Thousands have died after being found fit for work in the UK - Polidicks

[quote] Nearly 90 people a month are dying shortly after being declared fit for work, according to new data that has prompted campaigners and Labour leadership contenders to call for an overhaul of the government’s welfare regime. Statistics released by the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) on Thursday revealed that [url=https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/mortality-statistics-esa-ib-and-sda-claimants]2,380 people died between December 2011 and February 2014[/url] within 14 days of being taken off employment and support allowance (ESA) because a work capability assessment (WCA) had concluded they were able to work. Ministers insisted that the data could not be used to link claimant deaths to its welfare reforms, but the figures focused attention on the government’s fit-for-work assessment process, which has been dogged by controversy in recent years.[/quote] [url=http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/aug/27/thousands-died-after-fit-for-work-assessment-dwp-figures?CMP=fb_gu]Source, from The Guardian[/url]

It's worth pointing out that the data doesn't specify the cause of death in these instances, so you can only really correlate the timing.

[quote]The figures also revealed that between December 2011 and February 2014, 50,580 recipients of ESA had died within seven days. Of this number, 2,380 – or 4% – had received a decision that they were fit for work, meaning that they were at risk of losing their ESA benefit. Another 7,200 claimants had died after being awarded ESA and being placed in the separate work-related activity group – a category which identifies claimants who are unfit to work but may be able to return to work in the future.[/quote] So it's probably best that we don't jump to conclusions, especially as they don't show the cause of each death.

[QUOTE=Wiggles;48555868]It's worth pointing out that the data doesn't specify the cause of death in these instances, so you can only really correlate the timing.[/QUOTE] While it's probably true that a few of those deaths were probably completely unrelated to their previous disability or illness, the sheer size of that number suggests there is still a major issue that needs to be examined here.

"Welfare reforms", ah yes the old trick of giving people who are examined 0 points and hoping they don't contest it via tribunal. Seriously, when I had my reexamination, the guy gave me ZERO points, contested it, got to my tribunal, the judge and two doctors didn't take long to award me 33 points, more than double that was needed, and so high intact I got put into a special bracket. There's a reason I refer to that company as ATOSsers. Its quite stressful worrying that you'll get kicked off it, wonder if that directly correlated with suicides (there's been quite a few related to losing benefits) or if the stress from it exacerbated existing health problems. It really is stressful, to the point where I suffer bad from anxiety every morning when the postman comes round because I dread getting a telltale brown envelope from the DWP.

[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;48556040][IMG]http://facepunch.com/fp/emotes/clickbait.gif[/IMG] Seriously[/QUOTE] How exactly? The thread title described the content of the article efficiently enough...

[QUOTE=RayvenQ;48556524]"Welfare reforms", ah yes the old trick of giving people who are examined 0 points and hoping they don't contest it via tribunal. Seriously, when I had my reexamination, the guy gave me ZERO points, contested it, got to my tribunal, the judge and two doctors didn't take long to award me 33 points, more than double that was needed, and so high intact I got put into a special bracket. There's a reason I refer to that company as ATOSsers. Its quite stressful worrying that you'll get kicked off it, wonder if that directly correlated with suicides (there's been quite a few related to losing benefits) or if the stress from it exacerbated existing health problems. It really is stressful, to the point where I suffer bad from anxiety every morning when the postman comes round because I dread getting a telltale brown envelope from the DWP.[/QUOTE] My girlfriend used to work for DWP, while she was there she described to me what essentially sounded like an "us verses them" attitude in the workforce, especially regarding people who were appealing against the result of a tribunal.

My grandmother had terminal cancer and was told she was fit to work two weeks before ahe died. It's a system which needs some serious revision.

[QUOTE=RayvenQ;48556524]"Welfare reforms", ah yes the old trick of giving people who are examined 0 points and hoping they don't contest it via tribunal. Seriously, when I had my reexamination, the guy gave me ZERO points, contested it, got to my tribunal, the judge and two doctors didn't take long to award me 33 points, more than double that was needed, and so high intact I got put into a special bracket. There's a reason I refer to that company as ATOSsers. Its quite stressful worrying that you'll get kicked off it, wonder if that directly correlated with suicides (there's been quite a few related to losing benefits) or if the stress from it exacerbated existing health problems. It really is stressful, to the point where I suffer bad from anxiety every morning when the postman comes round because I dread getting a telltale brown envelope from the DWP.[/QUOTE] ATOS is a scummy organisation. My friend is a military veteran and is struggling with physical and mental disability stemming from his time in the service. ATOS has been curb-stomping him for over a year. His mobility is severely restricted, yet his evaluations are scheduled at places where he physically can't even get to. He lacks the know-how on how to fight this sort of thing. I've been helping him navigate the bureaucratic maze and legal wrangles to get things sorted, write appeals and such. Things are finally starting to sort themselves out. He was on his way to get a teacher's education and in his final year. Then ATOS took everything away from him. He's had to quit school, lost his kids (since he is simply unable to financially support them now) and has had periods where he had a meal once every two days. He was [i]this[/i] close to losing his home. It's like he's living in a third world country. But he's not. It feels like some cruel joke. But it's not. He's a fucking veteran and they treat him like garbage. It's disgusting. Despite him showing documentation and bank statements from his military pension, they don't believe he is a veteran and just dismiss his claims. If it wasn't for his pension, he'd be 6 feet under. I don't even live in the UK, yet from everything he's told me, I think ATOS is one of the scummiest and vile organisations in the world. They prey on the disabled to save a few bucks.

[QUOTE=LordLoss;48558796]My girlfriend used to work for DWP, while she was there she described to me what essentially sounded like an "us verses them" attitude in the workforce, especially regarding people who were appealing against the result of a tribunal.[/QUOTE] Probably because the DWP was in the wrong and they knew it, just mad that people used their right to a tribunal. Seriously, for my tribunal, about 4-5 other people went in before more, all of them came back out, celebrating, because they'd awarded the benefits. by a group of people who aren't under orders from the government to try and axe as many people as they can. It's less the DWP that i have a problem with (except for sanctions, don't get me started on those) and more ATOS, for being useless fucks who fail people purposely. I know lowest bidder and all, but how the fuck a French IT company got awarded to do medical exams, I never know. And they're the most bullshit exams ever. THey pretty much re-ask you everything you've filled out on the form, , maybe do a slight examination on how your joints move, and thats it (my physical examination lasted less than a minute, how the fuck you could properly assess someone with that I dont know) Oh and if you sit down too much, they'll knock points off, if you stand up and move around too much, they'll knock points off.

Wait, if you are declared fit to work you dont become immortal? For all we know, this is within the normal death rate for people in general. As in: Thousands have died after drinking tap water in the UK.

[QUOTE=taipan;48558932]Wait, if you are declared fit to work you dont become immortal? For all we know, this is within the normal death rate for people in general. As in: Thousands have died after drinking tap water in the UK.[/QUOTE] I can't even begin to state how stupid this post is.

[QUOTE=Enola;48559720]I can't even begin to state how stupid this post is.[/QUOTE] How so? If 90 people a month are dying shortly after being declared fit for work, that only has meaning if we know other things. Such as how many people in total are being declared fit for work every month? If 10,000 people every month are being declared fit for work, and only 90 of them die shortly after, then maybe the one thing has nothing to do with the other. Another point: the article says over 7,000 who got ESA died, that's three times the number who were declared fit for work. So more people who qualified died than people who were denied. That kind of undercuts the idea that the denial was a primary cause of death.

Here's a short article by Ben Goldacre about why we need more data before we're able to properly evaluate this. [url]https://storify.com/bengoldacre/how-dwp-has-confused-everyone-by-releasing-the-rig[/url]

[QUOTE=Enola;48559720]I can't even begin to state how stupid this post is.[/QUOTE] Please do. Because im not getting why this would be stupid.