[quote]
Pope Francis has demonstrated that there are limits to his modernising fervour as he warned against moves to legalise recreational drugs.
"Drug addiction is an evil, and with evil there can be no yielding or compromise," he said at a drug enforcement conference in Rome.
The Argentinian pontiff's comments, in which he insisted that "the problem of drug use is not solved with drugs", came a month after Uruguay become the first country to legalise the production, sale and consumption of cannabis, a move that is being followed closely in other Latin American countries trying to end the violence spawned by the drugs trade.
The pope, who has spoken out against drug use before, said: "To think that harm can be reduced by permitting drug addicts to use narcotics in no way resolves the problem. Attempts, however limited, to legalise so-called recreational drugs, are not only highly questionable from a legislative standpoint, but they fail to produce the desired effects."
On Saturday Francis is due to visit Calabria, home of Italy's powerful 'Ndrangheta mafia, which controls a significant share of the global trade in illegal narcotics. The pope said drug use was "fed by a deplorable commerce which transcends national and continental borders" and was placing increasing numbers of young people at risk of harm.
Several countries and US states have legalised, or are in the process of legalising or decriminalising cannabis in certain circumstances and/or for small amounts. In 2009, Argentina's supreme court declared that criminalised drug possession for personal consumption was unconstitutional and there have been moves to decriminalise it. Recreational use of marijuana has been legalised in Colorado and Washington, while Oregon may vote on the issue this year. The state of New York prepared on Friday to pass measures that should lead to it becoming the 23rd US state to allow medical use of marijuana.
[/quote]
[url]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/20/pope-francis-dont-legalise-drugs[/url]
It's not like Christ's blood is literally a drug or anything
don't care I still like him
I disagree with him here but he has done some cool stuff.
[QUOTE]there will be no room for illicit drugs, for alcohol abuse, for other forms of addiction.[/QUOTE]
Hey, at least he isn't concentrating entirely on drugs like most governments do!
tbh he brought up a few reasonable points
[QUOTE=ImpSnob;45178113]don't care I still like him
I disagree with him here but he has done some cool stuff.[/QUOTE]
He's a public figure representing a traditional organization, it's no wonder that he retains some beliefs from that traditional organization even if he is more liberal than some previous Popes.
I'm not going to expect any different from a Pope, and I'm not going to lower my opinion of him based upon this.
eh, narcotics are 80 times worse than my recreational shit, deal with it old man
[editline]21st June 2014[/editline]
you're still p cool tho
So wine, the blood of Christ and a drug, should be illegal then? Faulty logic.
I don't follow his logic. Is he saying he thinks cocaine being illegal has reduced people's access to it? No one can buy coke, that's why it's a multi-billion dollar a year business?
I think that argument has obvious flaws.
He just wants people to not have to go through bad trips.
Last time someone had a really bad trip in those circles, they thought their buddy who got crucified and put into a cave, resurrected himself 3 days later, instead of some graverobber just stealing the body for laughs.
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;45178161]I don't follow his logic. Is he saying he thinks cocaine being illegal has reduced people's access to it? No one can buy coke, that's why it's a multi-billion dollar a year business?
I think that argument has obvious flaws.[/QUOTE]
I don't know about you, but I can't afford the $60 a gram or however fucking much cocaine costs, and you'd be a fool to suggest that it wouldn't be cheaper if it was readily available.
[sp]Cue everyone from DD storming me and correcting that price.[/sp]
[quote]there will be no room for illicit drugs, for alcohol abuse, for other forms of addiction.[/quote]
I can at the very least see where he's coming from since he's not drawing some arbitrary, made up line between particular drugs and alcohol/cigarettes, which is what most people who are against drugs do.
If you're saying flat out that addictive substances and mind altering substances are all bad, I think you're wrong but I don't think you're an idiot. It's when you get people who are totally against the legalisation of, say, marijuana (as a pretty tame example) yet drink regularly and don't see the hypocrisy of it that really gets to me.
However, I will say that it's foolish not to try and legalise these things, since people will do it either way, and all you do by illegalising drugs is put people who are just out to enjoy themselves in prison, and wind up with poor quality drugs that can be harmful since they're unregulated and are produced and distributed by fucking shady criminals.
[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;45178205]I don't know about you, but I can't afford the $60 a gram or however fucking much cocaine costs, and you'd be a fool to suggest that it wouldn't be cheaper if it was readily available.
[sp]Cue everyone from DD storming me and correcting that price.[/sp][/QUOTE]
I doubt it would be any cheaper if it was legal. Chances are it would be regulated and taxed out the wazoo.
To be honest, with everything going on in Latin America, this is a really dangerous statement. The reason they're moving towards legalisation there is to stem the fucking vicious drug industry there and ultimately to save lives, which it almost definitely will be doing and is probably the most effective way of doing so.
Seriously, these words carry a lot of weight and could potentially contribute to the continued existence of drug cartels.
If you want to be ascetic that's totally up to you but don't enforce it on everyone else via legislation.
[QUOTE=squids_eye;45178270]I doubt it would be any cheaper if it was legal. Chances are it would be regulated and taxed out the wazoo.[/QUOTE]
It would be easier to produce, though, wouldn't it? Easier to produce and move around = cheaper.s
[QUOTE=nikomo;45178178]He just wants people to not have to go through bad trips.
Last time someone had a really bad trip in those circles, they thought their buddy who got crucified and put into a cave, resurrected himself 3 days later, instead of some graverobber just stealing the body for laughs.[/QUOTE]
i cringed, nice post dude
[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;45178304]It would be easier to produce, though, wouldn't it? Easier to produce and move around = cheaper.s[/QUOTE]
Yes but when have you known pharmaceutical companies to not try and take a massive overhead? Especially when most users are already used to a high price.
Why not legalize anyway? Send drug addicts to rehab instead of prison. Take it from Portugal, drug use has gone down, std spread through shared needles, ect, has gone down, deaths from heroin were almost cut in half, and more people got help after legalization. Too bad every country can't do this.
[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;45178304]It would be easier to produce, though, wouldn't it? Easier to produce and move around = cheaper.s[/QUOTE]
Yeah but then regulation and taxation may simply cancel that out and ultimately not make much difference I dunno. Out of interest, anyone from Washington state or Colorado, what's happened to the price of weed since legalisation?
Besides, people who want to take cocaine are going to find a way of taking it, however much it costs or however legal it is, and I doubt there's anything you can do to change that.
well surely he can see that locking drug addicts up certainly isn't productive either
He's right. No reason hard drugs like heroin and cocaine should be legalized. The emergency medical costs, overdoses, and need for clinical rehabilitation would outweigh any tax benefits provided.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;45178401]He's right. No reason hard drugs like heroin and cocaine should be legalized. The emergency medical costs, overdoses, and need for clinical rehabilitation would outweigh any tax benefits provided.[/QUOTE]
except prohibition has only made those things worse. medical costs and overdoses happen because people don't know what they're shooting up for sure (and there is no regulation within black markets). it's not about tax benefits, it's about creating a safer product a safer environment for users and less social stigma against addicts so the ones that want help can get it without becoming felons first
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;45178401]He's right. No reason hard drugs like heroin and cocaine should be legalized. The emergency medical costs, overdoses, and need for clinical rehabilitation would outweigh any tax benefits provided.[/QUOTE]
What, because those things don't happen anyway? Legalisation doesn't mean encouragement to take it, and selling that shit over the counter. It just means you don't put people in prison for being unfortunate enough to have an addiction.
When people talk about legalizing the shit that is way too bad for you to outweigh their recreational use, they're talking about doing it so it can be easier to help addicts, not so that it can be easier to acquire and take recreationally.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;45178401]He's right. No reason hard drugs like heroin and cocaine should be legalized. The emergency medical costs, overdoses, and need for clinical rehabilitation would outweigh any tax benefits provided.[/QUOTE]
should we go back to the prohibition as well?
we need to legalize these drugs so we stop creating worse and worse addicts and victims in society.
By having them illegal, nothing has been curbed. No amount of laws on the books have ever lowered the drug use rates. Accepting that drugs exist, and that people use them, and helping them not be addicts is monumentally more successful than what you're suggesting.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;45178401]He's right. No reason hard drugs like heroin and cocaine should be legalized. The emergency medical costs, overdoses, and need for clinical rehabilitation would outweigh any tax benefits provided.[/QUOTE]
People get ODs because they are inexperienced users with no instruction, and the potency of drugs are not regulated. This happens even more so in a world where these drugs are manufactured and distributed by unlicensed and unregulated manufacturers/dealers (ie: prohibition)
If you had the drugs be manufactured under government regulation you'd be able to standardize scientifically-recommended dosages that don't kill you so easily and aren't cut with other nasty shit.
Legalize some of the relatively harmless ones, keep the rest banned, or at least under tight restrictions.
Jesus drank wine.
[QUOTE=Starpluck;45178278]If you want to be ascetic that's totally up to you but don't enforce it on everyone else via legislation.[/QUOTE]
That would work in countries without socialized healthcare or unemployment benefits, but if the drugs in question cause costly health issues/are strongly addictive/cause people who take then to not have enough income to keep up with the costs there's a ton of issues with people taking them.
I'm fine with substances not having those issues being legal, but otherwise I disagree.
[QUOTE=Tamschi;45178918]That would work in countries without socialized healthcare or unemployment benefits, but if the drugs in question cause costly health issues/are strongly addictive/cause people who take then to not have enough income to keep up with the costs there's a ton of issues with people taking them.
I'm fine with substances not having those issues being legal, but otherwise I disagree.[/QUOTE]
except the health issues are either caused or greatly exacerbated by prohibition. and i'm not sure i like the idea of banning something because it could put a burden on socialized healthcare or unemployment benefits is a good one, do we ban fatty foods? i'm sure obesity is a far larger cause of health costs than drugs
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