Corruption in gaming journalism discussion and update thread. - General

[img]http://i.imgur.com/eI1c0zf.png[/img] So, after the last thread was closed, i went to AshMans profile and asked if it'd be alright to make a new thread for discussion and news updates for this, since i think it should be discussed and there should be a place to discuss it. If you havent heard of this before: [b]Videos discussing the problems, topics, and reasons for whats happening:[/b] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5-51PfwI3M[/media] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKmy5OKg6lo[/media] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipcWm4B3EU4[/media] [b]Twitter posts from various people involved, as well as news articles:[/b] [img]http://i.gyazo.com/c06ca399e1e22f4efc2e1c506e6d0745.png[/img] Boy this one is a winner, jesus fucking christ Wil you illiterate moron. [img]http://puu.sh/bdMbC/fd5cb4269f.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/ujQKJLw.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/YvXuj0W.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/95ZAJCU.png[/img] [t]http://i.imgur.com/nQbPsKM.jpg[/t] [b]The Maya Felix Kramer Logs:[/b] [t]http://i.imgur.com/Ageb3fi.png[/t] [quote]Zoe Quinn's PR rep exhibits the exact same behaviour and unethical practices as Zoe. Maya is a pro at manipulating, obfuscating and lying through their teeth to get their way. They come off as loving and warm, but behind it all is a very dark person. While I truly do wish them well, I cannot help but make this observation. They have a history of misogyny, hypocrisy and unethical behaviour related to their line of work. The details are in the link. Maya walking out unscathed is worse in my mind than Zoe walking away. Maya represents many devs and can do some mighty fine manipulative damage control for anyone they see fit. Even the most honest of people do not deserve that sort of power.[/quote] From Reimu: [quote]The OP got in touch with chupa regarding Maya Felix Kramer (aka legobutts, Zoe Quinn's PR rep), because they had concerns about Maya Felix Kramer as some sort of professional connection. Chupa explained that Maya Kramer has a history being manipulative and a "social chameleon," aka acting one way in order to please others. In particular, chupa used to work with Maya. When chupa first started working with Maya, Maya seemed extremely friendly, but they became mean-spirited and harsh over time. This was due to Maya feeling extremely jealous of several friendships (and a relationship) that chupa was forming, including chupa's close relationship with her boss. This escalated to an extreme extent. Maya began sabotaging relationships and projects, gaslighting chupa, lying about chupa, and making others hate her. Maya would lie about chupa to other people, and Maya bullied the her to the point of tears on several occasions. Then, Maya would try to be reassuring and comforting, only to start the cycle again. And Maya did this to several people. Maya also showed many other troubling problems. They openly admitted being misogynistic, telling Chupa "I hate women, I'm such a misogynist." Most of the social justice stuff Maya openly stands for is not true, and they're extremely exploitative and manipulative. Above all, Maya isn't above demolishing careers in order to get their way, and has hurt several people in the past by doing just that. Chupa says that, while this was before MFK became interested in social justice, that she still has concerns about Maya Felix Kramer. And that it would be a particularly good idea for them to be careful of MFK. Because this conversation was posted, I'm guessing that the OP felt the same way.[/quote] Pastebin: [url]http://pastebin.com/qWX5qTvB[/url] And the previous thread: [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1418488[/url] To catch you up to speed As it stands now, everythings kind of a clusterfuck, everyones getting attacked, Game Journalists are pretty much confirmed shitlords, and Game Journalist sites Sponsors are apparently pissed. Oh, and Adam Baldwin is involved. [b]Getting involved in a productive way:[/b] And, you say, you want to help or get involved in some way? Do you not like corruption in Video Game Journalism? Good for you, Theres a list of these sites sponsors Here: [url]http://pastebin.com/faAxbF4E[/url] Should this Pastebin ever be rendered unusable via getting taken down somehow, heres multiple backups. [url=http://pastebin.com/An0QSG8W]1[/url] [url=http://pastebin.com/VHfHyLpS]2[/url] [url=http://pastebin.com/1z4qNRxY]3[/url] [url=http://pastebin.com/ZkjUdY3d]4[/url] [url=http://pastebin.com/Ezg0CVa3]5[/url] Submit polite, well written complaints to these companies, as[url=http://i.imgur.com/FcWU8XA.png] they're already getting pissed off[/url], it should give them a good kick in the bum. [QUOTE=adnzzzzZ;45860108]Gaming websites you can and should support: [url]http://gematsu.com/[/url] [url]www.geimaku.com[/url] [url]http://www.siliconera.com/[/url] [url]http://indiejuice.tv/[/url] [url]www.incgamers.com[/url] [url]http://www.gamerheadlines.com/[/url] [url]http://vidya.moe/[/url] [url]http://techraptor.net/[/url] [url]http://gamesnosh.com/[/url] [url]http://www.joystiq.com/[/url] [url]http://www.gamerevolution.com/[/url] [url]http://nichegamer.net/[/url] [url]http://operationrainfall.com[/url] [url]http://www.bluesnews.com/[/url] [url]http://www.gatheryourparty.com/[/url] A good way to fight bad journalism is by supporting good journalism.[/QUOTE] [b]Vivian James:[/b] Oh, also, through Zoe Quinn fucking with an indiegogo, 4Chan spawned a baby. [img]http://jesusfuck.me/di/EBXA/1409259598534.jpg[/img] Viva La Vivian James, etc. and so on. Discuss, mother fuckers. And should this thread be locked, i have a backup [url=http://pastebin.com/PGj2wWfV]pastebin of it[/url] here, as well.

Here's to the next 91 pages of hamburgers, Vivian James, PAX, Twitter, Tumblr, and so much more! Hopefully with less independent journalism talk and flame wars [sp]so that AshMan55 doesn't lock down everything again.[/sp]

So is there actually any proof that this Zoey person even did the stuff that she's accused of?

I feel like this is an important article to read before posting in this thread: [url]http://nyti.ms/1tEI6C1[/url] Remember everyone: People will bend evidence to further justify their preconceived opinions. Everything is a one-sided account. Trust no screenshots. That being said, I hope that Vivian James comes to fruition because the sheer beauty of 4chan coming together to donate to a feminist charity. Exciting times.

That thread was absolutely grorious, and now it's dead. Fascists.

[QUOTE=Mort Stroodle;45845834]So is there actually any proof that this Zoey person even did the stuff that she's accused of?[/QUOTE] She's admitted it in chat logs. Which was later confirmed to be real, Also in one of her posts, she completely sidestepped actually denying that she didnt do it, which any normal person would deny it if they did what she was accused of.

Thanks for making this! I have some info I can dump later if you want, mostly just videos and the original Maya Felix callout that we posted (which I highly recommend linking here, since it's one of the big things FP contributed to GamerGate). [QUOTE=Mort Stroodle;45845834]So is there actually any proof that this Zoey person even did the stuff that she's accused of?[/QUOTE] A total of five or six people have come out confirming different things she's done, and/or reinforcing Eron's post. There's also more that can confirm but are staying private. Combine that with the fact that Zoe is taking a "can neither confirm nor deny" approach, and it's very suspicious. Make your own conclusion, but even most people on their side are starting to agree that there might be some validity to the chat logs. Especially people who have read them. I can guarantee you, most people who think the Zoepost is crap have not read the enormous, 3mb+ logs.

[QUOTE=Reimu;45845985]Thanks for making this! I have some info I can dump later if you want, mostly just videos and the original Maya Felix callout that we posted (which I highly recommend linking here, since it's one of the big things FP contributed to GamerGate).[/QUOTE] No problem, i didnt post much in the previous thread, but i was following it daily and i think it needs to be discussed in some form. That and it gives me something to read when eating pringles. :v:

This is pretty much a consolidated report on all the shit that has gone down. (At least last I checked) [url]http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/quinnspiracy[/url]

When the other thread was closed I was afraid for a moment. "Oh no, not Facepunch too!" I'm glad I was wrong. :v:

Ashman mod abuse report that sucker to the web authorities...

Also, new Internet Aristocrat video is scheduled for today, most likely it'll be Zoe Quinn related, so i'll post it here if it is.

Impeach Ashman 2014

Whats best about this whole thing is that 4chan is doing more for dealing with gender inequality than Anita and social justice journalists who constantly demonize the gaming community as sexist misogynists.

[url]http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2014/08/26/sex-lies-and-video-games/[/url] how is this still a thing.

For the record AshMan posted this in his profile comments. [img]https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7333627/ShareX/2014-08/30T13-29-45.png[/img] He's not being a bad guy, honest! He was just (rightly) saying that the thread in SH was probably not the best section of the forums to talk about the whole thing.

Even with all this evidence and people still take her side? I do not understand people at all.

go outside [editline]30th August 2014[/editline] all of you just go outside

Also, here's the Maya Felix Kramer logs. They're very long, so I'm going to post these two tl;dr's that popped up on the reddit /r/Drama page: [thumb]http://i.imgur.com/gLmUiW1.png[/thumb] From the survivor: [quote]Zoe Quinn's PR rep exhibits the exact same behaviour and unethical practices as Zoe. Maya is a pro at manipulating, obfuscating and lying through their teeth to get their way. They come off as loving and warm, but behind it all is a very dark person. While I truly do wish them well, I cannot help but make this observation. They have a history of misogyny, hypocrisy and unethical behaviour related to their line of work. The details are in the link. Maya walking out unscathed is worse in my mind than Zoe walking away. Maya represents many devs and can do some mighty fine manipulative damage control for anyone they see fit. Even the most honest of people do not deserve that sort of power.[/quote] From myself: [quote]The OP got in touch with chupa regarding Maya Felix Kramer (aka legobutts, Zoe Quinn's PR rep), because they had concerns about Maya Felix Kramer as some sort of professional connection. Chupa explained that Maya Kramer has a history being manipulative and a "social chameleon," aka acting one way in order to please others. In particular, chupa used to work with Maya. When chupa first started working with Maya, Maya seemed extremely friendly, but they became mean-spirited and harsh over time. This was due to Maya feeling extremely jealous of several friendships (and a relationship) that chupa was forming, including chupa's close relationship with her boss. This escalated to an extreme extent. Maya began sabotaging relationships and projects, gaslighting chupa, lying about chupa, and making others hate her. Maya would lie about chupa to other people, and Maya bullied the her to the point of tears on several occasions. Then, Maya would try to be reassuring and comforting, only to start the cycle again. And Maya did this to several people. Maya also showed many other troubling problems. They openly admitted being misogynistic, telling Chupa "I hate women, I'm such a misogynist." Most of the social justice stuff Maya openly stands for is not true, and they're extremely exploitative and manipulative. Above all, Maya isn't above demolishing careers in order to get their way, and has hurt several people in the past by doing just that. Chupa says that, while this was before MFK became interested in social justice, that she still has concerns about Maya Felix Kramer. And that it would be a particularly good idea for them to be careful of MFK. Because this conversation was posted, I'm guessing that the OP felt the same way.[/quote]

[QUOTE=Reimu;45846108]Also, here's the Maya Felix Kramer logs. They're very long, so I'm going to post these two tl;dr's that popped up on the reddit /r/Drama page: [thumb]http://i.imgur.com/gLmUiW1.png[/thumb] From the survivor: From myself:[/QUOTE] Added to the OP.

[QUOTE=Forbes]I’ll echo Jim Sterling, who boils the whole controversy down to four major bullet points. “The way I see it,” Jim writes, “there are only four elements to this entire mess that have any relevance to the topics I care about professionally – the idea of sex between journalists and developers as a form of corruption, the whole mess with the DMCA takedown notices, harassment, and the overarching issue of devs and media being friendly. I am not going to say any of those issues should be the real takeaway of the whole thing, and I am not saying they’re equally important. I’m just saying they’re the sum total of aspects I feel I should have ANY interest in.” [B][I][U]I’m not going to focus on the first three.[/U][/I][/B][/QUOTE] k good to know you're picking the second least important topic to write some bullshit about goddamn it's like everyone's showing up trying to win the retard prize

[QUOTE=popBambi;45846089]Even with all this evidence and people still take her side? I do not understand people at all.[/QUOTE] It's incredibly easy to step into an internet echo chamber, and take opinion as fact once you've heard it enough times.

[QUOTE=Redswandir;45846149]k good to know you're picking the second least important topic to write some bullshit about goddamn it's like everyone's showing up trying to win the retard prize[/QUOTE] At this point, I think a lot of journos see the writing on the wall: don't touch the poop, because you're going to get dumped in it. So every journalist is trying to maintain this really awkward radio silence/sidestepping so they don't open up the floodgates. Now that advertisers are getting pissed off, all that needs to happen is one misstep, and everything will blow. They're obviously getting pissed, and the "gamers are dead" crap is 90% guaranteed to fall apart in front of their faces. No one wants to called something other than "gamer," they just want the various bullshit (from misogyny to corruption) to end.

[QUOTE=Reimu;45846187]At this point, I think a lot of journos see the writing on the wall: don't touch the poop, because you're going to get dumped in it. So every journalist is trying to maintain this really awkward radio silence/sidestepping so they don't open up the floodgates. Now that advertisers are getting pissed off, all that needs to happen is one misstep, and everything will blow. They're obviously getting pissed, and the "gamers are dead" crap is 90% guaranteed to fall apart in front of their faces. No one wants to called something other than "gamer," they just want the various bullshit (from misogyny to corruption) to end.[/QUOTE] I like the fact that with their whole "gamers are dead" lambasting they're forgetting one thing, if gamers are dead, then who the fuck needs these clowns around anymore then.

[QUOTE=Reimu;45846187]At this point, I think a lot of journos see the writing on the wall: don't touch the poop, because you're going to get dumped in it. So every journalist is trying to maintain this really awkward radio silence/sidestepping so they don't open up the floodgates. Now that advertisers are getting pissed off, all that needs to happen is one misstep, and everything will blow. They're obviously getting pissed, and the "gamers are dead" crap is 90% guaranteed to fall apart in front of their faces. No one wants to called something other than "gamer," they just want the various bullshit (from misogyny to corruption) to end.[/QUOTE] Whoever thought that the best course for business was to blatantly insult 90% of the people reading your article is a dunderfuck and deserves whats going to happen.

[QUOTE=Rockeiro123;45846161]It's incredibly easy to step into an internet echo chamber, and take opinion as fact once you've heard it enough times.[/QUOTE] Yeah. I got into a twitter argument with some pro-ZQ people, and the conversation basically runs in a cycle of: "Eron did it on purpose to hurt her." "Why?" "Because he had malicious intent." "Why?" "Because he knew what he was doing by posting on those sites?" "How?" "Because he purposefully meant to hurt her." If you ask them to deconstruct how they feel, it actually shuts them down. I got into a twitter argument with two of the people running around in a LOT of pro-ZQ camps, and they became very uncomfortable when they realized that maybe neutrality is a valid option. They thought it was triggering their internalized misogyny so they stopped talking to me. It's a massive echo chamber.

Wil Wheaton is a bit of a...Cunt about all of this.

Can we get the advertiser info added to the OP? Also, some examples of good quality emails? I would like for this to be front and center for people to be able to participate in.

[QUOTE=Indyclone77;45846200]Wil Wheaton is a bit of a...Cunt about all of this.[/QUOTE] I find the twitter pic i posted in the OP of him to be hilarious. Its just, like, god damn, just this shining golden example of everything wrong with how some people are going about this, he says some dumb bullshit and proceeds to show comments of people NOT saying what he said they were. [editline]30th August 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;45846203]Can we get the advertiser info added to the OP?[/QUOTE] Yeah, let me find the link. It would help if someone had the link, though. :v:

[QUOTE=RayvenQ;45846195]I like the fact that with their whole "gamers are dead" lambasting they're forgetting one thing, if gamers are dead, then who the fuck needs these clowns around anymore then.[/QUOTE] They keep on forgetting that most people actually like gamers, they just hate misogynistic gamers. Lots of feminists don't even like Tropes vs Women, and would prefer a much more nuanced look at gaming. So I don't know where a lot of these writers are coming from, other than the fact that they're all in a massive feel-good industry circlejerk. [QUOTE=AaronM202;45846197]Whoever thought that the best course for business was to blatantly insult 90% of the people reading your article is a dunderfuck and deserves whats going to happen.[/QUOTE] I agree. I think a lot of journalists have zero respect for people in the community. Like that Nathan Grayson FB post, where he talked about wanting to use the block button to cut off people's necks. That was kind of sad and disturbing, and it just shows you how unprofessional and immature these people are.