Holocaust Museum Pulls Study Absolving Obama Administration for Inaction in Face of Syrian Genocide - Polidicks

[quote]A major United States Holocaust Memorial Museum study of the Obama Administration’s Syria policy was put on hold last night after portions of the study given to Tablet were greeted with shock and harsh criticism by prominent Jewish communal leaders and thinkers. According to a publicity email sent by the Museum, the study was set to be launched at an event at the US Institute for Peace in Washington, D.C., on September 11 and was overseen by a former US intelligence and national security official under Obama, Cameron Hudson, now director of the Simon-Skjodt Center for the Prevention of Genocide. The paper argued that “a variety of factors, which were more or less fixed, made it very difficult from the beginning for the US government to take effective action to prevent atrocities in Syria, even compared with other challenging policy contexts.” Using computational modeling and game theory methods, as well as interviews with experts and policymakers, the report asserted that greater support for the anti-Assad rebels and US strikes on the Assad regime after the August 2013 Ghouta chemical weapons attack would not have reduced atrocities in the country, and might conceivably have contributed to them. The intervention of the Holocaust Museum in a hot-button political dispute—and the apparent excuse of official US government inaction in the face of large-scale mass murder, complete with the gassing of civilians and government-run crematoria—alarmed many Jewish communal figures. “The first thing I have to say is: Shame on the Holocaust Museum,” said Leon Wieseltier, the literary critic and fellow at the Brookings Institution, who slammed the Museum for “releasing an allegedly scientific study that justifies bystanderism.” The Museum’s exercise in counter-factual history, he suggested, was inherently absurd. “If I had the time I would gin up a parody version of this that will give us the computational-modeling algorithmic counterfactual analysis of John J McCloy’s decision not to bomb the Auschwitz ovens in 1944. I’m sure we could concoct the fucking algorithms for that, too.” While examining the US’s response to the conflict arguably falls within the Museum’s stated purpose of “inspiring citizens and leaders to confront hatred, prevent genocide, and promote human dignity,” it is unclear how producing work that could be used to justify or excuse official inaction in the face of war crimes committed by Bashar al-Assad’s regime in Syria squares with that mission. Since the outbreak of civil war early 2011, the Syrian dictator has repeatedly attacked civilians with poison gas, maintaining a network of prison camps where as many as 60,000 people have been tortured, murdered, and disappeared, with their bodies dumped into crematoria and mass graves. “I assume the leadership understands that it made a misstep,” said Abraham Foxman, the director of the Center of the Study of Anti-Semitism at the Museum of Jewish Heritage-A Living Memorial to the History. “I served three times on the Holocaust Commission. The institution is very dear to my heart. And I believe that it’s appropriate—indeed, it’s imperative—for the Museum deal with questions of genocide in contemporary current events. But in this case, several things are happening that are problematic. First, the genocide isn’t over. In the case of Rwanda and Bosnia, for example, the genocides were over and the Museum was able to offer its assessment in hindsight. Two, more broadly I just don’t think it’s appropriate for the Museum to issue this kind of judgement—that’s beyond its mandate. This should be a place where one meets to discuss, to debate, to question, to challenge: Could more have been done? Where? How? Not to issue judgment, especially not in this politicized atmosphere.” Some Jewish communal leaders suggested both privately to Tablet, and in conversations with board members and staff at the Holocaust Museum, that the Museum’s moral authority had been hijacked for a partisan re-writing of recent history, and alleged that the museum had absolved the Obama administration of any moral or political error in its response to mass atrocities in Syria. At least one of the architects of the Obama administration policy in Syria, former deputy national security advisor Ben Rhodes, was appointed to the museum’s Memorial Council during the closing days of the Obama administration. The Council also includes Obama NSC alumni Grant Harris and Daniel Benjamin. Other Obama NSC alumni, including Hudson and Anna Cave, have joined the Museum’s staff.[/quote] [url]http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/244567/holocaust-museum-pulls-study-absolving-obama-administration-for-inaction-in-face-of-syrian-genocide[/url] [url]http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/holocaust-museum-pulls-syria-study-defending-obama/article/2633527[/url]

Is there genocide happening in Syria? Last I checked it was just a Civil War. edit: there is a huge loss of life either way but the distinction ought to be made.

So from what I understand, and can someone please call me out where I'm wrong, a jewish community is upset with the holocaust museum for releasing a report of scientific data that concerns US intervention because it's lead to caution and in-action when astrocities are going on in Syria? [editline]7th September 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Lambeth;52655584]Is there genocide happening in Syria? Last I checked it was just a Civil War. edit: there is a huge loss of life either way but the distinction ought to be made.[/QUOTE] Didn't we hear about gigantic prisons and such a while back? Like death camps?

[QUOTE=MrJazzy;52655665]So from what I understand, and can someone please call me out where I'm wrong, a jewish community is upset with the holocaust museum for releasing a report of scientific data that concerns US intervention because it's lead to caution and in-action when astrocities are going on in Syria? [editline]7th September 2017[/editline] Didn't we hear about gigantic prisons and such a while back? Like death camps?[/QUOTE] The Jewish community is upset that the Holocaust is being used for petty circlejerking about how Obama did nothing wrong because the political conditions in Syria were too complex. You could argue the same about any country that was fighting against the Nazis in WW2. Also, this report ignores the input of people who actually know shit about syria [QUOTE]The Museum apparently undertook its Syria project without the usual degree of input from Washington’s community of Syrian activists who had worked with the Holocaust Museum to bring the Ceasar files and video from the besieged city of Aleppo to light. Given that the Museum had previously worked hard to expose Syrian government atrocities, members of the anti-Assad community found the counterfactuals report to be curiously out of character for the museum, and objected to the report’s seeming vindication of US policy. “If the reports are saying that nothing could have been done for Syria, this is something that every Syrian American I know considers grossly incorrect,” Shlomo Bolts, a policy and advocacy officer with the Syrian American Council noted to me. “There was a lot that could have been done and that can still be done to stop the mass atrocities in Syria. There are still thousands of civilians in Syria who are being tortured in Assad’s jails or fear imminent attacks by Assad forces and there is much that can be done to help them.”[/QUOTE] For fuck's sake, even Israel managed to help Syrians during this conflict in operation Good Neighbor and Israel is at war with Syria. The US could have definitely done something. [QUOTE]Rabbi Shmuly Yanklowitz, co-founder of Jews for Human Rights in Syria, who has worked with the Holocaust Museum and the Syrian community, said he was baffled by the report. [/QUOTE] The fact that I agree with this rabbi who is a disgrace to Judaism shows how fucked this entire report is.

^ I'm pretty sure we have been trying to do something, the only thing that has worked though is holding the line in iraq and pushing back to syria, imagine how much worse things would have been if the kurds got taken over, isis would have had iraq's oilfields, and would have done wholesale genocide on them . to say obama did nothing is wrong. to say he was responsible for genocide in syria is just daft, like blaming the US for not stoping the nazis sooner

I'd have to see the full report, specifically the part about [QUOTE]other challenging policy contexts[/QUOTE] I'm generally critical of how the Obama admin handled Syria but a lot of the people complaining about this report seem to be of the type of people who think American intervention should have been much greater in scope, which is something that was likely politically untenable for the US government at the time. [editline]7th September 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Svinnik;52655712] For fuck's sake, even Israel managed to help Syrians during this conflict in operation Good Neighbor and Israel is at war with Syria. The US could have definitely done something. [/QUOTE] This is the crux of the problem, illustrated with the line above the ones you quoted [QUOTE]It exposed him to sharp criticism around the world, as activists and foreign policy leaders believed the United States had flinched despite moral and strategic reasons for confronting adversaries in the country.[/QUOTE] People who aren't Americans expected America to intervene, when most Americans had absolutely no interest in an extended intervention. [QUOTE=Svinnik;52655712] The fact that I agree with this rabbi who is a disgrace to Judaism shows how fucked this entire report is.[/QUOTE] Do you have a link to the entire report?

Personally, I think it's actually impossible to accurately predict the results of these "what if" scenarios in the past. All we can do is make the best decision at the time.

just yet another example of damned if you do damned if you don't

[QUOTE=Svinnik;52655712]The Jewish community is upset that the Holocaust is being used for petty circlejerking about how Obama did nothing wrong because the political conditions in Syria were too complex. You could argue the same about any country that was fighting against the Nazis in WW2.[/QUOTE] At least the Nazis lead a country, fielded an army, and when we put them down, they were [I]down[/I]. Doesn't work like that when your enemies are international non-state groups who believe they're fighting a holy war for God. Try as you might, you'll never put them down for good, not without impossibly drastic measures, like total control of the region at every level and forced cultural revolution.

[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;52656477]At least the Nazis lead a country, fielded an army, and when we put them down, they were [I]down[/I]. Doesn't work like that when your enemies are international non-state groups who believe they're fighting a holy war for God. Try as you might, you'll never put them down for good, not without impossibly drastic measures, like total control of the region at every level and forced cultural revolution.[/QUOTE] It's actually the Syrian government and its allies who are responsible of most of the killing, as well as most if not all uses of poison gas (look at [URL="http://www.businessinsider.com/ap-the-latest-un-probe-blames-chemical-attack-on-syria-2017-9"]this[/URL], it was just published today), large scale bombings of cities and according to some testimonies massive executions of opposition members in their prison facilities.

[QUOTE=Mossad Agent]It's actually the Syrian government and its allies who are responsible of most of the killing, as well as most if not all uses of poison gas (look at [URL="http://www.businessinsider.com/ap-the-latest-un-probe-blames-chemical-attack-on-syria-2017-9"]this[/URL], it was just published today), large scale bombings of cities and according to some testimonies massive executions of opposition members in their prison facilities.[/QUOTE] Yes I understand, your country are very desperate to overthrow the Assad government. So your imperialist government can steal the land of Syria just to expand your country as part of the [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFIXo3E_3b0"]Greater Israel project[/URL]. And also using this false flag attack by The Rebels/White Helmets aka Al Qaeda just to justified wars in Syria.

[QUOTE=TheVincent;52656681]Yes I understand, your country are very desperate to overthrow the Assad government. So your imperialist government can steal the land of Syria just to expand your country as part of the [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFIXo3E_3b0"]Greater Israel project[/URL]. And also using this false flag attack by The Rebels/White Helmets aka Al Qaeda just to justified wars in Syria.[/QUOTE] Is the white helmets thing some kinda pet conspiracy theory for Assad apologists? I keep seeing it popping up in that context. Anyway, let's look at actual reports from sources most of us consider reliable, shall we? [URL="https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/09/14/world/middleeast/syria-war-deaths.html"]https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/09/14/world/middleeast/syria-war-deaths.html[/URL] [URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/05/world/middleeast/syria-bashar-al-assad-atrocities-civilian-deaths-gas-attack.html"]https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/05/world/middleeast/syria-bashar-al-assad-atrocities-civilian-deaths-gas-attack.html[/URL] [URL="http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/06/middleeast/syria-weapons-against-civilians/index.html"]http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/06/middleeast/syria-weapons-against-civilians/index.html[/URL] [URL="http://www.businessinsider.com/assads-government-still-kills-way-more-civilians-than-isis-2015-2"]http://www.businessinsider.com/assads-government-still-kills-way-more-civilians-than-isis-2015-2[/URL] [URL="http://www.vocativ.com/224151/syria-government-assad-kills-more-civilians-than-isis/"]http://www.vocativ.com/224151/syria-government-assad-kills-more-civilians-than-isis/[/URL] And then of course there's this: [URL="http://whoiskillingciviliansinsyria.org/"]http://whoiskillingciviliansinsyria.org/[/URL] But of course all western media is secretly controlled by Israel as part of its nefarious plan to take over Syria because it makes perfect sense for a country of 8 million people to occupy a country of 18 million, most of whom very angry and armed to the fucking teeth.

[QUOTE=TheVincent;52656681]Yes I understand, your country are very desperate to overthrow the Assad government. So your imperialist government can steal the land of Syria just to expand your country as part of the [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFIXo3E_3b0"]Greater Israel project[/URL]. And also using this false flag attack by The Rebels/White Helmets aka Al Qaeda just to justified wars in Syria.[/QUOTE] I wish Benjamin Netanyahu and his rag tag band of thieves and crooks were capable of any of the things you said.

[QUOTE=ScumBunny;52656609]It's actually the Syrian government and its allies who are responsible of most of the killing, as well as most if not all uses of poison gas (look at [URL="http://www.businessinsider.com/ap-the-latest-un-probe-blames-chemical-attack-on-syria-2017-9"]this[/URL], it was just published today), large scale bombings of cities and according to some testimonies massive executions of opposition members in their prison facilities.[/QUOTE] They're also the most stable option for the region. Certainly not the moral choice, but from a pragmatic perspective, they already have all the necessary civil and military institutions in place. If the government falls, there will be a massive power vacuum and the war will be dragged out another decade or more with all the rebel and terrorist factions fighting tooth and nail for control over the country.

[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;52666459]They're also the most stable option for the reason. Certainly not the moral choice, but from a pragmatic perspective, they already have all the necessary civil and military institutions in place. If the government falls, there will be a massive power vacuum and the war will be dragged out another decade or more with all the rebel and terrorist factions fighting tooth and nail for control over the country.[/QUOTE] So coming back around to the OP, does that justify the U.S. government's (supposedly) turning a blind eye to the atrocities the Syrian government is committing?