Fucked up news: Traumatized Newtown Officers Low on Sick Days. Soon will go without paycheck.
41 replies, posted
Source: [url]http://newtown.patch.com/articles/report-traumatized-newtown-officers-low-on-sick-days[/url]
[quote]
According to an AP report, a small number of Newtown police officers have yet to return to work since the tragic Dec. 14 shootings at Sandy Hook Elementary School, traumatized by the senseless carnage they witnessed that day.
Unfortunately, this trauma is not covered by workers’ compensation and some officers have used up their personal days and “could soon be at risk of going without a paycheck,” AP's Michael Melia reports.
There are less than 15 officers “critically affected” by the shootings, according to police union attorney Eric Brown, and only a few have taken extended time off.
Area police officers have stepped up to help, volunteering to cover shifts and give Newtown officers some rest, though that was only through Christmas Day and doesn’t cover missed pay.
Newtown’s Volunteer Ambulance Corps (NVAC) members spoke with Patch a week after the incident about responding to such a horrific scene and the toll it has taken on the volunteers.
"Everyone goes on autopilot," NVAC Secretary-Treasurer Jordan Reed explained. "You're here to do a job and you have to focus on that. And that's exactly what people did, whether they were [at the station] and overwhelmed, or on scene and dealing with seeing some awful stuff and trying to help families. When you get back here and started to realize the scope of it, it started to hit."
[/quote]
This is bullshit.
[QUOTE=faze;38999042]Source: [url]http://newtown.patch.com/articles/report-traumatized-newtown-officers-low-on-sick-days[/url]
This is bullshit.[/QUOTE]
Really? I get six weeks sick pay from my crappy supermarket job not including statutory sick pay - they don't even get that? That's pretty fucked up.
To be honest (don't take this the wrong way please), as a police officer you're putting yourself at risk of seeing these kind of horrible things, and you have to get back to work eventually. It's been over 2 weeks now... it's your job and you have to move on and get back to work.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;38999129]To be honest (don't take this the wrong way please), as a police officer you're putting yourself at risk of seeing these kind of horrible things, and you have to get back to work eventually. It's been over 2 weeks now... it's your job and you have to move on and get back to work.[/QUOTE]
Try seeing 20 dead kids shot at close range and see how you react.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;38999129]To be honest (don't take this the wrong way please), as a police officer you're putting yourself at risk of seeing these kind of horrible things, and you have to get back to work eventually. It's been over 2 weeks now... it's your job and you have to move on and get back to work.[/QUOTE]
You clean up the bodies of a bunch of dead kids and try not to be traumatized about it. Just because it's your job doesn't make you immune to it.
[b]EDIT:[/B]
Seriously, what you said is stupid. It's like faulting soldiers for being hospitalized with PTSD. "It's their job" is not an excuse, that kind of shit is why we have so many mentally unstable veterans.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;38999129]To be honest (don't take this the wrong way please), as a police officer you're putting yourself at risk of seeing these kind of horrible things, and you have to get back to work eventually. It's been over 2 weeks now... it's your job and you have to move on and get back to work.[/QUOTE]
What is PTSD
-snip-
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;38999129]To be honest (don't take this the wrong way please), as a police officer you're putting yourself at risk of seeing these kind of horrible things, and you have to get back to work eventually. It's been over 2 weeks now... it's your job and you have to move on and get back to work.[/QUOTE]
Mate, I saw shit in Afghanistan that measures up to this, maybe even a little worse. Now because I had a job to do as a soldier, your telling me to shrug off seeing my friends die, or seeing the desecrated bodies of women and children, killed because their husbands and fathers didn't want to join some crazy jihad.
Fuck you, mate, just fuck you.
[QUOTE=Jund;38999200]What is PTSD[/QUOTE]
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posttraumatic_stress_disorder]Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder.[/url]
tl;dr you see the most terrible things that human beings can do to one another and have to take it home with you.
[QUOTE=rrunyan;38999241][url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posttraumatic_stress_disorder]Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder.[/url]
tl;dr you see the most terrible things that human beings can do to one another and have to take it home with you.[/QUOTE]
You missed the context sir.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;38999129]To be honest (don't take this the wrong way please), as a police officer you're putting yourself at risk of seeing these kind of horrible things, and you have to get back to work eventually. It's been over 2 weeks now... it's your job and you have to move on and get back to work.[/QUOTE]
I am not taking this the wrong way but there isn't a set human recovery period and then all the sudden you are all better. It is their job but even cops don't expect to have to do stuff like this. Kind of like my cousin did not expect to have to go around collecting severed limbs off rooftops after 9/11 from the towers collapsing. It's shit that sticks with you forever. Ask any war vet who has been in combat. The toughest human beings remember that stuff forever.
Strange things happen to people who experience trauma like this. Giving them some time to recover and paying them for it should be the least they are doing.
Where the hell is their short term/ long term disability coverage? Hell I have it working in a warehouse.
Cool so they're reporting that it would be within the rules to not pay them
and not that their paychecks are currently being withheld
[QUOTE=Moustacheman;38999236]Mate, I saw shit in Afghanistan that measures up to this, maybe even a little worse. Now because I had a job to do as a soldier, your telling me to shrug off seeing my friends die, or seeing the desecrated bodies of women and children, killed because their husbands and fathers didn't want to join some crazy jihad.
Fuck you, mate, just fuck you.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for your service but do elaborate.
Also, we're allowed to think this is bullshit.
I work in the funeral business. Death is never pretty. It's sometimes ugly and smelly, very rarely at all nice. To understand what these police officers went through is impossible without being there, but I work in a controlled, clean environment and I can only try to relate to the aftermath. These guys are put into a world of chaos - an unpredictable, dangerous and violent environment at a daily basis, risking their personal safety for the sake of public well being and security. They are trained for it, yes, but no amount of training will prepare you for an event like that. Some of those officers must've seen things that were quite simply traumatizing. They are likely depressed and in shock. They need assistance, not punishment.
[QUOTE=Moustacheman;38999236]Mate, I saw shit in Afghanistan that measures up to this, maybe even a little worse. Now because I had a job to do as a soldier, your telling me to shrug off seeing my friends die, or seeing the desecrated bodies of women and children, killed because their husbands and fathers didn't want to join some crazy jihad.
Fuck you, mate, just fuck you.[/QUOTE]
Chill. I'm talking about the money aspect. We can't just pay police officers to time off to recover which could take months to years. It would be a huge economic burden to everybody. They need to work during their recovery process. You're taking it as a personal offense to war veterans.
[QUOTE=faze;38999393]Thanks for your service but do elaborate.
Also, we're allowed to think this is bullshit.[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't bullshit about something this serious, mate. That's just fucking low.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Sgt;38999278]I am not taking this the wrong way but there isn't a set human recovery period and then all the sudden you are all better. It is their job but even cops don't expect to have to do stuff like this. Kind of like my cousin did not expect to have to go around collecting severed limbs off rooftops after 9/11 from the towers collapsing. It's shit that sticks with you forever. Ask any war vet who has been in combat. The toughest human beings remember that stuff forever.
Strange things happen to people who experience trauma like this. Giving them some time to recover and paying them for it should be the least they are doing.
Where the hell is their short term/ long term disability coverage? Hell I have it working in a warehouse.[/QUOTE]
Yeah I agree. Most people need a lot of time to recover from that sort of thing before returning to daily life, and it shouldn't be limited at all. Those officers will never really fully recover from it either. Hopefully the department will catch a lot of flak for this.
The most therapeutic thing for these police officers would be to get back to work. They were normal humans reacting to a trauamatic event how a normal human would. Now if this drags on for more than a month, thats when it can get a little dicey.
Stress is okay in the event and even after, but for an extended period of time after the traumatic event is when it can cause problems. Avoidance is a major symptom of PTSD, and the best thing for these people to do is get back to work.
You see a lot of fucked up things as a police officer. Suicides, rape/murder victims, babies dismembered in car crashes, 15 month old corpses. They shouldn't have taken the job if they weren't able to handle this.
yeah, fuck those guys for not showing superhuman feats of emotional strength
[QUOTE=Greenen72;39000369]yeah, fuck those guys for not showing superhuman feats of emotional strength[/QUOTE]
Emotional strength is a job requirement when you're a police officer. It's not a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress," it' s a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress even though it was their job to do so."
[QUOTE=Kasuga Ayumu;39000402]Emotional strength is a job requirement when you're a police officer. It's not a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress," it' s a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress even though it was their job to do so."[/QUOTE]
if you list 'able to cope with mass of murdered children after 2 weeks leave' as a job requirement for being a cop then good luck on finding enough people to actually have a police force
[QUOTE=Kasuga Ayumu;39000402]Emotional strength is a job requirement when you're a police officer. It's not a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress," it' s a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress even though it was their job to do so."[/QUOTE]
Because every cop thinks about the fucked up shit they might have to see when they get the job.
I do sympathize with the cops, but at what point do we determine the optimal "grieving and settling down" time? At some point work has to be done, and I think having that deadline is better than allowing people unlimited time off without pay. As people have said earlier, getting back to the job and getting back to a routine might be the best way for people to recover from this trauma, rather than avoidance.
However, if their shifts are being covered by other people I don't see the big issue behind letting people who were more directly affected by the tragedy stay on extended leave.
[QUOTE=yumyumshisha;39000778]I do sympathize with the cops, but at what point do we determine the optimal "grieving and settling down" time? At some point work has to be done, and I think having that deadline is better than allowing people unlimited time off without pay. As people have said earlier, getting back to the job and getting back to a routine might be the best way for people to recover from this trauma, rather than avoidance.
However, if their shifts are being covered by other people I don't see the big issue behind letting people who were more directly affected by the tragedy stay on extended leave.[/QUOTE]
Thank you for putting that into words better than I can.
[QUOTE=Kasuga Ayumu;39000327]You see a lot of fucked up things as a police officer. Suicides, rape/murder victims, babies dismembered in car crashes, 15 month old corpses. They shouldn't have taken the job if they weren't able to handle this.[/QUOTE]
Seeing that stuff is actually pretty rare in most departments. Paramedics see worse than officers. No one can just 'deal with it.' It takes time, treatment, and patience. The overwhelming of one's ability to cope can happen to anyone. It's not like we can hire desensitized super-humans to take the job.
[QUOTE=yumyumshisha;39000778]I do sympathize with the cops, but at what point do we determine the optimal "grieving and settling down" time? At some point work has to be done, and I think having that deadline is better than allowing people unlimited time off without pay. As people have said earlier, getting back to the job and getting back to a routine might be the best way for people to recover from this trauma, rather than avoidance.
However, if their shifts are being covered by other people I don't see the big issue behind letting people who were more directly affected by the tragedy stay on extended leave.[/QUOTE]
Well first off, "we" don't determine that kind of stuff. Those in charge of those who are on leave likely have enough knowledge of the situation and experience to know how to deal with this stuff.
[QUOTE=Greenen72;39001013]Well first off, "we" don't determine that kind of stuff. Those in charge of those who are on leave likely have enough knowledge of the situation and experience to know how to deal with this stuff.[/QUOTE]
That was more of a hypothetical "we," obviously we don't determine that. I was referring to whoever does determine pay and whatnot.
This is just wrong on behalf of the department.
They should have CISM and then allow them to take as many paid-days off as they need (within reason).
[QUOTE=Kasuga Ayumu;39000402]Emotional strength is a job requirement when you're a police officer. It's not a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress," it' s a matter of "someone was unable to handle the stress even though it was their job to do so."[/QUOTE]
You don't know how the real world works, do you
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