Holland: Refugee spokesman sends letter to mayor "Expect robbery if financial situation doesnt impro - Polidicks

I've posted a few topics on the refugeecenter in Nijmegen already, where I also volunteer. The mood there has been getting more grim the last weeks, where they are also now holding protestmarches through the city of Nijmegen. Today, they sent a letter to the mayor...and I'm absolutely baffled. [quote][b]Refugees send letter of despair to Mayor Bruls[/b] NIJMEGEN - A group of asylumseekers from refugee camp Heumensoord at Nijmegen have written a desperate letter asking for help from the Nijmegen mayor Hubert Bruls. The letter will be presented Monday at 14:30 at the town of Nijmegen. It is a group of dozens of refugees from Heumensoord present, says Mohamed Sameh Okko, inhabitant of Heumensoord and initiator of the letter. [b]4 points[/b] In the letter he appoints four points of concern of the refugees. Firstly, the start of procedures for the asylum application takes too long, the transition to a better housing is too slow, hygiene and health at the location is too low and the financial situation of people starting to get awkward. [b]Diseases [/b] Sameh Okko warns for disease outbreaks by poor hygiene and robberies by lack of money. He also asked Bruls to commit themselves to a quick start of the asylum procedures because people become frustrated and depressed by the increasingly desperate situation. [/quote] [url=http://www.gelderlander.nl/regio/nijmegen-e-o/nijmegen/wanhoopsbrief-vluchtelingen-aan-burgemeester-bruls-1.5541195]Source for newsreport above[/url] [b]Full translation of letter sent by the refugees[/b] [quote]Dear mister Bruls, On behalf of the people staying in camp Heumensoord in your municipality, I want to ask you for your involvement in a few topics that, in my vision, are fueling the frustration. 1. Starting procedures of asylum Most people in Heumensoord are now 3 months in the Netherlands, and have been housed in several crisislocations. Apart from the registration at the IND there has been no moment in het asylumprocedure and the way it looks now is that this will not change in the coming 4,5 or 6 months. I can't tell you how much stress this causes amongst the refugees. In part because they still have family that is in danger in the homeland. (Rumbler note: They want to complete the full asylumprocedure, since at the end of the the Dutch government will pay for the familymembers to be flown in, paid for with taxmoney) [b]This uncertainty and inclarity leads to frustration, agitation and unsatisfiedness towards the COA and her employees, but also to feelings of depression and hopelessness.[/b] (Rumbler note: I can absolutely attest to this. Although I am not formally a COA employee, since I'm a volunteer, I can feel how people are starting to see us more and more as enemies instead of helpers) 2. Flow-through Camp Heumensoord is a crisislocation. Housing in this location should only be in case of emergency for a period [b]as short as possible and definitely not longer than 3 or 4 weeks. After that we should flow-through and move along in the system. Kamp Heumensoord isn't adequate for housing during several months of people in such a vulnerable position.[/b] At the moment there is no movement at all, and the way it looks now we will have to spend winter here. We need your help to start the flow-through process. 3. Healthcare in the camp De hygene in the camp is very poor, and this results in poor personal hygene. The large amount of people here make it hard to control the diseases even more. [b]There are more and more unpleasant diseases like mange, impegito, and lice.[/b] Apart from that there is only one doctor available for each 'village' for only 3 hours a day (Rumbler note: the camp houses 3000 people and the we have 1 doctor available for 3 hours per day to serve 200 refugees per doctor. This is adequate, since most people are healthy, and do not require attention. The refugees seem to think differently on this matter though) On a group of hundreds of people this is simply too few. The same problem exists with psychiatric help. Medical care should be provided and be available 24/7. A group of 3.000 people with custom health-care is almost impossible with the limited resources and manpower of the GCA and Redcross. This results in bad individual cases since adequate help is too late. Second-line help is even delayed to after when we have complete the asylumprocedure. I could give you many examples, but I'll leave them out of this letter. I will gladly tell you to them in a personal conversation. 4. Financial situation People are burning through their financial reserves, but will only get the 'government allowance' until after completing the procedure. [b]This means that the longer people stay here, the more the current criminality will stay and increase. Criminality like 'theft under threat'[/b] (Rumbler note: Robbery in English judicial jargon). I hope I have given you an accurate image of the situation in camp Nijmegen and ask you for your help to reach a solution for the above problems. With kind regards, Mohamed Sameh Okko[/quote] Pictures and video inside the camp. It's not half as bad as they're making it out to be.... [img]http://www.gelderlander.nl/polopoly_fs/1.5297651.1443791604!/image/image.JPG_gen/derivatives/landscape_800_600/image-5297651.JPG[/img] [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhW8bM3KJgg[/media] I'm absolutely losing the will and drive to staying a volunteer there for much longer honestly. The tensions are increasing by the day.

Just as Merkel and Sweden back track on refugee intake. The people of Europe will pay a heavy toll for this level of incompetence.

Such a loaded post.

Rumbler, could you post proof that you actually volunteer in that camp?

Rumbler, does Heumensoord allow foreign volunteers? I could stay with family in Nijmegen for a week and help out [editline]14th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Svinnik;49314917]Rumbler, could you post proof that you actually volunteer in that camp?[/QUOTE] This too

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;49315025]If asylum procedures take more than 3 months and they're basically locked up in there, I'd complain too. It seems like a prison from my point of view. Still ought to have predicted that not all of refugees would be perfect human beings. Are thiefs getting caught? I guess the cram up status of the camps would make it harder for law enforcement.[/QUOTE] They shouldn't complain when it was their own choice to come here. Gee, who would have known that the most densely packed country in Europa has issues getting stuff done. We simply don't have as much space to spare like Sweden and Germany. Our housing plans have about a 12-year waiting list. Our elderly homes are criminally understaffed too, we struggle to get qualified 24/7 aid for our elderly. And we are ,in a lesser extent, understaffed for doctors in general. It's a good thing that those well-qualified asylum seekers are going to be our next doctor- oh wait, they cannot even take care of their personal hygiene, guess we can forget about that now. Also, what kind of fucking coward leaves their family in a dangerous country while they just happily straddle their way across Europa to a safe country?

wow the nerve they have to complain. Jesus, who's side are they on?

[QUOTE=Cypher_09;49314992]Rumbler, does Heumensoord allow foreign volunteers? I could stay with family in Nijmegen for a week and help out [/QUOTE] Hello Cypher, I'll gladly point you to the form that I used to enter into volunteerwork: [url]http://noodopvang.stipnijmegen.nl/contact/[/url] Fill out this form (which I used too), leave an emailadress and a phonenumber and you will be called and/or emailed. Please give a clear timeperiod in which you'd be available, and specify with which work you are comfortable but please take into account it might take some time before they respond. We have many volunteers at the moment, and a lot of people are writing in that they want to organize events to help pass the time. You are very welcome to come help the refugees, and at the same time verify that what I'm saying is true. Please post in this topic if you've had a message back. I'm very curious to see if you're actually going to do this, or if you're bluffing. We might even be able to meet up there if it's either a Saturday or a Sunday in the coming two weeks. Will gladly hear from you regarding this.

That looks very comfortable to me as far as semi-permanent housing is concerned. You've got heat, shelter, food and clothing for free, as well as safety. Looks no different than any number of military bases.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49314917]Rumbler, could you post proof that you actually volunteer in that camp?[/QUOTE] Please see these posts I made recently: [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1497132&p=49295307&viewfull=1#post49295307]Why I will not identify myself personally[/url] [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1497132&p=49295366&viewfull=1#post49295366]Why I volunteered[/url] However, apart from all that... How about you guys respond to the news-message itself, instead of trying to attack the messenger and ignore the news completely. I know you're all hoping to found out I'm secretly Hitler2, so you can stop even paying attention to what I'm saying. Seems like the normal tactic to counter multi-cultural/immigrational-criticism for you normally is to just call a person a racist and a xenophobe, this volunteer-thing must very inconvenient for you guys since it actually forces you to get into the meat of the discussion where you have to think about things you might not / don't want to hear. Must be why you guys are focussing on it so much. I do volunteer, I want the best for everyone, yet I'm still very critical of how the situation is currently being 'dealt with'.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;49315025]If asylum procedures take more than 3 months and they're basically locked up in there, I'd complain too. It seems like a prison from my point of view. Still ought to have predicted that not all of refugees would be perfect human beings. Are thiefs getting caught? I guess the cram up status of the camps would make it harder for law enforcement.[/QUOTE] Well what should they have expected a 4 star hotel without making any reservations? The least they could have done is provided us with a heads up that they were gonna need a 4 star hotel room instead of just showing up. On a more serious note it is a sort of prison because we don't know if we can trust them yet. Their backgrounds need to be researched so that we know they are who they say they are. This needs to be done thoroughly and not put on a fast track. Honestly if some idiot decides that wanting an extra loaf of bread is worth robbing someone and risk having them sent back to a warzone let him do it so we have an excuse to kick him out of the country. It's better to risk a few extra robberies which only do a relatively small amount of short term damage then risk long term damage in the form of welfare mooching/possible terrorists passing through the system.

Economic luxury immigrants, not war refugees... As said before, people fleeing for their lives from a horrific war DO NOT act like this.

Next twenty years are going to be a whole lot of fun for Europe, good luck!

[QUOTE=Rumbler;49315163]Please see these posts I made recently: [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1497132&p=49295307&viewfull=1#post49295307]Why I will not identify myself personally[/url] [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1497132&p=49295366&viewfull=1#post49295366]Why I volunteered[/url] However, apart from all that... How about you guys respond to the news-message itself, instead of trying to attack the messenger and ignore the news completely. I know you're all hoping to found out I'm secretly Hitler2, so you can stop even paying attention to what I'm saying. Seems like the normal tactic to counter multi-cultural/immigrational-criticism for you normally is to just call a person a racist and a xenophobe, this volunteer-thing must very inconvenient for you guys since it actually forces you to get into the meat of the discussion where you have to think about things you might not / don't want to hear. Must be why you guys are focussing on it so much. I do volunteer, I want the best for everyone, yet I'm still very critical of how the situation is currently being 'dealt with'.[/QUOTE] You don't need to say my name is XYZ but post an ID with your details blocked out? I don't like the current immigration problems either but I'm not the one saying that I directly work with them

Yet another scare mongering thread by Rumbler. I am not surprised. If we look at the letter's four points, all it actually says is: [quote]1. Starting procedures of asylum Most people in Heumensoord are now 3 months in the Netherlands, and have been housed in several crisislocations. Apart from the registration at the IND there has been no moment in het asylumprocedure and the way it looks now is that this will not change in the coming 4,5 or 6 months. I can't tell you how much stress this causes amongst the refugees. In part because they still have family that is in danger in the homeland. ([B]Rumbler note: They want to complete the full asylumprocedure, since at the end of the the Dutch government will pay for the familymembers to be flown in, paid for with taxmoney[/B]) This uncertainty and inclarity leads to frustration, agitation and unsatisfiedness towards the COA and her employees, but also to feelings of depression and hopelessness. (Rumbler note: I can absolutely attest to this. Although I am not formally a COA employee, since I'm a volunteer, I can feel how people are starting to see us more and more as enemies instead of helpers)[/quote] Asylum seekers are worried for their families and the bureaucracy of the process causes stress. Apparently Rumbler is upset that this costs tax money. [quote]2. Flow-through Camp Heumensoord is a crisislocation. Housing in this location should only be in case of emergency for a period as short as possible and definitely not longer than 3 or 4 weeks. After that we should flow-through and move along in the system. Kamp Heumensoord isn't adequate for housing during several months of people in such a vulnerable position. At the moment there is no movement at all, and the way it looks now we will have to spend winter here. We need your help to start the flow-through process.[/quote] Asylum seekers feel imprisoned by retention in military-style shelters for periods over a month. They fear being forgotten and want to address the government with this concern. [quote]3. Healthcare in the camp De hygene in the camp is very poor, and this results in poor personal hygene. The large amount of people here make it hard to control the diseases even more. There are more and more unpleasant diseases like mange, impegito, and lice. Apart from that there is only one doctor available for each 'village' for only 3 hours a day (Rumbler note: the camp houses 3000 people and the we have 1 doctor available for 3 hours per day to serve 200 refugees per doctor. This is adequate, since most people are healthy, and do not require attention. The refugees seem to think differently on this matter though) On a group of hundreds of people this is simply too few. The same problem exists with psychiatric help. Medical care should be provided and be available 24/7. A group of 3.000 people with custom health-care is almost impossible with the limited resources and manpower of the GCA and Redcross. This results in bad individual cases since adequate help is too late. Second-line help is even delayed to after when we have complete the asylumprocedure. I could give you many examples, but I'll leave them out of this letter. I will gladly tell you to them in a personal conversation.[/quote] Asylum seekers are under the impression that hygiene is lacking in the camps, and reference the existing spread of parasites and other illness. They claim that medical supplies are not being administered to combat the issue effectively. Apparently Rumbler thinks this isn't the case. I'm sure he would know what their lives are like in the spare time he volunteers. If he volunteers at all, and isn't just a political propaganda shitposter who should've already been permabanned. I bet the refugees are totally making it all up! Yeah, they totally have reason to make up complaints about disease! [quote]4. Financial situation People are burning through their financial reserves, but will only get the 'government allowance' until after completing the procedure. This means that the longer people stay here, the more the current criminality will stay and increase. Criminality like 'theft under threat' (Rumbler note: Robbery in English judicial jargon).[/quote] The refugees are worried that they will run out of money; not [I]everything[/I] is provided to them, and they will lack the supplies they need. Perhaps the medical ones, since they seem to be lacking. I don't know, but the point is that they're worried that their neighbours will become increasingly unruly as financial strain grows. According to Rumbler that means a sensationalist thread title meant to portray the refugees as threatening the government/populace. seriously you do nothing but purposefully misconstrue, and in several caught events, lie

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49315236]You don't need to say my name is XYZ but post an ID with your details blocked out? I don't like the current immigration problems either but I'm not the one saying that I directly work with them[/QUOTE] The point is that even if I did that, it wouldn't be proof still. [b]There are two options:[/b] 1. I am lieing. I'm not going to stop lieing just because you want to see a badge with blacked-out information. I could obtain that quite easily, even if I were lieing. Showing you one, isn't proof. Nothing changes about the news I posted, which you've completely ignored anyways since you don't WANT to see it. 2. I am truthful. Your little ad-hominem tactic backfired, didn't have any effect on real world problems and you've spent your time harassing a guy who HAS, unlike you, been actively investing his free-time and money into making a difference whilst being showered in racism-accusations by you, a guy who's sitting at home doing nothing. I emplore you again, stop trying to shoot down the messenger because the news will not change even if you would be succesful in doing so. I am not giving up my personal identity just to please some guy over in America. If this remains your desperate attempt at a discussional-tactic then I am no longer interested in responding to you.

[QUOTE=bitches;49315270] seriously you do nothing but purposefully misconstrue, and in several caught events, lie[/QUOTE] Right? Literally ALL of his posts are immigration related! I can't seriously be the only noticing this. Within the past 3 weeks hes posted NINETEEN THREADS about it, with 95% percent of his posts being on his own threads. Like god damn, these threads are just annoying at this point. And don't ask him for proof that he actually works in a refugee camp, he literally says "he will be hunted by SJW's to get him fired." It doesn't help he deflects literally every argument with "I work in a refugee camp so I can say [I]x[/I]." Where you signed up is not valid proof that you actually did! [editline]wtf is this shit[/editline] [quote]1. I am lieing. I'm not going to stop lieing just because you want to see a badge with blacked-out information. I could obtain that quite easily, even if I were lieing. Showing you one, isn't proof.[/quote] Like wtf is this shit. Give us proof. It takes two goddamn seconds.

[QUOTE=Rumbler;49315279] [b]There are two options:[/b] ...[/QUOTE] If that's the possible cases, why even mention you volunteer? It changes nothing after all. Seems stupid.

As nice as the temporary housing looks, it's still temporary housing. I would be frustrated living there for months as well. But it sounds like the Netherlands is just getting swamped and needs more manpower. [QUOTE=Jordax;49315088] Also, what kind of fucking coward leaves their family in a dangerous country while they just happily straddle their way across Europa to a safe country?[/QUOTE] It's cheaper and easier to move one person who is capable of working and sending back money in Europe back home. This has been the way of refugees and immigrants since forever. If your family isn't in immediate danger and you don't have the funds or contacts to get everyone out, you get your strongest person out to help the others sometime later. That seems to be the case here as well.

Hey, Rumbler, remember when you said this to me 20 hours ago? [QUOTE=elixwhitetail;49310190]Says the guy who only posts things with dedicated anti-Muslim/anti-refugee slants and has taken to posting in Videos instead of SH because there's no rule against bad sources in the Videos section. :v:[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Rumbler;49310269]Please go through my latest 10 posts if you want to see how wrong you are. You're completely on the wrong track with me as a person, or the topics that I post about.. Kinda sad this really... Here; I'll even [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1497132&p=49300783#post49300783]point a post out to you, for your convenience.[/url] Edit:// And I've posted 19 topics, of which 13 in SH. How exactly are you justified in your claims that I'm somehow ... never mind seriously. I don't get the feeling you're open to a rational discussion, because you've already made up your mind about me.[/QUOTE] Here you are doing it again. I WIN.

Man, all this stuff about refugees really makes me not want to return to Holland, especially since I'll probably be teaching in Nijmegen. I just hope this whole ordeal is fixed, before I have to start to pretend I'm politically correct.

Who the hell cares if Rumbler works at a refugee camp or not? Are you all still expecting these news to be complete bogus made up for scaremongering? Jesus fuck, talk about denial...

[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;49315298]Right? Literally ALL of his posts are immigration related! I can't seriously be the only noticing this. Within the past 3 weeks hes posted NINETEEN THREADS about it, with 95% percent of his posts being on his own threads. And don't ask him for proof that he actually works in a refugee camp, he literally says "he will be hunted by SJW's to get him fired." Hes nuts.[/QUOTE] Come on, when the newspapers in the next country over, Germany, was openly trying to paint whoever said anything negative about the mass immigration policy a few months ago as utter Nazis, I would kinda get why he doesn't want to show his ID Card. [QUOTE=Raidyr;49315332]As nice as the temporary housing looks, it's still temporary housing. I would be frustrated living there for months as well. But it sounds like the Netherlands is just getting swamped and needs more manpower. It's cheaper and easier to move one person who is capable of working and sending back money in Europe back home. This has been the way of refugees and immigrants since forever. If your family isn't in immediate danger and you don't have the funds or contacts to get everyone out, you get your strongest person out to help the others sometime later. That seems to be the case here as well.[/QUOTE] We are assuming that we took in war refugees and not economical immigrants. If they wanted to get classified as economical immigrants, they should have taken the legal route to get work here. And yep, you kinda said it already, I seriously doubt that the families of those refugees/immigrants are in any real danger seeing as they left them behind mostly for monetary reasons. If they were in any sort of real danger, they would obliviously have taken them with them, or they are the biggest cowards on the planet. Which wouldn't surprise me either.

Every thread I see now people are asking rumbler for proof of his identity instead of talking about the thread context. Seriously guys, it doesn't fucking matter if he works there or not. You're completely ignoring the actual news with a reliable posted source. Like, what the fuck does it matter? badgering somebody for their ID should be a bannable offense. Nobody is trying to push an agenda on facepunch.

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;49315350]I WIN.[/QUOTE] oh wow you never cease to amaze me SH [editline]14th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Jordax;49315367]And yep, you kinda said it already, I seriously doubt that the families of those refugees/immigrants are in any real danger seeing as they left them behind mostly for monetary reasons. If they were in any sort of real danger, they would obliviously have taken them with them, or they are the biggest cowards on the planet. Which wouldn't surprise me either.[/QUOTE] Like I've said before, Merkel and everyone else fucked everyone over. Not just the nationals of each country receiving refugees, no no... The refugees aswell. Hyped it up all to be "the next Land of Oportunity", saying that we'd take care of them for sure, everyone got excited and hoped on the bandwagon, and now, everyone is paying the price.

[QUOTE=DiBBs27;49315371]Nobody is trying to push an agenda on facepunch.[/QUOTE] You mean Lamar never posts threads that show Israel in a bad light in its interactions with Palestine? Yeah, I'm definitely imaginging that happening for years. No, nobody ever tries to push an agenda in SH, guys, don't bother looking into any ulterior motives when an old account awakens after years of inactivity and begins posting a lot, the great majority of it slanted and misleading shit about Muslim refugees. It's all in your head. Wake up, politics is a dirty game.

[QUOTE=DiBBs27;49315371]Every thread I see now people are asking rumbler for proof of his identity instead of talking about the thread context. Seriously guys, it doesn't fucking matter if he works there or not. You're completely ignoring the actual news with a reliable posted source. Like, what the fuck does it matter? badgering somebody for their ID should be a bannable offense. Nobody is trying to push an agenda on facepunch.[/QUOTE] An agenda is still an agenda whether or not it is correct. If the entirety of someone's posts is to convince a crowd of a particular view, that someone is pushing an agenda. They're only asking for ID because he's trying to pass off his "volunteer work" as PROOF of claims. Asking for ID doesn't just literally ask for verification and identity, but also implicitly points at how anecdotal evidence is worthless. I'd rather Sensationalist Headlines either be renamed Propaganda Outlet, or ban political threads altogether at this rate.

[QUOTE=DiBBs27;49315371]Every thread I see now people are asking rumbler for proof of his identity instead of talking about the thread context. Seriously guys, it doesn't fucking matter if he works there or not. You're completely ignoring the actual news with a reliable posted source. Like, what the fuck does it matter? badgering somebody for their ID should be a bannable offense. Nobody is trying to push an agenda on facepunch.[/QUOTE] Well that last part is up for debate. And how long before people are just shipped back? As harsh and.. I suppose "Texan" as that sounds, if you're just going to be a cunt because you didn't get set up in a fucking 5 star Sandals resort when you're trying to escape from a warzone, then maybe you should go back to the hell you're supposedly trying to flee. Beggars can't be choosers.

[QUOTE=ZakkShock;49315412]Well that last part is up for debate. And how long before people are just shipped back? As harsh and.. I suppose "Texan" as that sounds, if you're just going to be a cunt because you didn't get set up in a fucking 5 star Sandals resort when you're trying to escape from a warzone, then maybe you should go back to the hell you're supposedly trying to flee. Beggars can't be choosers.[/QUOTE] You'll find that those "disagreeing" with you completely agree with what you just said. The problem is that unruly and entitled minorities get cast by the news (and people like Rumbler) as the majority. That, or everything said gets taken monstrously out of context, like with this thread's title.

[QUOTE=bitches;49315270] Asylum seekers are worried for their families and the bureaucracy of the process causes stress. Apparently Rumbler is upset that this costs tax money.[/QUOTE] Yes I am upset this costs taxmoney, when at the same time the austerity-measures haven't been cancelled yet, and the government has announced [b]further increases in taxation[/b]. Meanwhile, my elderly grandmother who has worked her entire life and has paid taxes her entire life has to rely on my mom for her welfare because that was deemed to expensive. Meanwhile there are also Dutch cities with a 12-21yr waitinglist for social-housing. So yes I am angry we are spending taxmoney on flying in EVEN MORE people who will be totally dependant on taxmoney, thus worsening the problem. [QUOTE=bitches;49315270] Asylum seekers feel imprisoned by retention in military-style shelters for periods over a month. They fear being forgotten and want to address the government with this concern.[/QUOTE] Military-style shelter. That's hilarious. Well I certainly know that you aren't the one volunteering your time in one of those centers. Watch this video. I know you're pretty much skimming past the content of the OP if it has my name next to it. But how about actually watching this for once. I'll give you a screencap of the video even. This is one of two main entrancehalls where they are provided TV's, comfortable sofa's and chargingpoints for their cellphones. [img]https://www.anony.ws/i/2015/12/14/screencap-Copy.jpg[/img] [QUOTE=bitches;49315270] Asylum seekers are under the impression that hygiene is lacking in the camps, and reference the existing spread of parasites and other illness. They claim that medical supplies are not being administered to combat the issue effectively. Apparently Rumbler thinks this isn't the case. I'm sure he would know what their lives are like in the spare time he volunteers. If he volunteers at all, and isn't just a political propaganda shitposter who should've already been permabanned.[/QUOTE] Again, love how you're again focussing on my volunteerwork but I'll tell you what I experience personally. I've also posted this is another thread but whatever. The refugees are complaining hygiene is lacking, absolutely true. However this is caused by the fact that the refugees themselves make a mess which they refuse to clear up themselves. Nobody cleans streaks out of toilets, and people are even unwilling to pick up dirty toiletpaper that they somehow managed to deposited next-to, instead of INSIDE, the toiletbowl. With 3000 people in the camp, if only 10% would act like this. There'd be 300 people making a huge mess, before the other 2.700 were able to even use the facilities. Now lets shift to reality, and I'll freely admit that this is a number that I'm guessing, but 50% would be much more closer to people not cleaning up after themselves. This means that in between cleaningperiods (PROVIDED BY VOLUNTEERS) twice a day, around 700 people use the facilities that are, from the looks of it, actively trying to make a mess. I have said many times, also to my volunteer-leader, "Why do we not put up a cleaningroster" where the refugees themselves are responsible for cleaning the facilities. They complain about how volunteers do a poor job, they complain about how much free time they have. How about we tell them they themselves are now responsible for cleaning, in a rotated roster. I was met by absolute shock. How dared I suggest such a thing.... [QUOTE=bitches;49315270] I bet the refugees are totally making it all up! Yeah, they totally have reason to make up complaints about disease![/QUOTE] Who's saying that? Not me. Again you're putting words in my mouth. The diseases are real, but they are caused by the very poor hygiëne-mentality that a lot of the refugees have. But but but, should disease then go untreated mr Adolf Rumbler? Nope! We are treating them, but we aren't catering to their every wish. Angry fathers and mothers will regularly show up to the medicalpoint to ask the doctor to give their child antibiotics because their child has had a cough for three days. In Syria it's apparently quite normal to take antibiotics preventively, but here in the Netherlands we don't, because overusage stimulates resistant bacteria. It's not because we don't want to provide healthservice. It's just because it's different. Just because they're not satisfied, because they're not served on every request doesn't mean their complaints are ALWAYS valid. Ofcourse they are still valid complaints. The amount of peopl there makes it all a very complex operation, so mistakes are bound to be made. [b]Also, native Dutchmen have 1 doctor available per 2.500 people. The refugees have 1 doctor available per 250 - 300 people. If they think they have anything to complain about, then the natives should be complaining even more.[/b] [QUOTE=bitches;49315270] The refugees are worried that they will run out of money; not [I]everything[/I] is provided to them, and they will lack the supplies they need. Perhaps the medical ones, since they seem to be lacking. I don't know, but the point is that they're worried that their neighbours will become increasingly unruly as financial strain grows. According to Rumbler that means a sensationalist thread title meant to portray the refugees as threatening the government/populace.[/QUOTE] [b]Please name me a few things that isn't provided for them, instead of just yelling out something.[/b] They are provided with housing, childrens-treats, tri-daily meals, snacks, drinks, television, organized entertainment (football-matches mostly but still) all free of charge. The complaints for money that I usually come across are from smokers, who come from Syria where cigarettes are dirtcheap and now suddenly have to pay €6.50 or $7.50 a pack. Another need for money is usually because they want to go shopping for groceries or snacks themselves, or to pay for prepaid phones. Not exactly things you NEED. Everything they need to stay safe and alive is provided to them free of charge. So threatening to then say "The existing criminality will stay, or will increase" is nothing but a display of ungratefulness. [QUOTE=bitches;49315270] seriously you do nothing but purposefully misconstrue, and in several caught events, lie[/QUOTE] Citation please. If you don't respond, at least you'll have admitted you know you're full of excrement.