France: Windows 10 collects 'excessive personal data', issues Microsoft with formal warning - Polidicks

[quote]After accusations that Windows 10 collects too much data about users, France's National Data Protection Commission (CNIL) has order Microsoft to comply with the French Data Protection Act within three months. The company has been ordered to "stop collecting excessive data and tracking browsing by users without their consent". In addition to this, the chair of CNIL has notified Microsoft that it needs to take "satisfactory measures to ensure the security and confidentiality of user data". The notice comes after numerous complaints about Windows 10, and a series of investigations by French authorities which revealed a number of failings on Microsoft's part. Microsoft is accused of not only gathering excessive data about users, but also irrelevant data. The CNIL points to Windows 10's telemetry service which gathers information about the apps users have installed and how long each is used for. The complaint is that "these data are not necessary for the operation of the service".[/quote] [url]http://betanews.com/2016/07/20/windows-10-excessive-data-collection-france/[/url] oh boy

They might as well change it for all countries in this case. Please?

but it's all for the greater good of Win 10. [I]the greater good.[/I]

[quote]gathers information about the apps users have installed and how long each is used for.[/quote] Uh, I feel like I'm missing something here, because that's literally what diagnostic telemetry [i]is[/i]. That information can easily become relevant depending on the situation.

better ban ios/osx, they keep track of all apps their users install and for how long better ban android, they keep track of all apps their users install and for how long better ban windows phone too, their app store keeps track of all apps their users install and for how long pretty sure the "users consent" is whether or not they have the telemetry enabled [editline]20th July 2016[/editline] knowing what applications are installed and for how long is vital in determining problems with an OS microsoft should just get rid of all telemetry and drop all support for win10 because at this point they'll have to

[QUOTE=Demache;50747718]Uh, I feel like I'm missing something here, because that's literally what diagnostic telemetry [i]is[/i]. That information can easily become relevant depending on the situation.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]The complaint is that "these data are not necessary for the operation of the service".[/QUOTE] Relevant to the product but hardly necessary for the program to work. My guess is that the telemetry bit is merely an example of one such data point they don't like.

People go muh privacy but don't realize that jack shit is private on the net. Everything you do and search is used for data collection. Disconnect your Ethernet if you want full privacy

[QUOTE=Worstcase;50747804]Relevant to the product but hardly necessary for the program to work. My guess is that the telemetry bit is merely an example of one such data point they don't like.[/QUOTE] "i don't like you being able to diagnose your OS, halt!!!"

[QUOTE=Map in a box;50747796]better ban ios/osx, they keep track of all apps their users install and for how long better ban android, they keep track of all apps their users install and for how long better ban windows phone too, their app store keeps track of all apps their users install and for how long pretty sure the "users consent" is whether or not they have the telemetry enabled [editline]20th July 2016[/editline] knowing what applications are installed and for how long is vital in determining problems with an OS microsoft should just get rid of all telemetry and drop all support for win10 because at this point they'll have to[/QUOTE] specifically it's for battery life so they can determine what cases to optimize for. Edit: I should also point out that no one has really determined what data is specifically sent

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747806]People go muh privacy but don't realize that jack shit is private on the net. Everything you do and search is used for data collection. Disconnect your Ethernet if you want full privacy[/QUOTE] Or... Give people the option to have full privacy as should be their right?? I really don't know why some people struggle to comprehend something so simple. Collecting telemetry is fine. IF done with the user's explicit permission and if they are shown/clearly and unambiguously explained what information will be sent. If people don't want to send that telemetry then they should have every right to not have it sent.

[QUOTE=Alice3173;50747830]Or... Give people the option to have full privacy as should be their right?? I really don't know why some people struggle to comprehend something so simple. Collecting telemetry is fine. IF done with the user's explicit permission and if they are shown/clearly and unambiguously explained what information will be sent. If people don't want to send that telemetry then they should have every right to not have it sent.[/QUOTE] But they do give you that option? When installing windows and even in settings you can check to not have them collect data and send data reports.

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747845]But they do give you that option? When installing windows and even in settings you can check to not have them collect data and send data reports.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]and if they are shown/clearly and unambiguously explained what information will be sent.[/QUOTE] This is a kinda vital step they miss. Also there have been numerous complaints about the mechanisms given to disable this stuff. It's not centralized and instead is spread out through [I]way[/I] more submenus than it needs to be and several updates have reset these settings as well.

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747845]But they do give you that option? When installing windows and even in settings you can check to not have them collect data and send data reports.[/QUOTE] Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's opt-in, and considering that most people will go with the default parameters that skips most of the configuration, it won't comply with the FDPA.

[QUOTE=Nabile13;50747857]Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's opt-in, and considering that most people will go with the default parameters that skips most of the configuration, it won't comply with the FDPA.[/QUOTE] Last I checked it's super easy to accidentally skip over it too. Rather than it being an unskippable step that most people would just leave on the default settings it's under the customize options where there's a bunch of settings that even someone worried about privacy settings won't want to mess with when it really belongs in the main setup instead.

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747806]People go muh privacy but don't realize that jack shit is private on the net. Everything you do and search is used for data collection. Disconnect your Ethernet if you want full privacy[/QUOTE] that might be true if you don't care at all about securing your data, but many people (like me) use a VPN almost all the time, run noscript, etc. People act like it's impossible to choose to have your data private, but that's not the case

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747806]People go muh privacy but don't realize that jack shit is private on the net. Everything you do and search is used for data collection. Disconnect your Ethernet if you want full privacy[/QUOTE] I refuse, I should have whatever level of privacy I want, because the internet is an essential part of human life nowadays, so the freedom to not be tracked must be respected. Saying that the internet inherently makes privacy impossible is just a demonstration of how much government tracking can do, the answer is not to stop using the internet, the answer is to make the governments and companies respect your privacy like you deserve.

[QUOTE=phygon;50747875]but many people (like me) use a VPN almost all the time, run noscript, etc.[/QUOTE] I just don't get it. Thats such overkill, for what? Having someone not know what app you're using or what you search daily? Call me ignorant, I just don't get the paranoia. I disable the features to send data but if I missed something or data is getting sent why should I care?

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747922]I just don't get it. Thats such overkill, for what? Having someone not know what app you're using or what you search daily? Call me ignorant, I just don't get the paranoia. I disable the features to send data but if I missed something or data is getting sent why should I care?[/QUOTE] It seems overkill but it really shouldn't be. You shouldn't need to go through that much effort to keep such simple things private.

It would help of Microsoft came forward about what data is actually sent. Oh wait, they won't because they know it goes beyond simple app stuff.

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747922]I just don't get it. Thats such overkill, for what? Having someone not know what app you're using or what you search daily? Call me ignorant, I just don't get the paranoia. I disable the features to send data but if I missed something or data is getting sent why should I care?[/QUOTE] It's not paranoia. My VPN runs at like 98% of the speed I already get, and noscript mostly just blocks stuff I didn't want anyway. It's as you said: Absolutely everybody is tracking you. It's not paranoia to find that creepy. What [I]I[/I] think is creepy is the fact that when I upload a photo to facebook, facebook automatically is able to tag every single person in the photo for me. I find it creepy that I google a question and then get targeted advertising for that query for the next week. I find it creepy that I even have to go through any effort at all to keep that basic info of me not out there, because I know that 99.9999% of people don't do that which means that companies have info on all of them. This is why I think that nothing should track even basic personal data without having you enable it. Even if it is just telemetry or metadata; "It's already happening" is a bad excuse and a slippery slope imo. I just don't want that data on me floating around

I just don't like the general privacy of Windows 10 itself. Not online privacy, but desktop privacy. I don't want someone hopping on my PC and seeing all my recent porn on the start bar.

[QUOTE=redBadger;50747806]People go muh privacy but don't realize that jack shit is private on the net. Everything you do and search is used for data collection. Disconnect your Ethernet if you want full privacy[/QUOTE] There's a huge fucking difference between application level privacy issues and OS level privacy issues. Not even the same goddamn ballpark.

[QUOTE=Mattk50;50747967]There's a huge fucking difference between application level privacy issues and OS level privacy issues. Not even the same goddamn ballpark.[/QUOTE] This too. People go "Well google chrome shares that anyway!" neglecting to realize that you don't have to use chrome, or google, and even if you do want to use google you can block it from tracking you fairly easily.... but when the leak comes from your system itself, you're kinda fucked.

[QUOTE=phygon;50747972]This too. People go "Well google chrome shares that anyway!" neglecting to realize that you don't have to use chrome, or google, and even if you do want to use google you can block it from tracking you fairly easily.... but when the leak comes from your system itself, you're kinda fucked.[/QUOTE] except until you disable it

[QUOTE=Map in a box;50747985]except until you disable it[/QUOTE] Windows 10 home edition doesnt even let you disable automatic updates without third party tools.

[QUOTE=Map in a box;50747796]better ban ios/osx, they keep track of all apps their users install and for how long better ban android, they keep track of all apps their users install and for how long better ban windows phone too, their app store keeps track of all apps their users install and for how long pretty sure the "users consent" is whether or not they have the telemetry enabled [editline]20th July 2016[/editline] knowing what applications are installed and for how long is vital in determining problems with an OS microsoft should just get rid of all telemetry and drop all support for win10 because at this point they'll have to[/QUOTE] Don't forget the fact that most of this telemetry has existed in Windows since the days of Vista and has only been expanded with each release of Windows since. [editline]21st July 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Mattk50;50748001]Windows 10 home edition doesnt even let you disable automatic updates without third party tools.[/QUOTE] Yeah, because home users are fucking retards who think windows update is 'inconvenient' and turn it off, leaving their systems open to security holes because they don't ever update, then complain when they get compromised and blame Microsoft for having an insecure OS. :v:

[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;50747966]I just don't like the general privacy of Windows 10 itself. Not online privacy, but desktop privacy. I don't want someone hopping on my PC and seeing all my recent porn on the start bar.[/QUOTE] That's literally no different than how its been since 7. In fact applications being able to put recently used links in the Start bar was a big feature that was a significant change from Vista.

[QUOTE=Lyokanthrope;50748007] Yeah, because home users are fucking retards who think windows update is 'inconvenient' and turn it off, leaving their systems open to security holes because they don't ever update, then complain when they get compromised and blame Microsoft for having an insecure OS. :v:[/QUOTE] While I heavily doubt that people are complaining about getting compromised after disabling updates, it doesn't matter. [I]You should be able to turn off updates in-system no matter what.[/I]

[QUOTE=Lyokanthrope;50748007] Yeah, because [B]home users are fucking retards who think windows update is 'inconvenient'[/B] and turn it off, leaving their systems open to security holes because they don't ever update, then complain when they get compromised and blame Microsoft for having an insecure OS. :v:[/QUOTE] It [I]IS[/I] inconvenient. It shuts down whatever you're doing with nothing more than a five-minute warning (that pops up in the background on many fullscreen games), and then prevents you from using your computer for potentially HOURS while it installs whatever it has to. [editline]21st July 2016[/editline] Remember that unlike linux, Windows needs a restart for updates.

[QUOTE=phygon;50748119]It [I]IS[/I] inconvenient. It shuts down whatever you're doing with nothing more than a five-minute warning (that pops up in the background on many fullscreen games), and then prevents you from using your computer for potentially HOURS while it installs whatever it has to. [editline]21st July 2016[/editline] Remember that unlike linux, Windows needs a restart for updates.[/QUOTE] linux needs to restart for kernel updates most linux updates are just updating packages which are often not in use