[video=youtube;mfWjgAK-VsQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfWjgAK-VsQ[/video]
[url=http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2014/08/12/westlake-mall-cop-ignores-agitator-maces-african-american-bystander-at-israel-protest]Article[/url]
Then a cop chimes in, "LET HIM DO HIS JOOOB"
jesus christ
-snip sorry I had a human emotion-
[QUOTE=Samg381;45689246]Honestly I felt bad for the mall cop towards the end. Sure he fucked up and maced the completely wrong guy, but from what I could see he was trying to stay professional and not just listen to the people around him. He could have been a lot more brutal and the situation could have been a lot worse.[/QUOTE]
yeah i can feel that too in the sense that i know what he's going through. as a soccer referee, you might not be able to see anything during a play but you know something happened, and you may eject the completely wrong player and their team will confront you and yell, but if you go back on your decision then your credibility after that is 0.
shouldn't have maced the wrong guy though wtf.
During a protest? Wrong place, wrong time. Very shitty though. But, again, if it wasn't the wrong guy that security guy could've gotten into a lot of shittier shit.
lawsuit
Private property? It's a fucking mall.
Do you smell that
the faint aroma of lawsuit?
[QUOTE=Samg381;45689246]Honestly I felt bad for the mall cop towards the end. Sure he fucked up and maced the completely wrong guy, but from what I could see he was trying to stay professional and not just listen to the people around him. He could have been a lot more brutal and the situation could have been a lot worse.[/QUOTE]
yeah give him a medal for not beating the guy
[QUOTE=cdr248;45689345]Private property? It's a fucking mall.[/QUOTE]
Which are generally owned by someone.
The guy that was pepper sprayed was awfully calm for being maced.
I've heard being maced is one of the worst feelings in the world, given it's supposed to incapacitate you and all.
[QUOTE=Naelstrom;45689548]The guy that was pepper sprayed was awfully calm for being maced.
I've heard being maced is one of the worst feelings in the world, given it's supposed to incapacitate you and all.[/QUOTE]
Pretty sure there is a difference between pepper spray and mace.
[QUOTE=cdr248;45689345]Private property? It's a fucking mall.[/QUOTE]
Private property refers to property owned by non-government entities.
Your home is private property. Your local walmart is private property.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;45689458]Which are generally owned by someone.[/QUOTE]
I just think it's funny when the cop is saying "you aren't supposed to go in there" when you can see a bunch of shoppers already doing their shit in there.
[QUOTE=Tippmann357;45689575]Pretty sure there is a difference between pepper spray and mace.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mace_(spray)[/url] There was originally a difference, but now a lot of people usually just refer to OC (pepper) spray as mace.
[QUOTE=Crash155;45689133]
Then another mall cop chimes in, "LET HIM DO HIS JOOOB"
jesus christ[/QUOTE]
That's not another Mall Cop. The guy with the bike helmet is a real cop.
[editline]14th August 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=cdr248;45689345]Private property? It's a fucking mall.[/QUOTE]
The Security Guards are employed my the mall. The Mall is private property. All those people wanted to follow the guard and the backpack guy into the mall and they're causing a scene so they didn't allow them onto mall property so there wasn't a parade of people screaming at the guard while people are trying to shop.
[editline]14th August 2014[/editline]
Honestly, I don't know what happened. If he really maced the wrong guy, that sucks and he's probably going to lose his job. I don't know for certain that's really what happened. Not to mention a lawsuit if it really was a genuine fuck up. But those audience members aren't needed. They voiced their opinion, the guard obviously isn't going to listen to them so they should be quiet and when that Cop came they should have calmly presented themselves as witnesses to him so they could sort it out later. No matter what, it was going to get sorted out. The shouting and crowd didn't help anyone.
I've seen apprehensions of shoplifters go like this. Where someone resists being taken to the back for shoplifting and than they scuffle on the ground and all the sudden people become a fucking audience and start shouting and throwing accusations even though it's non of their business.
For example. You can try to apprehend a shoplifter and if she's a woman and you have to block her and push her back inside the building people immediately turn into white knights and ASSUME she's innocent simply because she's a woman and you're the evil establishment beating on a woman. They have no idea what they're talking about, are straight out wrong and need to mind their own damn business.
[QUOTE=Samg381;45689246]Honestly I felt bad for the mall cop towards the end. Sure he fucked up and maced the completely wrong guy, but from what I could see he was trying to stay professional and not just listen to the people around him. He could have been a lot more brutal and the situation could have been a lot worse.[/QUOTE]
i dont, the cop looked like your typical squid on a power trip
According to the article there was some sort of pro-Israel protest and one of the guys that was right next to the gentlemen with the backpack had his shirt off and was calling people "Towel-Heads" and "Sand-Niggers" so the Security Guard was dealing with him and telling him to stop when the guy in the backpack came over and wanted to get into the mall. (Why he didn't just go around the guard and the shirtless man, I'm not sure)
When the backpack guy started walking toward the guard he told him to stop and he (this is literally a quote) said "Why are you pointing that mace at me, he's the one being aggressive." and if that was what he said he may not have said it nicely, combined with the fact he was ignoring his 'stop' command he felt threatened enough to use the mace. Maybe or maybe not the best decision but it's easy to sit back and not be involved in the situation personally and just throw around blame but that was probably a scary situation for a security guard to be in.
And in the grand scheme of things. His eyes will burn for a day and life goes on. He wasn't killed, he wasn't severely injured. He'll take it to court and they'll make a better more informed decision on who was guilty of what than we can by watching a youtube video and reading a news article.
As they were going down the steps, I'm sure one of the bystanders shouted 'Why did you rape, uh, mace a black guy for?'
I'd have just let them finish their procedure, regardless of innocence or not. People just piling in doesn't help. The truth will out.
What's a mall cop anyway? Are they just glorified security guards?
[QUOTE=Memobot;45690811]As they were going down the steps, I'm sure one of the bystanders shouted 'Why did you rape, uh, mace a black guy for?'
What's a mall cop anyway? Are they just glorified security guards?[/QUOTE]
They are security guards. But if a security guard is employed my a mall or shopping center they become 'mall cops' but that's not an official term, it's just sorta slang and usually not a flattering title either.
They're no more glorified than any other guards. The uniform, duty belts, equipment and hats all vary depending on the contractor it just so happens that higher-class malls usually dress their guards up to look like cops to present a more professional image and deter people from actually causing trouble.
Just let him do his thing, get processed, contact a lawyer. They'd be all over this.
Of course, if it is the wrong guy that is. Then it'll be fine.
[QUOTE=Apache249;45690046][URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mace_(spray)[/URL] There was originally a difference, but now a lot of people usually just refer to OC (pepper) spray as mace.[/QUOTE]
I already looked it up. The page for pepper spray is far longer compared to the page for mace. From what I remember, mace is more of a liquid that comes out in a stream while pepper spray is aerosol.
[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper_spray[/URL]
I don't know. Maybe they're both the same but I always thought there was a difference.
[QUOTE=Tippmann357;45691298]I already looked it up. The page for pepper spray is far longer compared to the page for mace. From what I remember, mace is more of a liquid that comes out in a stream while pepper spray is aerosol.
[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper_spray[/URL]
I don't know. Maybe they're both the same but I always thought there was a difference.[/QUOTE]
Pepper spray comes out as a liquid too. It depends on the type though. There are a lot of pepper sprays that are more aerosol but the stronger ones are like a liquid stream.
[QUOTE=CodeMonkey3;45690787]
When the backpack guy started walking toward the guard he told him to stop and he (this is literally a quote) said "Why are you pointing that mace at me, he's the one being aggressive." and if that was what he said he may not have said it nicely, combined with the fact he was ignoring his 'stop' command he felt threatened enough to use the mace. Maybe or maybe not the best decision but it's easy to sit back and not be involved in the situation personally and just throw around blame but that was probably a scary situation for a security guard to be in.[/QUOTE]
are you implying it's his fault for not politely asking to not get maced for literally nothing
[QUOTE=Venezuelan;45692242]are you implying it's his fault for not politely asking to not get maced for literally nothing[/QUOTE]
I wasn't there. I'm not part of a jury, I can't say what happened. Just offering different theories as to why the events went the way they did.
It's possible to say polite or reasonable things in a threatening matter and considering the guard was probably already tensed up from dealing with the shirtless racist it wouldn't take much to put him on the offense like he did. It's hard for me to illustrate with text but you can say. "Hey, how's it going bro." which is by it's self a very friendly greeting but you say that same phrase with different body language, different tone of voice and while walking toward the person it can become very intimidating. I'm sure you've been in a situation like this at one point or another. Especially given the situation being as iffy as it already was I didn't take much to escalate it.
If you're walking a dark street at night and some complete stranger from down the block yells "Yo, Bro. Come over here. I wanna talk to you." while spreading his arms and walking toward you with a frown, it makes you nervous right? The setting is bad, it's a dark empty street late at night. The man is a complete stranger. And although what he actually said by it's self is completely reasonable the fact he's yelling at you, approaching you and frowning presents a very scary situation. Which is more or less what could of happened here. Only instead of a dark street it's a crowd of angry, yelling people, one of which is shirtless and screaming about 'sandniggers' than suddenly some guy approaches you. You have no idea what he wants, all you're concerned about is that in this particular situation he may close that distance and bring you harm.
I still don't get it though. It's an open plaza. If he wanted to get into the mall like he said he did, I don't see why he couldn't go around the security guard and screaming shirtless racist like literally everyone else was doing and instead decided to try to slip around the guard which was ordering him to stop the entire time whilst producing his mace.
If I was in the guy's shoes, I'd honestly have told everyone to fuck off, cause they were just agitating the mall cop and making them get more pissed off. I'd have just wanted the dumb mall cop to do whatever he had to do so I could hurry up and get away.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;45689458]Which are generally owned by someone.[/QUOTE]
Which was probably subsidized by the government so the people have the right to go in there and film police brutality. I don't see what the problem is.
[editline]15th August 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=CodeMonkey3;45690787]According to the article there was some sort of pro-Israel protest and one of the guys that was right next to the gentlemen with the backpack had his shirt off and was calling people "Towel-Heads" and "Sand-Niggers" so the Security Guard was dealing with him and telling him to stop when the guy in the backpack came over and wanted to get into the mall. (Why he didn't just go around the guard and the shirtless man, I'm not sure)
When the backpack guy started walking toward the guard he told him to stop and he (this is literally a quote) said "Why are you pointing that mace at me, he's the one being aggressive." and if that was what he said he may not have said it nicely, combined with the fact he was ignoring his 'stop' command he felt threatened enough to use the mace. Maybe or maybe not the best decision but it's easy to sit back and not be involved in the situation personally and just throw around blame but that was probably a scary situation for a security guard to be in.
And in the grand scheme of things. His eyes will burn for a day and life goes on. He wasn't killed, he wasn't severely injured. He'll take it to court and they'll make a better more informed decision on who was guilty of what than we can by watching a youtube video and reading a news article.[/QUOTE]
But what justified making someone's eyes burn for a day? Even if they did target the right guy, I wouldn't say the macing was justified. Arrest him and if he attempts to resiist, you can subdue. I've been maced before and it's not fun. I wouldn't wish it on anybody, especially if they didn't deserve it.
Maybe the guy with the backpack thought the officer was telling the screaming racist to stop? And the guy who got maced was like oh he must be referring to the guy who is actually causing trouble. What makes people think the guy was just trying disobeying the mall cops order when he even said this "Why are you pointing that mace at me, he's the one being aggressive." The man who got maced literally had no reason to think he was the one the cop was telling to stop.
Who cares if he was being a screaming racist? What's the mace going to do? Make him scream more. Attempt an arrest and subdue. Don't mace the guy, especially the wrong one.
Damn how do you even fuck up that bad. Mace is supposed to be used as a non-lethal deterrent, not a magic way to make a guy stop yelling racial slurs. At least get the right guy too.
This happened last Saturday at the Westlake Mall in Seattle, there was a pro-Palestine rally going on near the mall(near it though, not on their property), the shirtless guy was very belligerent and harassing the protesters before ripping his shirt off and chasing down the man wearing the backpack. The man wearing the backpack turned around and was ready to defend himself, but stopped after the mall cop approached, he definitely did not do anything to provoke being maced. This mall cop has a local reputation of being very abrasive and unreasonable, and was previously a corrections officer before becoming a security officer. [URL="http://thedignityvirus.com/2014/08/09/activists-protest-bombing-of-gaza-and-innocent-passerby-harassed-by-pro-israel-opposition-and-arrested/"]The images in this article[/URL] give a better understanding of what happened prior to the video in the OP.
[editline]15th August 2014[/editline]
Oh and the cherry on top, after he maced him he took him on to private property(he was on the sidewalk before), essentially kidnapping him(Mall security can only hold someone in custody for breaking the law on mall property, and even then they can only hold them until a real cop shows up).
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