I'm about 9 minutes in and so far it's pretty good. It's more direct and to the point that the previous video and the fact that she's using current games as examples shows how writers are still beating this dead horse of a trope.
Oh boy, here we go again. Get ready for the shitstorm people :v: . I may post my personal opinion on the video later.
[QUOTE=zizzleplix;40817471]Oh boy, here we go again. Get ready for the shitstorm people :v: . I may post my personal opinion on the video later.[/QUOTE]
I don't see why there [I]has[/I] to be a shitstorm, as long as everyone keeps it civil and stops getting defensive it should be ok. I'm pretty sure we can all manage that, right?
I commend Anita for making these videos sharing her opinion and attempting to raise awareness. It is, in fact, completely disgusting that people demonize Anita and insult her with such veracity, she's doing nothing wrong besides sharing what she thinks is an issue.
[editline]28th May 2013[/editline]
Oh [B]HELL[/B] no, she better not talk shit about Kingdom Hearts
She is not sexy, i cant watch. brb getting fedora
UGH FUCKING FEMINAZIS FUGRUHJEHEJ
[QUOTE=Dr. Gestapo;40817488]I don't see why there [I]has[/I] to be a shitstorm, as long as everyone keeps it civil and stops getting defensive it should be ok. I'm pretty sure we can all manage that, right?[/QUOTE]
I'd like for there to be civil discussion, but you know how facepunch is. It may start out civil but all it takes is for one person to say something stupid and BAM! the thread gets de-railed and it's back and forth until one side leaves. I know I may seem pessimistic but seeing happen many times before here hopefully you can see where I'm coming from.
All around fantastic video, Anita is a perfect example of what we need with women in the industry right now and I cannot give her enough praise for rising up and being a voice we always needed.
This still took a while to finish really.
Oh shit, she just shit all over thunderf00t's stupid response video by explaining why Double Dragon Neon's end credit nut punch is irrelevant.
[QUOTE=Lambadvanced;40817579]Oh shit, she just shit all over thunderf00t's stupid response video by explaining why Double Dragon Neon's end credit nut punch is irrelevant.[/QUOTE]
Yeah I agree. Thunderf00t's reply was pretty bad.
I see where she's coming from. I just don't want to end up with games where no characters can have an opinion on each other without it being considered sexist by fembeasts. Neither do i want to end up in a situation where actually sexual content always has to be barked at. I agree that we seem to have an industry that's seriously confused about what a female person is and how they're not just a prize. But going all Kotaku and starting shitstorms over harmless shit is just not the way to do it.
If some topics have to go off the table for 5 years in order to get a broader table where we can put them back on along with a ton of other subjects, i'm all for it. But the current feminist trend where women aren't female, but an entity... It's just taking it too far.
Abandon Videogames guys, just let them have it....
It's time to play Vidya Gaems!!
The new way to enjoy games for the content without having to worry about the whys and why nots. You get your gun and and you shoot the bad people. You make your base and you invade the other bases. You take your car and you race it to the finish line or finally... You create your character then grind like a motherfucker til you're a lvl 88 Dark Ultra Mega Wizard.
Sexual representation of women and all that goes with it, ege "HALP!", "I'm hurt", "I'm in shock" or other variants of "I can't!" should only be a small corner of the full picture.
[QUOTE=Bomimo;40817666]But going all Kotaku and starting shitstorms over harmless shit is just not the way to do it.
If some topics have to go off the table for 5 years in order to get a broader table where we can put them back on along with a ton of other subjects, i'm all for it. But the current feminist trend where women aren't female, but an entity... It's just taking it too far.[/QUOTE]
It seems that you think that feminists want *every* female character in video games to be strong, complex, and independent, and never to be sexualized.
What we actually want is a variety of female characters in games of all personalities and body types, so that women aren't portrayed *almost exclusively* as whitewashed subordinate sex objects.
We don't want to remove skimpy, overtly sexual armor for females from games; we want male and female characters to have the same degree of variance with regards to how sexually [B]or[/B] asexually they are depicted. In essence, we want male and female characters to have roughly the same potential level of depth, variety, and sexuality in gaming.
And currently, they don't.
I don't think [B]anyone[/B] is advocating for the total elimination of sexy ladies in games. I think they would prefer if there were more dimensions to their personalities though. There are feminist critiques of Bayonetta, however there are feminists who see Bayonetta as an empowering representation of femininity, even with her entirely unrealistic proportions.
I don't play video games to find something to jerk off to. Keep objectification of men and women were it belongs: porn.
I couldn't help but chuckle at the trigger warning.
just a heads up, the video is filled with spoilers of various games so consider refraining if that bothers you.
what she posted as spoilers (according to her description)
· Bionic Commando (2009)
· Borderlands 2 (2012)
· Breath of Fire IV (2000)
· Castlevania: The Dracula X Chronicles (2007)
· Castlevania: Lament of Innocence (2003)
· Castlevania: Lords of Shadow (2010)
· Dante's Inferno (2010)
· The Darkness II (2012)
· Dead Space (2008)
· Devil Summoner: Raidou Kuzunoha vs The Soulless Army (2006)
· Double Dragon Neon (2012)
· Gears of War 2 (2008)
· God of War: Ghost of Sparta (2010)
· The Godfather: The Game (2006)
· Grand Theft Auto III (2001)
· Hotline Miami (2012)
· Ico (2001)
· Infamous (2009)
· Inversion (2012)
· Kane & Lunch: Dead Men (2007)
· The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess (2006)
· MediEvil 2 (2000)
· Ninja Gaiden 3 (2010)
· Pandora's Tower (2011)
· Prey (2006)
· Resident Evil 5 (2009)
· Shadows of the Damned (2011)
· Tenchu: Shadow Assassins (2009)
Why does she seem to have the impression that men are all demons or sexist, I don't disagree with some of her points but she seems to have this negative perception of [I]all[/I] men.
All around great video. I thought the first one was pretty good, but I definitely preferred this one. Some particularly important quotes (emphasis added by me):
[QUOTE=Anita Sarkeesian]please keep in mind that [B]it’s both possible (and even necessary) to simultaneously enjoy a piece of media while also being critical[/B] of it’s more problematic or pernicious aspects[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Anita Sarkeesian]Of course, if you look at any of these games in isolation, you will be able to find incidental narrative circumstances that can be used to explain away the inclusion of violence against women as a plot device. But[B] just because a particular event might “makes sense” within the internal logic of a fictional narrative – that doesn’t, in and of itself justify its use[/B]. Games don’t exist in a vacuum and therefore can’t be divorced from the larger cultural context of the real world.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Anita Sarkeesian]Despite these troubling implications, [B]game creators aren’t necessarily all sitting around twirling their nefarious looking mustaches while consciously trying to figure out how to best misrepresent women as part of some grand conspiracy[/B].
[B]Most probably just haven’t given much thought to the underlying messages their games are sending[/B] and in many cases developers have backed themselves into a corner with their own game mechanics.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Anita Sarkeesian]So to be clear here, [B]the problem is not the fact that female characters die or suffer[/B]. Death touches all of our lives eventually and as such it’s often an integral part of dramatic storytelling. To say that women could never die in stories would be absurd, but [B]it’s important to consider the ways that women’s deaths are framed and examine how and why they’re written[/B].[/QUOTE]
Technically Deadlight doesn't count since you don't save his wife does it ?
Also Nero isn't even close to brooding, he's downright sassy in every cutscene that doesn't include Kyrie getting hurt.
[QUOTE=ZombieDawgs;40817790]Why does she seem to have the impression that men are all demons or sexist, I don't disagree with some of her points but she seems to have this negative perception of [I]all[/I] men.[/QUOTE]
Where did you get the impression that she's saying/implying that "all men are evil, misogynistic pigs!"?
I still don't understand why she feels that the only reason that the male protagonists in video games go after a kidnapped woman was because she was his property or an object. Wouldn't any normal person go after someone if they got kidnapped because they care about them?
[QUOTE=zizzleplix;40817845]Where did you get the impression that she's saying/implying that "all men are evil, misogynistic pigs!"?[/QUOTE]
Just by the wording she uses, she seems to imply that we're somehow inferior because we play this game, or that we're lesser or something. I don't know it's just the vibe I personally get from the video.
It might be because she's just trying to sound smarter by using bigger words, I don't know.
[QUOTE=Mio Akiyama;40817863]I still don't understand why she feels that the only reason that the male protagonists in video games go after a kidnapped woman was because she was his property or an object. Wouldn't any normal person go after someone if they got kidnapped because they care about them?[/QUOTE]
Yeah that's one thing I think shows that she's looking at this from a biased perspective, male female drama is just a normal part of society, losing love is just typical shit that everyone can relate to and understand, so of course it's used as a plot device, and when love is lost, going to find it again isn't because they're entitled or because they "own them", it's just because that's what people do.
I don't understand why she's so adverse to a power imbalance in a relationship; almost all real life relationships have this; how likely is it that two people will have the exact same physical strength, intelligence, social status, level of education, personal wealth and life experience? Portraying fictional relationships as some sort of Utopian picture of total equality is rarely done because it would just ring hollow and seem unreal. I do agree however that too often women are in the weaker position in these fictional relationships and more narratives that buck this trend would be refreshing.
Alright, I watched the whole thing.
It's pretty spot on, actually. [I]Much[/I] better than the previous video, concise and to the point. Not only does it put the current use of the trope on display, but also the growing lack of creativity in the industry. I seriously can't believe how many games have nearly identical ideas behind their plotlines. This why this shit is so bad, not only does it portray women awfully, but also creates artistic stagnation.
I also really liked the way the trope was deconstructed and analysed, allowing us to see all the variations of what is essentially the same thing.
But really, the things that bothers me the most here is the whole "darker and edgier" fad, it's as if the developers, in an effort to make their games seem more "adult" and "mature" add incredibly gruesome shit ad nauseaum to the point of ridiculousness.
It's also great that she explained how these things are mostly done out of misinformation and that developers aren't actively finding ways to put women down, as a lot of people here seem to think.
Overall, great video, I'm looking forward to the next one, especially to see how much the trope has been subverted.
And I feel that the only reason that it's always a male protecting a female is the same reason you almost exclusively play as males in video games...
because most people who play games are male, and that is indeed shifting to be more equal, and I feel like in the future we'll be seeing more games with females as the played-character to accommodate the new demographics.
[QUOTE=Mio Akiyama;40817863]I still don't understand why she feels that the only reason that the male protagonists in video games go after a kidnapped woman was because she was his property or an object. Wouldn't any normal person go after someone if they got kidnapped because they care about them?[/QUOTE]
It's mostly because it breaks the "show, don't tell" rule of writing. You are rarely given a reason to care about those characters other than "she's [U]your[/U] girlfriend/wife/mother/sister/daughter", effectively rendering the character a simple object or goal the (usually male) character has to recover.
[QUOTE=Aidan_088;40817904]I don't understand why she's so adverse to a power imbalance in a relationship; almost all real life relationships have this; how likely is it that two people will have the exact same physical strength, intelligence, social status, level of education, personal wealth and life experience? Portraying fictional relationships as some sort of Utopian picture of total equality is rarely done because it would just ring hollow and seem unreal. I do agree however that too often women are in the weaker position in these fictional relationships and more narratives that buck this trend would be refreshing.[/QUOTE]
It's not that power imbalance is bad [I]per se[/I], it's that media usually reinforces the notion that a power imbalance in relationships is ideal and desirable. Most relationships do, in fact, have some sort of imbalance, but this often the result of said factors at work. And yes, women are usually expected to be the weaker party in the relationship.
The point is, power imbalance is something that couples usually try to fix, as no one wants to be in an inferior position, while the media usually tells us that it's actually a great thing that we should strive for.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
