Which DSLR for film making?

[Dylan13198]

A topic more so along the lines of film making than photography but I need help choosing the right DSLR for myself. I've saved up a bit of money for a while and now is the picking and choosing part. I've been contemplating getting either a Canon T4i or a 60D. Now there's some what of a price difference and while that of course is a factor, I don't want it to be the deciding factor. I've done quite a bit of research and have seen that the T4i may be better for video than the 60D. The T4i has a Digic 5 processor while the 60D has a Digic 4 but I'm not quite sure how much of a difference that actually is. I don't know a ton about DSLR's yet but film making is something I've always been interested in and I've always resorted to making videos with one of my friend's dad's 5D. Any help would be great.

Note: One up-side of getting the 60D is that a friend of mine has a lot of really great lenses for the 5D and I would be able to use those on the 60D. I'm not quite sure if I'm able to do so on the T4i without some sort of adapter.

[Trogdon]

They can both use the same lenses. The digic 4 and 5 are pretty much the same thing realistically. They will take video that will look exactly the same between the two cameras.
I haven't used either one, but I think the 60D might have better ergonomics

[Dylan13198]

[QUOTE=Trogdon;39603621]They can both use the same lenses. The digic 4 and 5 are pretty much the same thing realistically. They will take video that will look exactly the same between the two cameras.
I haven't used either one, but I think the 60D might have better ergonomics[/QUOTE]

I was looking at some comparison chart of some sort and they're just so close. One thing I saw is that the 60D is weather sealed to shoot in the rain. And thanks for that info, knowing that the lenses are interchangeable between both is awesome.

[Elfy]

I have a 7d, and I can say it is awesome with magic lantern. IT has two digic 4's and takes CF cards.

[Raygen]

The T4i uses a better implementation of autofocus in videos, especially with Canon's new STM lenses. The heftier weight and better ergonomics of the 60D really don't make that much of a difference. If I had to make a choice, based purely on their video shooting capabilities, I'd go for the T4i.

[Trogdon]

Really the AF on the t4i isn't anything I would consider a selling feature. It works with 2 lenses and takes like 3-4 seconds or a few passes to lock on.

[Raygen]

[QUOTE=Trogdon;39604823]Really the AF on the t4i isn't anything I would consider a selling feature. It works with 2 lenses and takes like 3-4 seconds or a few passes to lock on.[/QUOTE]

Very true, but the point is the AF on the T4i is (slightly?) better than that on the 60D. Which is the comparison we're making here, right?

Essentially you can achieve the same results with both cameras, it's just that the 60D is a little more of an up-market model.

[Trogdon]

Yeah but I just want to make the distinction that its not something you can rely on, manual focus will be needed in 9/10 scenarios. If video AF is really important, consider the Sony SLT line which has AF that I would consider usable in most applications

[Angus513]

iv went through the same issue a while back and heres what i found out.
lenses wise both take ef and ef-s mount lenses so no difference there. the main advantages of the 60d over the t4i lie mainly in its picture taking ability but its also more comfortable to hold as its body is bigger. the digic 5 in the t4i is supposed to be better at removing sensor noise that the digic 4. i currently have the 7d which hasbthe same sensor as the 60 and t4i butbi also have a 5d mk ii and the picture quality difference is unquestionable. if you can afford a second hand 5d mk ii i would suggest that. otherwise rumor has it that canon will be releasing replacementsnfor the 60d and 7d later in the year wih digic 5s

[Raygen]

[QUOTE=Angus513;39630279]...rumor has it that canon will be releasing replacementsnfor the 60d and 7d later in the year wih digic 5s[/QUOTE]

Now that sounds really attractive, especially since I was planning to buy a 60D later in the year.

[Angus513]

[QUOTE=Raygen;39632374]Now that sounds really attractive, especially since I was planning to buy a 60D later in the year.[/QUOTE]

Yes it does, although I would still recommend a full frame sensor with digic 4 (5d mk ii) over a crop sensor with digic 5 (t4i or any new canon) just for the better image quality, plus you get much better bokeh with a full frame sensor

[Trogdon]

the digic processors honestly make like little to absolutely no difference in image quality

[Raygen]

[QUOTE=Trogdon;39637688]the digic processors honestly make like little to absolutely no difference in image quality[/QUOTE]

When you compare the ISO levels, the 60D (with Digic 4) even slightly outperforms the 650D / T4i (with Digic 5). I would say the processors don't really make a difference.

If I had the budget, I would take the 5D mk 3 for video. If you add a little sharpening and grading in post, the image really comes to life. Can't do that with any of the previous cameras as it will worsen anti-aliasing and moiré.

[pure.Joseph]

I would go for either. IIRC, the T4i has a touch screen which may be of use for you when you are shooting videos, if that is not of use, then I would consider the conditions you shoot in, as well as the ISO range you want.

The 60D has a wider ISO range, and more granular control, I believe the T4i only has multiples of 100.

As posted already, both do take EF-S and EF lenses, so they are all fine.

[Angus513]

the only difference between the digic 4 & 5 that youll notice is the digic 5 may write files slightly faster

[garychencool]

If you ever want to throw money, get this

[url]http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_c300[/url]

[Angoose]

Every guest speaker at my uni who does moving image recommends the 60D

[Angus513]

[QUOTE=Angoose;39670587]Every guest speaker at my uni who does moving image recommends the 60D[/QUOTE]

probably for its rotatable screen

[Angoose]

Nah it's because it has best quality and a lot of control for such a small price.

[garychencool]

The flippy screen because they are unlikely to get stuff like external video monitors, the control and the manual settings. It is the cheapest full hd dslr by canon in a professional body. also the kit lens is the good shitty kit lens.

[Elfy]

OR get a RED one.

[garychencool]

[QUOTE=Elfy;39675218]OR get a RED one.[/QUOTE]

Not RED EPIC

[Elfy]

[QUOTE=garychencool;39675235]Not RED EPIC[/QUOTE]

[url]http://www.red.com/products/red-one[/url]

a RED one..?

[Raygen]

[QUOTE=garychencool;39673547]The flippy screen because they are unlikely to get stuff like external video monitors, the control and the manual settings. It is the cheapest full hd dslr by canon in a professional body. also the kit lens is the good shitty kit lens.[/QUOTE]

And this is why you should get the 60D. Or save up and wait for the 70D since that's likely to come out at the end of the year.

[garychencool]

70D? Oh, that's interesting. Probably won't be able to get that as first DSLR and get a 60D instead in the summer.

[editline]22nd February 2013[/editline]

70D? Oh, that's interesting. Probably won't be able to get that as first DSLR and get a 60D instead in the summer.

[cueballv2themax]

arri alexa is where it's at

now
1. avoid full frame unless you have a very good and very justifiable reason.
WHY? i hear you scream. yes your screams are justified, we all love the 5D series.

[img]http://cdn1.mos.techradar.futurecdn.net//Review%20images/PhotoRadar/Canon/5D%20Mark%20III/canon-5d-mark-3-580-100.jpg[/img]

[I]getting your mirror out for the lads, mmm
[/I]
BUT

full frame is 35mm photography full frame, not super 35 cinema full frame.
this means you are getting a look and depth of field so razor thin it's impossible to control in many cases and similar to "vistavision" film, which you aren't likely to find on your local cutting room floor.
the crop sensor in the XX0D, X0D and 7D series is pretty close to super 35, giving you a look (in terms of dof) similar to that of a real cinema camera.

[I]so what can i do cueball?[/I]
good question kiddo

you can point your eyes towards the 600D
PROS:
flip screen: fucking hell, that's a lifesaver and you will use it more than you think.
it's not shit
it's like $100 or $200 cheaper than the 60D which produces exactly the same video

CONS:
your friend with a 60D will bully you over the slightly smaller body.

the money you save from buying a 600D can be put towards more lenses, and that is a good thing.

or the 60D
PROS:
bragging rights (yeah right, that's not even magnesium alloy)
flip screen
it's not shit

CONS:
literally paying $200 for photo features you won't use
your friends with a 7D will kick the shit out of you in alleyways.

but the 7D
PROS:
a fucking tough camera (actual metal on it)
looks good
makes good video

CONS:
no flip screen, so you're looking at an external monitor if you want to look at it any way but horizontal.
costs stupid money so you'll be using an expensive camera with shit glass
no manual audio
pretty old
if you leave it in your car overnight it might be cold to hold it when you go get it in the morning and might make your hands slightly chilly

[B]SO WHAT DO I DO?[/B]

Buy a 600D, stick magic lantern on it, shoot with a flat colour profile and thinking about your shots.
colour grade, keep yourself to 1/48s unless you need to move and don't think you're suddenly a big shot cinematographer.

you're not.

[url]http://vimeo.com/andrewperry[/url]
see what stuff from a 600D can be like

[Raygen]

[QUOTE=cueballv2themax;39698697]*story*[/QUOTE]

The 5DmkIII is the best DSLR for video. Why? Philip Bloom. [url=http://philipbloom.net/2012/12/31/conundrum/]He makes a distinction between "generation 1" video shooting DSLRs from Canon and a "generation 2", the latter of which is comprised solely of the 5DmkIII.[/url]

So I'd wait and see if the 70D belongs to generation 2. (You could also wait for the 7DmkII but that's likely to be shitloads expensive and not have a flippy floppy screen.)

[cueballv2themax]

[QUOTE=Raygen;39701960]The 5DmkIII is the best DSLR for video. Why? Philip Bloom. [url=http://philipbloom.net/2012/12/31/conundrum/]He makes a distinction between "generation 1" video shooting DSLRs from Canon and a "generation 2", the latter of which is comprised solely of the 5DmkIII.[/url]

So I'd wait and see if the 70D belongs to generation 2. (You could also wait for the 7DmkII but that's likely to be shitloads expensive and not have a flippy floppy screen.)[/QUOTE]

can op even afford it we're talking hundreds more for a brand new camera

[Raygen]

[QUOTE=cueballv2themax;39703938]can op even afford it we're talking hundreds more for a brand new camera[/QUOTE]

Just giving more info about video modes on Canon's current DSLRs.

I'm sure that if the 70D belongs to this "generation 2", it's worth saving up for. Sharpening in post will make the image come alive, not bring back the aliasing and moiré as generation 1 DSLRs would.

[Elfy]

[QUOTE=cueballv2themax;39698697]
but the 7D
PROS:
a fucking tough camera (actual metal on it)
looks good
makes good video

CONS:
no flip screen, so you're looking at an external monitor if you want to look at it any way but horizontal.
costs stupid money so you'll be using an expensive camera with shit glass
no manual audio
pretty old
if you leave it in your car overnight it might be cold to hold it when you go get it in the morning and might make your hands slightly chilly
[/QUOTE]

My 7d has manual audio ;)