what the result.

[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;45974818]The idea of this being decided by a simple majority is so fucking stupid. I wouldn't be surprised at all if there're riots in Scotland, no matter what the result.[/QUOTE] It should either be a 2/3rds majority or a 1/2 simple majority followed by another 1/2 simple majority twelve months later.

I keep thinking that these threads are saying that neither vote is gaining a lead.

[QUOTE=download;45974906]It should either be a 2/3rds majority or a 1/2 simple majority followed by another 1/2 simple majority twelve months later.[/QUOTE] But then the referendum would be heavily biased towards the status quo, it wouldn't be a free vote

[QUOTE=smurfy;45975019]But then the referendum would be heavily biased towards the status quo, it wouldn't be a free vote[/QUOTE] Well a 1/2 simple majority followed by another 1/2 simple majority twelve months later wouldn't be. All it would do is make sure people aren't making a rash decision.

[QUOTE=download;45975901]Well a 1/2 simple majority followed by another 1/2 simple majority twelve months later wouldn't be. All it would do is make sure people aren't making a rash decision.[/QUOTE] It would. You would need two votes to pass to beat the status quo, while either one failing would mean status quo stays. It's still 2:1. The way you could kinda ease it would be having a new vote periodically forever, and whenever 2 would pass in a row, it would drop. Still not fair for Yes, tho. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Don't get me wrong I think the entire ordeal is retarded but having to pass a vote twice in order for it to have effect is NOT fair and NOT democratic, as long as you want to play that game.

[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;45974818]The idea of this being decided by a simple majority is so fucking stupid. I wouldn't be surprised at all if there're riots in Scotland, no matter what the result.[/QUOTE] I know that no matter what the outcome of this, the side that lost is going to be talking to the media for months afterwards about how the results are bullshit.

I'm biased towards Yes because it won't have much impact on me and I think it'll be interesting to watch.

I don't really have any opinion on either side, but I can say that it is nice that the people can decide themselves.

[QUOTE=Blanketspace;45976098]I'm biased towards Yes because it won't have much impact on me and I think it'll be interesting to watch.[/QUOTE] I hope the Republicans win your next election.

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;45975983]It would. You would need two votes to pass to beat the status quo, while either one failing would mean status quo stays. It's still 2:1. The way you could kinda ease it would be having a new vote periodically forever, and whenever 2 would pass in a row, it would drop. Still not fair for Yes, tho. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Don't get me wrong I think the entire ordeal is retarded but having to pass a vote twice in order for it to have effect is NOT fair and NOT democratic, as long as you want to play that game.[/QUOTE] What about: One vote on whether to negotiate the terms of independence and then another vote on whether Scotland wants independence on the terms given?

[QUOTE=Robert9734;45976251]I hope the Republicans win your next election.[/QUOTE] This is how FPers fight "You MOTHERFUCKER, I hope your preferred party doesn't do so well in the next midterm elections and loses its Senate majority cunt"

I have a feeling that if it did end up that: -The subs are staying long term (likely) -No currency union (very possible) -Significant debt (likely) -High costs of setting up the new gov etc (unavoidable) etc etc A lot of yes voters would rather stay part of the union. Edit: Smurfy my merge :suicide: not trusting it again. As someone in England, I don't really mind what you do as long as the deal is fair both sides of the border because I don't want a currency union unless it makes economic sense for the UK and tbh that would likely involve shared or closely linked fiscal policy, at which point why have independence?

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;45975983]It would. You would need two votes to pass to beat the status quo, while either one failing would mean status quo stays. It's still 2:1. The way you could kinda ease it would be having a new vote periodically forever, and whenever 2 would pass in a row, it would drop. Still not fair for Yes, tho. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Don't get me wrong I think the entire ordeal is retarded but having to pass a vote twice in order for it to have effect is NOT fair and NOT democratic, as long as you want to play that game.[/QUOTE] How the hell is that 2:1? It's a 50% vote that just makes sure no one is making a knee jerk reaction to something.

[QUOTE=download;45976312]How the hell is that 2:1? It's a 50% vote that just makes sure no one is making a knee jerk reaction to something.[/QUOTE] If you have to get two times Yes but one time No for it to be decisive, it's definitely not balanced and fair. And how can you call a knee jerk on something that has been discussed since like, year ago? [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Let me put it the other way, if it's fair lets say that there will be two votes 12 months apart and if either one of these is yes, the split will happen. Still sounds fair to you?

hmm [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/fcVvhqX.png[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;45976394]If you have to get two times Yes but one time No for it to be decisive, it's definitely not balanced and fair. And how can you call a knee jerk on something that has been discussed since like, year ago? [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Let me put it the other way, if it's fair lets say that there will be two votes 12 months apart and if either one of these is yes, the split will happen. Still sounds fair to you?[/QUOTE] you know what, this has been going on for two years, the yes vote is increasing every day - here's the number for the electoral commission scotland if you want to debate the voting system being used The Electoral Commission Lothian Chambers 59-63 George IV Bridge Edinburgh EH1 1RN Tel: +44 131 225 0200 [email]infoscotland@electoralcommission.org.uk[/email]

[QUOTE=smurfy;45975019]But then the referendum would be heavily biased towards the status quo, it wouldn't be a free vote[/QUOTE] Well similar how most changes towards a constitution of a country require a qualified majority. Something so important, so deeply changing should also need one. At least 3/5ths

[QUOTE=wraithcat;45976441]Well similar how most changes towards a constitution of a country require a qualified majority. Something so important, so deeply changing should also need one. At least 3/5ths[/QUOTE] Yea, my concern would be that something bad might happen and a group uses said tragedy to push through a referendum and have some sort of right stripped away. Then, not long after once everyone has cooled off they realise they did something dumb.

Meanwhile in Glasgow... [IMG]https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10609533_893036947388002_4206267862277933231_n.jpg?oh=997f5feb263cd5c27f24834302f12a4a&oe=54997CFF[/IMG]

Yeah I wouldn't take that statistic seriously. Apparently the yes vote was 8 points ahead yesterday.