[img_thumb]http://www.slate.com/content/dam/slate/blogs/behold/2013/07/15/1.jpg.CROP.original-original.jpg[/img_thumb][URL="http://www.slate.com/blogs/behold/2013/07/15/_you_are_you_looks_at_a_gender_nonconforming_camp_for_boys_photos.html"]
[/URL][quote][URL="http://www.slate.com/blogs/behold/2013/07/15/_you_are_you_looks_at_a_gender_nonconforming_camp_for_boys_photos.html"]Over the past three years, photographer [/URL][URL="http://lindsaymorris.viewbook.com/"]Lindsay Morris[/URL] has been documenting a four-day camp for gender nonconforming boys and their parents.
The camp, “[URL="http://lindsaymorris.viewbook.com/you-are-you"]You Are You[/URL]” (the name has been changed to protect the privacy of the children and is also the name of Morris’ series), is for “Parents who don’t have a gender-confirming 3-year-old who wants to wear high heels and prefers to go down the pink aisle in K-Mart and not that nasty dark boys’ aisle,” Morris said with a laugh.
It is also a place for both parents and children to feel protected in an environment that encourages free expression.
“[The kids] don’t have to look over their shoulders, and they can let down their guard. Those are four days when none of that matters, and they are surrounded by family members who support them,” Morris said.
Morris has stated that her photographic goal for the project is “to represent the spirit of these boys as they shine.” Some of the ways in which the kids shine is through the talent and fashion shows at camp that are popular and for which the campers come well-prepared.
“Some practice for the talent show all year, and others create their own gowns with their mothers or friends of the family,” Morris said. “The focus and enthusiasm is really pretty incredible. Also, it can be very emotional for the parents, especially the families who are new to camp and are experiencing this kind of group acceptance for the very first time.”[/quote]
[url]http://www.slate.com/blogs/behold/2013/07/15/_you_are_you_looks_at_a_gender_nonconforming_camp_for_boys_photos.html[/url]
Cue all the IT'S NOT NORMAL THE KIDS SHOULDN'T BE FORCED TO ACCEPT THEIR GENDER ISSUES BLA BLA I'M AN IDIOT posts
I think it's great these kids have a place where they can act out their personalities without reprecussions.
Damn, that poor kid in the OP. All those people laughing at him.
[QUOTE=Papytendo;41479047]Damn, that poor kid in the OP. All those people laughing at him.[/QUOTE]
I think they're enjoying it with the kid, not laughing at him.
I wish I had the chance to model pretty dresses and high heels when I was three.
Fucking 3. Yeah. Ok. First that first grader going to the girls bathroom, now three year olds in women's clothing, clothing that not even 3 year old girls wear? Surely there's a limit somewhere. You won't even remeber stuff that happens when you are 3.
[QUOTE=Selek;41479081]I think they're enjoying it with the kid, not laughing at him.[/QUOTE]
That was the poorly translating joke. (Is there a way to say that without coming across as an ass?)
Oh jesus, I can already tell where this thread is gonna go...
[QUOTE=Whiterfire;41479474]Fucking 3. Yeah. Ok. First that first grader going to the girls bathroom, now three year olds in women's clothing, clothing that not even 3 year old girls wear? Surely there's a limit somewhere. You won't even remeber stuff that happens when you are 3.[/QUOTE]
Who cares? It's not hurting anyone as long as the kid is the one making the choice.
[QUOTE=Whiterfire;41479474]Fucking 3. Yeah. Ok. First that first grader going to the girls bathroom, now three year olds in women's clothing, clothing that not even 3 year old girls wear? Surely there's a limit somewhere. You won't even remeber stuff that happens when you are 3.[/QUOTE]
gender is something that is set even before birth through influence, you don't develop one magically when you turn 18.
[editline]16th July 2013[/editline]
And why is it any of your business whether or not children decide their gender?
[QUOTE=demoguy08;41479008]Cue all the IT'S NOT NORMAL THE KIDS SHOULDN'T BE FORCED TO ACCEPT THEIR GENDER ISSUES BLA BLA I'M AN IDIOT posts
I think it's great these kids have a place where they can act out their personalities without reprecussions.[/QUOTE]
Still though 3 years old. I bet most 3 year olds wouldn't know what the actual differences between genders are at 3. I accept that it's a place for free expression and all that stuff, this still seems like taking a mile from an inch.
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479603]Still though 3 years old. I bet most 3 year olds wouldn't know what the actual differences between genders are at 3. I accept that it's a place for free expression and all that stuff, this still seems like taking a mile from an inch.[/QUOTE]
children don't need to know the difference to know what they are
i'm sure you didn't know the difference between being homosexual and heterosexual at 3, but you did know what you were.
It's a brainwashing camp. They should shut this down and ban this sick filth.
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479603]Still though 3 years old. I bet most 3 year olds wouldn't know what the actual differences between genders are at 3. I accept that it's a place for free expression and all that stuff, this still seems like taking a mile from an inch.[/QUOTE]
I believe there's been a study of some sort (don't have the link, remember seeing it in another trans-related news thread) that shows gender cements itself between... 2 and 5 years old, I believe it was?
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;41479622]children don't need to know the difference to know what they are
i'm sure you didn't know the difference between being homosexual and heterosexual at 3, but you did know what you were.[/QUOTE]
That's not the point I'm making. But these children are too young to know what they are. What I meant to say is that these children are too young to know what gender is and so I see this as going too far based on very little.
Would this not be a Pedos paradise? o.O
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479647]That's not the point I'm making. But these children are too young to know what they are. What I meant to say is that these children are too young to know what gender is and so I see this as going too far based on very little.[/QUOTE]
There's really no harm in letting the kid go through with this if they want to though.
[QUOTE=Whiterfire;41479474]Fucking 3. Yeah. Ok. First that first grader going to the girls bathroom, now three year olds in women's clothing, clothing that not even 3 year old girls wear? Surely there's a limit somewhere. You won't even remeber stuff that happens when you are 3.[/QUOTE]
The world would be a much better place if there weren't closed minded people like you holding us back.
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479647]That's not the point I'm making. But these children are too young to know what they are. What I meant to say is that these children are too young to know what gender is and so I see this as going too far based on very little.[/QUOTE]
I'm sorry, I didn't know your childhood experience was the only one. just because you didn't know at 3 doesn't mean they haven't.
and what harm is done if they do end up a different gender later in life?
[QUOTE=Alice3173;41479658]There's really no harm in letting the kid go through with this if they want to though.[/QUOTE]
I know, and I agree with you but it just seems excessive to me to take your children to a camp where they have their non confirmation taken to extremes just because they're different from the norm.
I don't want to sound offensive but it just seems excessive to me. I'm not saying that there's anything wrong about it.
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479679]I know, and I agree with you but it just seems excessive to me to take your children to a camp where they have their non confirmation taken to extremes just because they're different from the norm.[/QUOTE]
This probably isn't something that you take your kid to because they tried on Mommy's high heels once. It's probably something that these kids are very adamant about wanting to wear dresses regularly, liking the color pink, etc.,. I highly doubt they're isolated cases of the kid not conforming to their gender.
[QUOTE=biodude94566;41479697]This probably isn't something that you take your kid to because they tried on Mommy's high heels once. It's probably something that these kids are very adamant about wanting to wear dresses regularly, liking the color pink, etc.,. I highly doubt they're isolated cases of the kid not conforming to their gender.[/QUOTE]
It probably isn't the sort of place that tries and pressures the kids into doing something they don't want to do anyways seeing as that would be completely contrary to the purpose of the place.
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479679]I know, and I agree with you but it just seems excessive to me to take your children to a camp where they have their non confirmation taken to extremes just because they're different from the norm.
I don't want to sound offensive but it just seems excessive to me. I'm not saying that there's anything wrong about it.[/QUOTE]
this isn't 'taking it to the extremes', this is embracing their decisions and letting them know it's OK to be as they are.
[QUOTE=Papytendo;41479047]Damn, that poor kid in the OP. All those people laughing at him.[/QUOTE]
It's a judgement free environment did you not read?
[editline]16th July 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;41479583]gender is something that is set even before birth through influence, you don't develop one magically when you turn 18.[/QUOTE]
Fucking this.
Even the last thread someone compared gender identity to understanding the value of money.
[QUOTE=Whiterfire;41479474]Fucking 3. Yeah. Ok. First that first grader going to the girls bathroom, now three year olds in women's clothing, clothing that not even 3 year old girls wear? Surely there's a limit somewhere. You won't even remeber stuff that happens when you are 3.[/QUOTE]
If I had the opportunity to explore gender roles when I was 3, I would not have so many repressed gender issues right now.
This is extremely important. Who cares if they do/don't remember what they do? Part of childhood is figuring out your identity and exploring what you're comfortable with. That's a journey that starts as young (or as late) as the individual wants it to be.
If we actually let people question social gender norms more, we would live in a better place. The deconstruction of gender normality isn't an apocalyptic scenario.
That will teach the cis scum!
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;41479676]I'm sorry, I didn't know your childhood experience was the only one. just because you didn't know at 3 doesn't mean they haven't.
and what harm is done if they do end up a different gender later in life?[/QUOTE]
Agreed. Repressed and lifelong gender issues don't come from experiences wearing high heels and dresses. They come from a society which dictates how people should act.
There's nothing wrong with allowing a child to experiment and figure out their own gender. There [i]is[/i] something wrong with telling a child that they have to confine to social gender guidelines.
[QUOTE=The mouse;41479647]That's not the point I'm making. But these children are too young to know what they are. What I meant to say is that these children are too young to know what gender is and so I see this as going too far based on very little.[/QUOTE]
It's not really like they're making a permanent decision by going there, if they change their minds it's not really any harm done. It's not like you've signed up to permanent hormone treatments and operations just by going to the camp.
[QUOTE=Midas22;41479636]It's a brainwashing camp. They should shut this down and ban this sick filth.[/QUOTE]
Yes, those dirty transexuals are trying to convert all the straight people to their ways.
Please explain how these kids are being brainwashed.
[QUOTE=Erebus.;41480243]Yes, those dirty transexuals are trying to convert all the straight people to their ways.
Please explain how these kids are being brainwashed.[/QUOTE]
Oh wow, did you just take me seriously? This has never happened before and I'm somewhat offended.
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