The Pope celebrates 499th anniversary of Luther's 95 Theses in Sweden for reconciliation - Polidicks

[quote]LUND, Sweden — Almost 500 years after Martin Luther nailed his 95 theses to a church door, setting off more than a century of religious warfare and forever changing the practice of Christianity worldwide, Pope Francis on Monday urged atonement and Christian reconciliation. Visiting the cities of Lund and Malmo in southern Sweden for a joint Catholic-Lutheran commemoration of the Reformation, the pope observed the 499th anniversary of Luther’s protest of the sale of indulgences by noting the beneficial impact it had on Catholicism. [B]“With gratitude we acknowledge that the Reformation helped give greater centrality to sacred Scripture in the church’s life,” the pope said[/B] in a joint declaration at Lund Cathedral with Bishop Munib A. Younan, the head of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Jordan and the Holy Land and the president of the Lutheran World Federation. The trip, which kicked off a year of events leading up to the 500th anniversary of the Reformation, was announced in January, but it was no less striking for those who listened to the pope. Sweden played a pivotal and troubling role in Protestant and Catholic history. From the 16th century, Catholics were persecuted and even put to death in Sweden. As recently as 1951, Catholics were barred from becoming doctors, teachers and nurses, and Catholic convents were banned until the 1970s. Some Catholics and Lutherans, especially those whose families are intermingled, hoped that the event would produce a concrete step toward the two churches’ allowing their members to take communion in each other’s worship services. In their joint declaration, Pope Francis and Bishop Younan acknowledged the divide, but said only that they were working toward a resolution through dialogue.[/quote] [url]http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/01/world/europe/pope-francis-in-sweden-urges-catholic-lutheran-reconciliation.html?_r=0[/url]

[QUOTE]As recently as 1951, Catholics were barred from becoming doctors, teachers and nurses, and Catholic convents were banned until the 1970s.[/QUOTE] Wow. It's hard to think that a country with a reputation for being tolerant had laws like that up until very recently. But then again, how many Catholics lived in Sweden anyway?

[quote]Some Catholics and Lutherans, especially those whose families are intermingled, hoped that the event would produce a concrete step toward the two churches’ allowing their members to take communion in each other’s worship services.[/quote] I really don't see this happening, due to the rather large differences in the specifics of the beliefs in that regard.

[QUOTE=Daniel Smith;51290621]Wow. It's hard to think that a country with a reputation for being tolerant had laws like that up until very recently. But then again, how many Catholics lived in Sweden anyway?[/QUOTE] You think that's bad Northern Ireland had much worse laws and problems up until 1998.

[QUOTE=Mabus;51291238]You think that's bad Northern Ireland had much worse laws and problems up until 1998.[/QUOTE] Yup. Among the reasons why Henry the 8th should go down as The Worst British King of All Time ([I]Kenya whispers of All Time[/I]), his decision to create his own church just so he could divorce yer wan has had so many awful consequences and has caused so much pain here in Ireland, should go down as the worst.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;51291208]I really don't see this happening, due to the rather large differences in the specifics of the beliefs in that regard.[/QUOTE] The Lutheran Church is the most Catholic-like church, however. There could be some reconciliation, at least at a base level like allowing communion.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;51291609]The Lutheran Church is the most Catholic-like church, however. There could be some reconciliation, at least at a base level like allowing communion.[/QUOTE] I thought the Episcopal church was the most Catholic-like church?

[QUOTE=adamsz;51291651]I thought the Episcopal church was the most Catholic-like church?[/QUOTE] They are as well. I guess it's a matter of opinion which is "more like". However, I don't think dogma and the finer details of faith will hinder sharing communion either way. As far as I know, most Christian churches of any denomination have communion and it's really just a matter of the exact actions taken during it rather than the religion behind it that differs.

[QUOTE=Daniel Smith;51290621]Wow. It's hard to think that a country with a reputation for being tolerant had laws like that up until very recently. But then again, how many Catholics lived in Sweden anyway?[/QUOTE] Sweden also used to sterilize Sami people until like, the 60s? They've got a few skeletons in their closet.

[QUOTE]“With gratitude we acknowledge that the Reformation helped give greater centrality to sacred Scripture in the church’s life,” the pope said[/QUOTE] But according to Lutheran interpretations of scripture, there shouldn't even be a pope.

[QUOTE=adamsz;51291651]I thought the Episcopal church was the most Catholic-like church?[/QUOTE] Anglicans have more different rites still than lutherans when it comes to relation to catholics

[QUOTE=GÃ©za!;51291658]Sweden also used to sterilize Sami people until like, the 60s? They've got a few skeletons in their closet.[/QUOTE] Up untill the early 80s my country hated anyone that was homosexual, bisexual, sami or had any kind of mental disability. They did steralize people and didn't care about it. Being homosexual up till about the mid 70s was considered a dissease and you were steralized and put in mental asylum.

[QUOTE=The mouse;51291661]But according to Lutheran interpretations of scripture, there shouldn't even be a pope.[/QUOTE] Lutherans have the whole hierarchy of the church as the Catholics do except for Cardinals and Popes. And really, the Pope is just suppose to be a "head bishop" and nothing more, it was centuries of centralizing power to Rome's Bishop that made the Pope unique in the church. I don't think Lutherans really have an issue with there being a pope so much as the absolute authority and the religious significance Catholics have put into that office over the centuries. If the Pope was simply a head-bishop regional administrator as was originally intended, they would have a pope as well perhaps.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;51291707]Lutherans have the whole hierarchy of the church as the Catholics do except for Cardinals and Popes. And really, the Pope is just suppose to be a "head bishop" and nothing more, it was centuries of centralizing power to Rome's Bishop that made the Pope unique in the church.[/QUOTE] Main reason that the pope became a thing is because back in the day you had five major Christian bishops to administer to the Christian flock. Unfortunately three of them were made redundant after the Islamic conquests of the 7th century, and the remaining two bishops ended up siding with the Holy Roman Empire (The pope) or the Byzantine Empire (The Patriarch of Constantinople).

[QUOTE=GÃ©za!;51291658]Sweden also used to sterilize Sami people until like, the 60s? They've got a few skeletons in their closet.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=freaka;51291671]Up untill the early 80s my country hated anyone that was homosexual, bisexual, sami or had any kind of mental disability. They did steralize people and didn't care about it. Being homosexual up till about the mid 70s was considered a dissease and you were steralized and put in mental asylum.[/QUOTE] We actually forced people to get sterilized before a sex change. It wasn't changed until [B]2012[/B].

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;51291657]They are as well. I guess it's a matter of opinion which is "more like". However, I don't think dogma and the finer details of faith will hinder sharing communion either way. As far as I know, most Christian churches of any denomination have communion and it's really just a matter of the exact actions taken during it rather than the religion behind it that differs.[/QUOTE] In Germany, there's a rather large division regarding whether the wafers are transformed or representative. That's if I don't completely misremember the relevant episode of Die Sendung mit der Maus, that is. I'm not religious, so I only know what I learned from religion classes in school and picked up otherwise.

[QUOTE=Tamschi;51291767]In Germany, there's a rather large division regarding whether the wafers are transformed or representative. That's if I don't completely misremember the relevant episode of Die Sendung mit der Maus, that is. I'm not religious, so I only know what I learned from religion classes in school and picked up otherwise.[/QUOTE] Well so long as both churches don't get upset over the other's parishioners complaining about the belief behind it, I don't think they'll have much trouble having communion in each other's churches.

[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;51291305]Yup. Among the reasons why Henry the 8th should go down as The Worst British King of All Time ([I]Kenya whispers of All Time[/I]), his decision to create his own church just so he could divorce yer wan has had so many awful consequences and has caused so much pain here in Ireland, should go down as the worst.[/QUOTE] It was a power struggle with the church meddling in English affairs (even trying to control the state) - wanting to divorce was just the final straw.

[QUOTE=Vasili;51291853]It was a power struggle with the church meddling in English affairs (even trying to control the state) - wanting to divorce was just the final straw.[/QUOTE] Then explain why Henry the 8th actively defended the Church when the Protestant Revolution started? That seems like a contradiction.

[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;51291877]Then explain why Henry the 8th actively defended the Church when the Protestant Revolution started? That seems like a contradiction.[/QUOTE] A source would help, not sure what you're referring to.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;51291707]Lutherans have the whole hierarchy of the church as the Catholics do except for Cardinals and Popes. And really, the Pope is just suppose to be a "head bishop" and nothing more, it was centuries of centralizing power to Rome's Bishop that made the Pope unique in the church. I don't think Lutherans really have an issue with there being a pope so much as the absolute authority and the religious significance Catholics have put into that office over the centuries. If the Pope was simply a head-bishop regional administrator as was originally intended, they would have a pope as well perhaps.[/QUOTE] The big problem comes from the split with the Eastern Romans. The Catholic Church needed to give people reason to follow it instead of the empirical church of the Romans. The Pope therefore became "the conduit of God" and tried to sap away legitimacy of the Eastern Romans. That's why you see the Catholic Church today referred to as the Roman Catholic Church, and the Eastern Roman as Orthodox Christian. Also why the Eastern rams were renamed Byzantines.

[QUOTE=Vasili;51292139]A source would help, not sure what you're referring to.[/QUOTE] [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_of_the_Seven_Sacraments[/url]