British public back a ban on burqa by two to one, poll finds - Polidicks

[QUOTE]A majority of the British public are in favour of banning the burqa in public, a poll has found, while almost half say the burkini should be prohibited. The only age group to oppose a ban was the 18-24-year-olds, while all others were in favour, with the oldest 65+ group backing the prohibition by an overwhelming 78 per cent to 12. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE]The British government said last week it would not introduce a ban on the Islamic swimsuit, saying it “sees no need” to dictate how people dress. A spokesman for the Government Equalities Office said: “The Government sees no need for measures restricting what people can wear in public places.[/QUOTE] [URL]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/01/british-public-back-a-ban-on-burqa-by-two-to-one-poll-finds/[/URL]

Yeah it's obviously the racism and not the fact it's the complete concealment of identity on the basis that man in sky says so.

If the government decided denim was illegal as it promoted complete concealment of a booty we would all be outraged. Governments don't get to dictate how we dress. We do that to children in schools. That is where it should remain.

[QUOTE=Saints;50982996]Yeah it's obviously the racism and not the fact it's the complete concealment of identity on the basis that man in sky says so.[/QUOTE] I struggle to imagine that 78% of 65 year olds are so passionate about identity politics and women's rights that they'd support banning an article of clothing

Yeah and that's why you don't let public decide shit like this. Thank god it was just a research poll and nothing else.

is anyone honestly surprised

I'm one of the least racist people you'll meet, and while I'm perfectly fine with people wearing what they want in their own time, in public you should remain as secular as possible. Add onto that the fact that conceiling your faces can only add to fears people have, I support this move.

[QUOTE=James xX;50983019]I'm one of the least racist people you'll meet, and while I'm perfectly fine with people wearing what they want in their own time, in public you should remain as secular as possible. Add onto that the fact that conceiling your faces can only add to fears people have, I support this move.[/QUOTE] so to you "secular" is the government interfering in peoples right to practice and express their religious beliefs? would you support a ban on crosses in public too?

[QUOTE=James xX;50983019]I'm one of the least racist people you'll meet, and while I'm perfectly fine with people wearing what they want in their own time, in public you should remain as secular as possible. Add onto that the fact that conceiling your faces can only add to fears people have, I support this move.[/QUOTE] Does this mean you don't want people wearing those cross necklaces I see everywhere [editline]1st September 2016[/editline] aaand ninja'd

We should ban all forms of self expression. Take that band t-shirt off, you're being too indiviual

Concealment of identity is a reasonable argument but only if it also covers motor cycle helmets, fancy dress and ridiculous huge sunglasses. Otherwise it's just another racist argument hidden in plain sight.

[QUOTE=Saints;50982996]Yeah it's obviously the racism and not the fact it's the complete concealment of identity on the basis that man in sky says so.[/QUOTE] pop quiz, name any other piece of clothing that is banned in public on the grounds that it's complete concealment of identity in the UK

I don't have any problem with banning face concealment (well, I don't really like it, but I can somewhat get on board with it.) But if they ban the burqa or the burkini as a specific exception, I'm buying one and wearing it.

[QUOTE=Streecer;50983020]so to you "secular" is the government interfering in peoples right to practice and express their religious beliefs? would you support a ban on crosses in public too?[/QUOTE] I wasn't aware that these crosses completely conceal your identity.

I don't know the situation outside of europe, but in Italy it's illegal to go around dressed like this: [img]http://oxford-products.com/us/product_images/n/004/Balaclava_eyes__92353_zoom.jpg[/img] So I don't see a reason why you should be allowed to go around like this: [img]http://thepolar.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/face_28915c.jpg[/img] I see absolutely no difference..

[QUOTE=Saints;50982996]Yeah it's obviously the racism and not the fact it's the complete concealment of identity on the basis that man in sky says so.[/QUOTE] pls also ban hats, helmets, sunglasses, hoodies, mustaches, beards, makeup, masks of any kind, halloween, and my hands

[QUOTE=Dom Pyroshark;50983015]Yeah and that's why you don't let public decide shit like this. Thank god it was just a research poll and nothing else.[/QUOTE] I find this interesting. When should the public decide what's the rule in their land and when should they not? Where the boundaries?

[QUOTE=Gizmodo456;50983027]Concealment of identity is a reasonable argument but only if it also covers motor cycle helmets, fancy dress and ridiculous huge sunglasses. Otherwise it's just another racist argument hidden in plain sight.[/QUOTE] deliberate masking of the identity covers masks, skiing hats and veils, but not sizeable hats and glasses unless it can be proven to be with the intent to hide identity (like when someone does a bankjob wearing a large sombrero to guard against security cameras) also discriminating people on the basis of cultural practices is not racism, [B]you just look like an idiot now.[/B]

[QUOTE=Blizzerd;50983058]deliberate masking of the identity covers masks, skiing hats and veils, but not sizeable hats and glasses unless it can be proven to be with the intent to hide identity (like when someone does a bankjob wearing a large sombrero to guard against security cameras) also discriminating people on the basis of cultural practices is not racism, [B]you just look like an idiot now.[/B][/QUOTE] By your own argument you cant ban the burqa because no Muslim woman would say they had the intent to hide their identity. It's about modesty and preserving their dignity which is their right. Not every Muslim is hiding a big dirty secret.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;50983032]pop quiz, name any other piece of clothing that is banned in public on the grounds that it's complete concealment of identity in the UK[/QUOTE] In the UK the police can demand to disrobe a balaclava if worn in public. Also its not illegal to wear one, but wearing one 'when the weather is not a valid reason' is deemed a reasonable argument to do an arrest on the basis of preventing a crime. You can thank the IRA for that. balaclava's also fall under the laws in France that were used in the polls in the UK as a basis of the question. So yes, there is some kind of precedent, and no there is no direct reason to assume most of the answers are based on unreasonable discrimination. [editline]1st September 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Gizmodo456;50983065]By your own argument you cant ban the burqa because no Muslim woman would say they had the intent to hide their identity. It's about modesty and preserving their dignity which is their right. Not every Muslim is hiding a big dirty secret.[/QUOTE] Hajibs dont hide identity, burkas do and their purpose is to hide identity to remain modest. Hajibs are legal in France, burkas arent.

[QUOTE=Blizzerd;50983071]In the UK the police can demand to disrobe a balaclava if worn in public. Also its not illegal to wear one, but wearing one 'when the weather is not a valid reason' is deemed a reasonable argument to do an arrest on the basis of preventing a crime. You can thank the IRA for that. balaclava's also fall under the laws in France that were used in the polls in the UK as a basis of the question. So yes, there is some kind of precedent, and no there is no direct reason to assume most of the answers are based on unreasonable discrimination.[/QUOTE] So should we ban tinted motorcycle helmets? and Sunglasses since they CAN be used to hide identity Anon masks? Hoodies? Caps? Gas masks

[QUOTE=Blizzerd;50983071] Hajibs dont hide identity, burkas do and their purpose is to hide identity to remain modest. Hajibs are legal in France, burkas arent.[/QUOTE] Where is your evidence that Muslim women are trying to hide their identity. If that was true they wouldn't be able to have a conversation or use a credit card etc. The whole argumentis flawed. You can't identify them so you assume they are hiding something sinister. I don't understand why people feel so threatened and cowered by women covering their faces. It's just bonkers.

Please try to remember that the burqa is the dress that completely conceals the face and the body with only a slit (IF THAT) for the eyes. It's not the hijab, it's not the head scarf. This is the same story as the burqini one, just in a different form and country. Let's try to build on it. Let's talk about freedom of expression. Whose freedoms are being violated by banning the burqa? First of all, anyone who wants to wear a burqa. Let's get that out of the way. Yes, the practice of wearing essentially a trash bag that completely CONCEALS identity and expression is under threat. Should Britain be allowed to question this 'cultural' practice just because their culture sees it as wrong? Here's a better question, [i]is it actually a cultural practice?[/i] I think I can answer this with confidence and say, [i]no, it's a practice of extreme RELIGIOUS fundamentalism.[/i] If you disagree with me here, I'd invite you to ask yourself what would make a person WANT to wear a trash bag out on a hot summer's day, other than their religious convictions or the male counterpart who holds the same convictions. Here's my straightforward opinion, and [b]tl;dr:[/b] The burqa in itself is a violation of the free speech of the woman wearing it, regardless of whether or not she "wants to express her religious beliefs," because it involves an unwitting submission on their part to surrender any possibility of expression without any sort of struggle whatsoever.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;50983032]pop quiz, name any other piece of clothing that is banned in public on the grounds that it's complete concealment of identity in the UK[/QUOTE] Yeah, I never said there was. I would completely be up for banning a balaclava in public too. I'd be just as uncomfortable with that. Also, people don't typically walk around wearing a balaclava whereas a burqua is far more wide-spread. And not to mention the fact that it's religious basically is a get out of jail free card. You honestly believe that a police officer will ask a person wearing a burqua to remove it? No. Because they'd probably irrationally be branded a racist for doing so.

You don't think she should be allowed to wear a burqa because you think she should want to not to wear one anyway? SJW's are so intent on saving people who don't feel they need to be saved from anything.

[QUOTE=nickohlus;50983090] tl;dr: The burqa in itself is a violation of the free speech of the woman wearing it, regardless of whether or not she "wants to express her religious beliefs," because it involves an [b]unwitting submission[/b] on their part to surrender any possibility of expression without any sort of struggle whatsoever.[/QUOTE] So you want to "save" someone regardless of whether or not they actually want to be "saved". what else could we apply that to? Should the government save us from cigarettes and alcohol, regardless of whether or not we want to be saved? Should the government save us from excessive internet use? Should a bride be disallowed from wearing a veil at her wedding? It serves the same purpose. To what degree does the government have to right to intervene? Those questions are rehtorical but I would sorta like to see an answer

It's illegal in Sweden to dress up in a way with intent to hide ones identity. only ever really comes in to play during rallies where instigators of violence against police or political opponents hide their faces

[QUOTE=nickohlus;50983090]violation of the free speech of the woman wearing it, regardless of whether or not she "wants to express her religious beliefs," because it involves an unwitting submission on their part to surrender any possibility of expression without any sort of struggle whatsoever.[/QUOTE] this isn't an argument, because by making it illegal, you are removing someone's right to express themselves by clothing that doesn't do any harm to anyone it doesn't matter how you justify it, if the clothing doesn't put anyone in immediate danger and isn't anything covered under hate speech like "KILL ALL X PEOPLE", then you're violating freedom of expression with no good reason it isn't your job, nor the government's job, to "save someone" from submission that they are willingly putting themselves through

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;50983077]So should we ban tinted motorcycle helmets? and Sunglasses since they CAN be used to hide identity Anon masks? Hoodies? Caps? Gas masks[/QUOTE] the answer to that question is the part you didn't quote. there is a difference between trying to hide your identity/facial features and wearing something that does. In this case intent does matter.

[QUOTE=Blizzerd;50983101]the answer to that question is the part you didn't quote. there is a difference between trying to hide your identity/facial features and wearing something that does. In this case intent does matter.[/QUOTE] Yes I agree intent matters. We've covered this dear.