[quote]
But while the adventures of Clary (in The Mortal Instruments) or Bella (in Twilight) act as a great self-esteem boost for female readers, reassuring them that it's okay to be shy or wish you were prettier or more popular, what messages do they send male readers? Have you ever read a piece of teen fiction in which a female protagonist falls in love with a boy who carries too much weight around his waist? Or one with a beautiful closed-mouth smile, because his front teeth are yellowing? Are we romantically inclined readers to assume that we can only settle for dashing, brooding, confident boys (often with supernatural powers)? These days, the media is continuously harassed for the way female beauty and body image is portrayed. But if Edward Cullen had a big nose and forgot to sparkle in the sunlight, would Bella still have fallen for him? Maybe not. Then again, readers will never know.
As a lover of romantic fiction, I often catch myself wondering why I never seem to meet any gorgeous, nice, successful, wealthy, intelligent, funny, sensitive (the list could go on) men in my own life. I can't help but wonder how I would take it if things were reversed - if male protagonists were always shown to fall for beautiful, fun, witty, confident, wealthy, kind girl-gamers, and men began expecting the same in real life. Surely, we'd crush their unrealistic expectations immediately.
It's not good enough to argue that romance is a genre written for girls. Teenage boys are well aware of it, particularly with all the book-to-film adaptations hitting the cinemas. Instead of giving boys a self-esteem boost like they do for many young women, these stories tell them that a girl won't fall in love with their underbite or their braces.
[/quote]
[url]http://www.theguardian.com/childrens-books-site/2014/jan/16/teen-romantic-fiction-bad-boys[/url]
Maybe someone should start a kickstarter for an online video series called "Tropes vs Males in Teen Romantic Fiction".
I don't know that many guys who read romantic fiction though...
(ps it's not targeted at boys you pieces of shit)
How was Bella a self-esteem boost? She was useless at pretty much everything and spent most of the time needing rescue or acting dumb.
[QUOTE=Reshy;43558682]How was Bella a self-esteem boost? She was useless at pretty much everything and spent most of the time needing rescue or acting dumb.[/QUOTE]
I have not read twilight but I think the point is that despite her flaws someone who is basically perfect falls in love with her.
[editline]16th January 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=slamex;43558670]I don't know that many guys who read romantic fiction though...[/QUOTE]
[quote]It's not good enough to argue that romance is a genre written for girls. Teenage boys are well aware of it, particularly with all the book-to-film adaptations hitting the cinemas.[/quote]
[QUOTE=Reshy;43558682]How was Bella a self-esteem boost? She was useless at pretty much everything and spent most of the time needing rescue or acting dumb.[/QUOTE]
It's a confidence booster because it tells young girls that it's okay to always need rescuing and act dumb.
[QUOTE=Reshy;43558682]How was Bella a self-esteem boost? She was useless at pretty much everything and spent most of the time needing rescue or acting dumb.[/QUOTE]
yeah shes useless in everyway but she gets the guy she wants
[quote]I have not read twilight but I think the point is that despite her flaws someone who is basically perfect falls in love with her.[/quote]
Except He's not "perfect" at all, infact rather fucking creepy.
[quote]It's not good enough to argue that romance is a genre written for girls. Teenage boys are well aware of it, particularly with all the book-to-film adaptations hitting the cinema.[/quote]
If that is the case case, I think it should be that women can't expect all guys to be like that in their books. Just like all men can't expect women to be supermodels or porn stars.
when you look at it from an outside POV, but he's portrayed in-series as being this perfect being.
and bella lusts after him like a housewife after the plumber.
It goes both ways, don't see what this article is trying to point out.
[QUOTE=lintz;43558812]when you look at it from an outside POV, but he's portrayed in-series as being this perfect being.
and bella lusts after him like a housewife after the plumber.[/QUOTE]
portrayed in series as being a perfect being, by the main character, who is dumber than a fucking rock.
I've learned to make it work to my advantage.
[I]BDA stares intently at his monitor, lips pursed. He takes a slow, but intense bite of his sandwich, never blinking.[/I]
I'd suppose not? Maybe it puts expectations too high when compared to reality. Then again if you think vampires and werewolves exist you might need to re-evaluate your perception of reality.
[QUOTE=Reshy;43558682]How was Bella a self-esteem boost? She was useless at pretty much everything and spent most of the time needing rescue or acting dumb.[/QUOTE]
Don't forget she was also pretty blank as a character mainly for projection purposes
[QUOTE=Glitchman;43558821]It goes both ways, don't see what this article is trying to point out.[/QUOTE]
The article is trying to point out just that, that it does goes both ways. Often whenever someone brings this up it's just hand waved as idealized males being self-inserts for male readers and therefore not sexist. These are books aimed at females and are doing just what video games and movies are criticised for doing to women.
[QUOTE=slamex;43558670]I don't know that many guys who read romantic fiction though...[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=lintz;43558674](ps it's not targeted at boys you pieces of shit)[/QUOTE]
This argument worked wonders in the tropes vs women debate.
[sp]by worked I mean didnt work[/sp]
the problem is there is too much crap out there, like hunger games and twilight right now
i mean substance wise these books are just crap and conflicting crap too. most of these romance books always show the main character being just bad at everything and everybody else is just as bad, yet things work out somehow. i mean hunger games just makes no sense at all, also i dare you to find a romance author that is a guy, because there aren't many. the only good romances ive read are in books like forgotten realms where it can't be crap because it has to fit in with the universe
[QUOTE=RayvenQ;43558827]portrayed in series as being a perfect being, by the main character, who is dumber than a fucking rock.[/QUOTE]
yes exactly, thus is the way that meyer projects her own desires of the flesh onto bella.
[QUOTE=Mr.95;43558871]
Don't forget she was also pretty blank as a character mainly for projection purposes[/QUOTE]
thats just a mark of a very poor writer....
there's a reason why drizzt has been in books for 20+ years and twilight burned out quickly, because you can't fix poorly written characters
[QUOTE=Sableye;43558910]the problem is there is too much crap out there, like hunger games and twilight right now
i mean substance wise these books are just crap and conflicting crap too. most of these romance books always show the main character being just bad at everything and everybody else is just as bad, yet things work out somehow. i mean hunger games just makes no sense at all, also i dare you to find a romance author that is a guy, because there aren't many. the only good romances ive read are in books like forgotten realms where it can't be crap because it has to fit in with the universe[/QUOTE]
i dont think hunger games is quite on the same level as twilight, although i've only briefly read twilight and haven't read hunger games.
I dont get the not targeted at men/boys argument for romance novels/movies. Nobody would accept the argument that it is not targeted at women/girl when they are portrayed unrealistically.
I also dont respect the argument that "it is just another symptom of the patriarchy" as if that justifies a lack of action. Regardless of if it is done to appeal to women or male power fantasies it has a negative affect and people should speak out. The assumption that males are somehow less affected by inaccurate portrayals in media is silly.
[QUOTE=Sableye;43558910]the problem is there is too much crap out there, like hunger games and twilight right now
i mean substance wise these books are just crap and conflicting crap too. most of these romance books always show the main character being just bad at everything and everybody else is just as bad, yet things work out somehow. i mean hunger games just makes no sense at all, also i dare you to find a romance author that is a guy, because there aren't many. the only good romances ive read are in books like forgotten realms where it can't be crap because it has to fit in with the universe[/QUOTE]
Most dudes have a very different perception of romance than women seem to have. An idealized male romance novel would be too short to publish, because it'd skip all the weird sexual tension and emotional games and go directly from the delicious meaty dinner to the bedroom.
[QUOTE=imptastick;43558946]I dont get the not targeted at men/boys argument for romance novels/movies. Nobody would accept the argument that it is not targeted at women/girl when they are portrayed unrealistically.
I also dont respect the argument that "it is just another symptom of the patriarchy" as if that justifies a lack of action. Regardless of if it is done to appeal to women or male power fantasies it has a negative affect and people should speak out. The assumption that males are somehow less affected by inaccurate portrayals in media is silly.[/QUOTE]People who get affected are ruining fiction. It is fiction, be it male or female power fantasy. It's called fantasy for a reason.
Are these type of novels really good for anyone?
[QUOTE=A B.A. Survivor;43558729]It's a confidence booster because it tells young girls that it's okay to always need rescuing and act dumb.[/QUOTE]
no, it's not that. it's worse. it (twilight in general) tells young girls that abusive relationships are okay.
[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;43558967]Most dudes have a very different perception of romance than women seem to have. An idealized male romance novel would be too short to publish, because it'd skip all the weird sexual tension and emotional games and go directly from the delicious meaty dinner to the bedroom.[/QUOTE]
not really... guys are just as bad as women with that stuff, its just most writers of romantic stuff are women or they don't make it a huge part of the plot
Nah, depends on the guy, mine would just lack the games but still be the same [I]slow[/I] build.
[QUOTE=Sableye;43559025]not really... guys are just as bad as women with that stuff, its just most writers of romantic stuff are women or they don't make it a huge part of the plot[/QUOTE]
He's making a joke.
[QUOTE=itisjuly;43558978]People who get affected are ruining fiction. It is fiction, be it male or female power fantasy. It's called fantasy for a reason.[/QUOTE]
I can respect this argument 100%, the argument I dont respect is change it for females and not for males and vice versa.
[I]Marco patted his belly and leaned back in his chair, content. The entire roasted chicken he'd just consumed sat in his gut, still radiating warmth through his core. He smiled. "Thank you for dinner, Julia. That was great."
Julia tore open her blouse and hiked up her skirt, indicating that it was Banging Time. Marco rang the Sex Gong and went to work.[/I]
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