Transphobia in Portland Woman's Shelter; Complaints that "he wasn't wearing makeup.. Just a man wear
57 replies, posted
[url]http://www.pressherald.com/news/two-women-complain-of-men-at-shelter_2013-07-15.html?pagenum=full[/url]
[quote]PORTLAND - Two women who stay at Florence House, a homeless shelter for women in Portland, have complained that two men who dress as women have also been staying there for the past few months -- using the same common bathrooms, showers and sleeping facilities.
The women say it's unsettling to share a space with people they consider men, although shelter officials say the two people identify as transgender and are therefore allowed to stay.
"I am supposed to be there as a woman with other women," said one of the women, who did not want to be identified for fear of losing her spot at the shelter. She said one of the people in question has stared at her, making her uncomfortable.
The issue of how homeless shelters navigate accommodating their clients' gender identity has surfaced in cases around the country, mainly when the shelters appear to run afoul of their state's or city's human rights ordinances.[/quote]
[quote]
But the women who complained said they believe that in at least one case, it was a ruse. They believe one of the people in question is a man who occasionally dresses as a woman to get into the shelter, perhaps for voyeuristic reasons. That person did not have any feminine mannerisms and often dresses in a T-shirt and jeans, sporting a 5 o'clock shadow of male facial hair, they said.
"If they're really living as a woman, I think they have every right to be there," said one of the women who complained. "But he wasn't wearing makeup or wearing eyeliner or anything. Just a man wearing a skirt. It was just odd."[/quote]
[quote]Officials with the Preble Street nonprofit organization, which owns the Florence House, said transgender people may appear to be male but identify themselves as women when checking in at the shelter. [b]They have rights and are allowed to use the facilities, said Mark Swann, executive director of Preble Street.[/b]
"We don't discriminate against anybody," Swann said. "We accept people at the shelter as they present themselves."[/quote]
According to the article, here's some similar examples in the past:
[quote]• In Washington, D.C., this spring, a transgender woman sued a shelter after she was denied a space based on her gender identity.
• The advocacy group Gay and Lesbian Advocates and Defenders filed a complaint with the Massachusetts Commission Against Discrimination on behalf of a transgender woman who was denied access to the women's dormitory at a Boston shelter, according to the GLAD website.[/quote]
Here's a blog - that originally sourced the article - that has some other information on transphobia in shelters:
[url]http://freethoughtblogs.com/zinniajones/2013/07/if-you-wear-jeans-youre-not-a-woman-transphobia-at-womens-shelters/[/url]
[quote]In a 2011 survey of 6,450 transgender Americans, 22% of trans women reported experiencing domestic violence due to being transgender. 19% of respondents had been homeless at some point in their lives, a number which rose to 48% among those who had suffered domestic violence.
A significant portion of trans women will require the services of shelters at some point in their lives. However, 34% of trans women who had attempted to access shelters were denied entry outright. Of the respondents who did manage to access a shelter, 25% were evicted after it became known that they were trans. 55% were harassed by shelter staff or residents, and 29% of trans women were physically assaulted. 26% were sexually assaulted at shelters. Overall, 47% were treated so poorly that they chose to leave the shelter.
Again, this took place in shelters that are intended to serve as a safe, supportive environment for abused and vulnerable women. Think about what that means: [b]At least one in four trans women in shelters have been physically or sexually assaulted [i]while residing at the shelter.[/i][/b][/quote]
I don't think this shelter in particular is inherently discriminating - the Florence House owners clearly state that they are accepting of transgender individuals. But there's a clear situation where certain employees and cisgender women are clearly denying an a.) safe space, or b.) shelter rights to abused trans* individuals.
I can understand that an abuse victim might be sensitive and upset around a trans* woman in an area where they internally assume that a "woman's shelter" is a "cisgender woman's shelter" and safe place. It's a shame that, as a society, we still uphold transphobic values that assert that a person is the gender of their sex - not the actual gender of their personality.
I wear a kilt and I get sad when people call me "that tall guy in the skirt."
sure it wasn't just a scot?
[QUOTE=Moustacheman;41652315]I wear a kilt and I get sad when people call me "that tall guy in the skirt."[/QUOTE]
As a tall person who doesn't wear a skirt, I empathize with this
Um did you even read what you posted before going on a rant? The woman felt like one of the trans women wasn't actually a trans woman but rather a crossdressing perv because she (or he if she's not actually trans) looked like a dude in a skirt, not even shaving off her beard. Not at all what you're trying to portray here.
[QUOTE=Reimu;41652322]As a tall person who doesn't wear a skirt, I empathize with this[/QUOTE]
"Do you play basketball?"
Literally every time I meet someone new.
[QUOTE=mobrockers;41652354]Um did you even read what you posted before going on a rant? The woman felt like one of the trans women wasn't actually a trans woman but rather a crossdressing perv because she (or he if she's not actually trans) looked like a dude in a skirt, not even shaving off her beard. Not at all what you're trying to portray here.[/QUOTE]
cease and desist, because you have no idea what you're talking about, literally
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Good post, make more." - Starpluck))[/highlight]
[QUOTE]But the women who complained said they believe that in at least one case, it was a ruse. They believe one of the people in question is a man who occasionally dresses as a woman to get into the shelter, perhaps for voyeuristic reasons. That person did not have any feminine mannerisms and often dresses in a T-shirt and jeans, sporting a 5 o'clock shadow of male facial hair[/QUOTE]
Making laws about stuff like this is going to be incredibly difficult.
[QUOTE=mobrockers;41652354]Um did you even read what you posted before going on a rant? The woman felt like one of the trans women wasn't actually a trans woman but rather a crossdressing perv because she (or he if she's not actually trans) looked like a dude in a skirt, not even shaving off her beard. Not at all what you're trying to portray here.[/QUOTE]
What do you mean?
A trans* woman who goes to a woman's shelter is probably not in the right shape to shave their beard or take care of other minor physical gender-related issues.
Plus, the shelter kept both trans* women because they realized that both women legitimately came from abusive relationships and were looking for a safe place to stay.
i'm transphobic
Reshy could probably shed light on what it's like in places like this.
Even if this isn't the best example, the first source clearly states that there's been lawsuits in the past where shelters have discriminated against trans* women.
[QUOTE=Reimu;41652389]What do you mean?
A trans* woman who goes to a woman's shelter is probably not in the right shape to shave their beard or take care of other minor physical gender-related issues.
Plus, the shelter kept both trans* women because they decided that both women legitimately came from abusive relationships and were looking for a safe place to stay.[/QUOTE]
That doesn't invalidate the other woman's fears, and makes me wonder why you created the thread at all. The trans women were treated fairly, after all.
[QUOTE=The_Marine;41652397]i'm transphobic[/QUOTE]
And I'm a xenophobe. Should I be proud too?
[sp]note: I'm not actually I'm just trying to make a point[/sp]
[QUOTE=mobrockers;41652419]That doesn't invalidate the other woman's fears, and makes me wonder why you created the thread at all. The trans women were treated fairly, after all.[/QUOTE]
I clearly said it doesn't.
[quote]I can understand that an abuse victim might be sensitive and upset around a trans* woman in an area where they internally assume that a "woman's shelter" is a "cisgender woman's shelter" and safe place.[/quote]
I never blamed the women specifically for being upset. It's understandable that the women would be afraid.
Instead, I blamed society for creating a situation where, due to our inferences on sex and gender, someone who is non-cisgender is going to upset others.
If you look at the source again, you'll see that this is just one example out of many where shelters actually [i]do[/i] discriminate against trans* individuals. Institutionally, there wasn't any discrimination here. That's not always the case.
[QUOTE=The_Marine;41652397]i'm transphobic[/QUOTE]
I'm a duck
Quack quack
[QUOTE=chimitos;41652367]"Do you play basketball?"
Literally every time I meet someone new.[/QUOTE]
You need my friend's shirt
[IMG]https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/392673_2742823901703_1564284858_n.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Reimu;41652467]
I never blamed the women specifically for being upset. It's understandable that the women would be afraid.
Instead, I blamed society for creating a situation where, due to our inferences on sex and gender, someone who is non-cisgender is going to upset others.[/QUOTE]
Its understandable to believe that people would pretend to be trans to get close to people of the opposite gender.
[QUOTE=The_Marine;41652397]i'm transphobic[/QUOTE]
I like to touch myself when imagining that I am doing very illegal things to you.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;41652567]Its understandable to believe that people would pretend to be trans to get close to people of the opposite gender.[/QUOTE]
If this isn't already a Law and Order: SVU episode, it will be.
[QUOTE=Ownederd;41652373]cease and desist, because you have no idea what you're talking about, literally[/QUOTE]
Good job reading the OP before you post.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;41652567]Its understandable to believe that people would pretend to be trans to get close to people of the opposite gender.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. The shelter would have kicked out the two individuals if there was proof to suggest that they were actually perverts.
If it's true that these transgender individuals have attended the shelter multiple times, then the shelter's employees are probably also familiar with them. And, as the Maine Human Rights Commissioner stated,
[quote]... Preble Street appeared to be following the correct procedures.
"There has to be something more than just a belief that the person isn't being genuine," Sneirson said.[/quote]
Again, it's a complicated issue and you have to take the concerned woman's fears seriously. But there's not necessarily any proof besides, "they don't dress feminine" and claims that one of the individuals might have been staring.
[QUOTE=Reimu;41652467]I clearly said it doesn't.
I never blamed the women specifically for being upset. It's understandable that the women would be afraid.
Instead, I blamed society for creating a situation where, due to our inferences on sex and gender, someone who is non-cisgender is going to upset others.
If you look at the source again, you'll see that this is just one example out of many where shelters actually [i]do[/i] discriminate against trans* individuals. Institutionally, there wasn't any discrimination here. That's not always the case.[/QUOTE]
Your title is quite misleading since the quote is from the case where they weren't discriminating but suspecting that she was just a pervert, which I find to be a pretty unsurprising in a shelter like this where women go to take shelter from men, of course they're going to suspect transgendered women.
[QUOTE=Reimu;41652407]Even if this isn't the best example, the first source clearly states that there's been lawsuits in the past where shelters have discriminated against trans* women.[/QUOTE]
Forgive my somewhat offtopic ignorance, but what's with the asterisks?
[QUOTE=jiggu;41652784]Your title is quite misleading since the quote is from the case where they weren't discriminating but suspecting that she was just a pervert, which I find to be a pretty unsurprising in a shelter like this where women go to take shelter from men, of course they're going to suspect transgendered women.[/QUOTE]
I know. It was an accident because I originally glanced through the article.
I originally meant the title to be "Transphobia in Women's Shelters" because I had other references besides the Portland issues.
I suppose "Peeping Tom or Trans* Woman in Portland Women's Shelter?" would be a better title. My mistake
I know I'm gonna be rated Dumb for this, but there is only one way to get around these problems: If it's they're a woman, they stay. If they're a man, they leave. And I'm talking biologically, none of this "self-identifying" shit. If you have a dick, you're a man. Simple as that.
[QUOTE=The_Marine;41652397]i'm transphobic[/QUOTE]
Uh, thanks for sharing? If you really want to share, post something hateful and get banned please.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;41652804]Forgive my somewhat offtopic ignorance, but what's with the asterisks?[/QUOTE]
IIRC it's a representation that there's a spectrum involved with gender issues. For instance, someone might not be a "trans" individual but they are genderfluid.
Also, in reference to "man*" and "woman*" it means the entire gender spectrum of "man" and "woman" i.e. beyond cisgender men and women. So a transgender woman is included in the notation "woman*," with the asterisk representing that there are gender identities beyond women who are born with the female sex.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;41652567]Its understandable to believe that people would pretend to be trans to get close to people of the opposite gender.[/QUOTE]
For god's sake this happens in every thread. If people are claiming to be trans to be perverts (which is absurdly rare by the way) then [B]kick out the people who are being perverts[/B]. There's no need to blanket all trans people because "people could be perverts!" You have to be a seriously dedicated pervert to crossdress, claim to be trans, claim to be a victim of abuse (to get in a women's shelter) just to get a peep of abused women. And how long can you keep up such a ruse without being found out? This shit is really not an issue.
[QUOTE=slayer64;41652828]I know [B]I'm gonna be rated Dumb for this,[/B] but there is only one way to get around these problems: If it's they're a woman, they stay. If they're a man, they leave. And I'm talking biologically, none of this "self-identifying" shit. If you have a dick, you're a man. Simple as that.[/QUOTE]
Yeah because you totally deserve it.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.