• Helicopter lost in Bin Laden raid was a secret stealth model
    214 replies, posted
[URL]http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/aviation-geeks-scramble-to-i-d-osama-raids-mystery-copter/[/URL] [quote] The May 2 raid on Osama bin Laden’s luxury compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, had it all: painstaking [URL="http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/surveillance-not-waterboarding-led-to-bin-laden/"]intelligence-gathering[/URL], a heroic Navy SEAL assault team, [URL="http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/with-drones-and-satellites-u-s-zeroed-in-on-bin-laden/"]satellite and drone surveillance[/URL], and [URL="http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/csi-bin-laden-commandos-use-thumb-eye-scans-to-track-terrorists/"]biometric forensics[/URL]. And now this: a possible super-secret, stealthy helicopter, unknown to the wider world before one [URL="http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/05/new-satellite-images-show-downed-helo-at-osama-hideout/"]crashed during the assault[/URL]. Aviation specialists are picking apart pixel-by-pixel the dozen-or-so photos of the copter that have appeared online. They’re assembling [URL="http://defensetech.org/2011/05/04/what-the-secret-bin-laden-raid-helo-might-look-like/"]digital mock-ups[/URL] of the aircraft and comparing them to lost stealth designs of the 1980s and ’90s. Speculation abounds, and so far no one from the government is commenting. But depending on what the copter turns out to be, it could shed new light on everything from the abilities of U.S. commandos to the relationship between the United States and Pakistan. Opinions about the copter seem to fall into three basic camps. The most-cautious observers believe the wreckage is from a conventional chopper that got so badly mangled during the crash that it became unrecognizable. In the center, there are those who think the helicopter is an Army MH-60 Blackhawk tweaked to make it quieter and more stealthy. On the fringes, the true believers are talking about a brand-new, radar-evading helicopter design. Considering the [URL="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2011/may/04/osama-bin-laden-compound#/?picture=374256192&index=4"]proliferation[/URL] of [URL="http://sitelife.aviationweek.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/0/14/8065b635-752f-4a63-ae97-84beaff28a19.Full.jpg"]bewildering photos[/URL] from the crash site, the conservative viewpoint seems unlikely. Equally, the notion of a brand-new “black” helicopter seems far-fetched, especially considering the Army’s long history of [URL="http://www.airspacemag.com/military-aviation/the_quiet_one.html"]heavily modifying existing rotorcraft[/URL] for secret missions. That leaves an upgraded, stealth-optimized MH-60 as the most likely candidate — a conclusion that jibes with CIA director [URL="http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/terrorism/jan-june11/panetta_05-03.html"]Leon Panetta’s assertion[/URL] Tuesday that the 25-man strike team was “carried in two Blackhawk helicopters that went in.” A story by ace reporter Sean Naylor in [I]Army Times[/I], published just minutes after the initial version of this post, [URL="http://www.armytimes.com/news/2011/05/army-mission-helocopter-was-secret-stealth-black-hawk-050411/"]supports this conclusion[/URL]. Naylor quotes a retired Special Forces aviator saying the special Blackhawk, modified by Lockheed Martin, has “hard edges, sort of like an … F-117″ stealth fighter from the same company.[/quote] [IMG]http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/dangerroom/2011/05/RTR2LZQ11-660x451.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/dangerroom/2011/05/AP110502027904.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/dangerroom/2011/05/mh-x3-660x410.jpg[/IMG] More info in the full article. Evidence is pretty limited, but any idiot can see unusually smooth paint and body lines that are the clear trademarks of stealth aircraft. Looks like the special forces may have access to a handful of heavily modified Blackhawks designed to avoid radar and infrared detection. It also means that the Pakistanis had absolutely no clue the SEALs were coming, and we thought the threat of being shot down by their air defenses justified the use of aircraft that were, up to now, completely secret.
Fucking awesome!
Black Helicopters. [img]http://media.strategywiki.org/images/thumb/6/68/Deus_Ex_Jock.jpg/150px-Deus_Ex_Jock.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Blanketspace;29625384]Black Helicopters. [img_thumb]http://media.strategywiki.org/images/thumb/6/68/Deus_Ex_Jock.jpg/150px-Deus_Ex_Jock.jpg[/img_thumb][/QUOTE] who's that?
Looks expensive
Well they obviously weren't too stealthy, that guy was able to hear them and tweeted it to the world.
I think if they were that important the US would have got the wreckage out fast.
[QUOTE=ultra_bright;29625442]who's that?[/QUOTE] a bomb
[QUOTE=mastermaul;29625502]I think if they were that important the US would have got the wreckage out fast.[/QUOTE] With what, another stealth helicopter?
[QUOTE=Cajun;29625521]a bomb[/QUOTE] What a shame.
[QUOTE=mastermaul;29625502]I think if they were that important the US would have got the wreckage out fast.[/QUOTE] They blew it up after it crashed. (they do this with any equipment that they can't recover, to prevent it from being captured or reverse-engineered)
A stealth Blackhawk? I..I don't even know what to say. That is fucking awesome.
[QUOTE=Forumaster;29625472]Well they obviously weren't too stealthy, that guy was able to hear them and tweeted it to the world.[/QUOTE] Stealthy in relation to radar, not hearing.
[QUOTE=ultra_bright;29625442]who's that?[/QUOTE] Jock, the black helicopter pilot from Deus Ex, of course. You might not have seen him if you didn't thoroughly investigate the bar in Hell's Kitchen on your second visit there.
well it crashed so it can't be that great
[QUOTE=ridinmybike;29625589]well it crashed so it can't be that great[/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure anything that gets shot enough is going to crash...
[QUOTE=Sottalytober;29625616]I'm pretty sure anything that gets shot enough is going to crash...[/QUOTE] I thought it was a mechanical failure?
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;29625640]I thought it was a mechanical failure?[/QUOTE] Mechanical failure is a pretty broad term in my opinion. Could be anything from the engine sputtered out, to an RPG hitting the back end.
Wow, that's awesome. :v:
nevermind
Heard it on the news earlier, they say that the disk in the middle of blades make it quieter or make it so when the helicopter is near you it sounds far away.
fucking cool
Possibly the reason why Pakistan didn't spot it at first was because of that.
[QUOTE=Forumaster;29625472]Well they obviously weren't too stealthy, that guy was able to hear them and tweeted it to the world.[/QUOTE] Helicopter sound mechanics work oddly. For the most part, with helicopters, the goal is to make it difficult to determine the direction the helicopter is coming from and to maintain a low altitude in order to ensure that the sound isn't heard until the helicopter is almost right on top of you. Directionally speaking, if a helicopter has more than 5 blades on the main rotor, it does something odd to the acoustics and makes it extremely difficult to determine the direction the sound is coming from. Judging by the large number of blades on the tail rotor here, it can be assumed that the main has at least five, if not six, blades. Ideally though, a ducted tail fan would be used in place of the standard tail rotor design. The sound a helicopter makes comes from the rotor wash of the main rotor colliding with that of the tail rotor. It literally chops the wash of the tail in two producing the oddly accurate nickname of "chopper". Old models of UH-1 Iroquois (AKA Hueys) used two blades on the main rotor and produced a really distinct thump thump thump sound as a result. This is where the nickname likely originated. Having a ducted fan mitigates this problem by projecting the tail rotor wash away from the wash of the main rotor. The RAH-66 was intended to be borderline stealth and used the tail fan to great effect: [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0R1ISQAmqk[/url] If you can ignore the cheesy voiceover, the sound of the helicopter is very different from your normal helicopter. Another way to achieve this is to use a coaxial rotor system that we see on Russian gunships. Instead of a tail rotor providing counter torque to the main, you have a second rotor placed above the main rotor that spins in the opposite direction. Mechanically speaking the system is more complicated, but you make significant performance gains. The Ka-50 Black shark is virtually unbeatable in agility and can carry significantly more payload than a helicopter its size otherwise would be able to due to all engine power being used for lift AND counter torque instead of a portion only being used for counter torque. The helicopter rotates so fast that the cannon isn't placed on a swivel mount like on other Gunships, because the helicopter would out-rotate most swivel mounts anyways. An interesting side note is that Metal Gear solid 4 actually did exactly that. It made stealth blackhawks with coaxial-rotors. From a science fiction standpoint, they did an outstanding job with the helicopter design. [url]http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/3440/830pxushelicopter.png[/url]
They both look photoshopped from hell just to be honest.
I bet some people are going to get fired because it crashed. Seriously god knows how much money lost and the helicopter revealed, wouldn't want to be responsible for that mess.
[QUOTE=flyschy;29625790]I bet some people are going to get fired because it crashed. Seriously god knows how much money lost and the helicopter revealed, wouldn't want to be responsible for that mess.[/QUOTE] As the Military and Government will put it What secret stealth helicopter I didnt see any? [img]http://www.pattiwood.net/images/williams3.jpg[/img]
Looks like it's from the future.
I sure hope JC wasn't in that chopper.
[QUOTE=Turkey72;29625868]I sure hope JC wasn't in that chopper.[/QUOTE] He would have just activated speed enhancement and jumped out.
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