David Cameron refuses Jamaican calls for Slave Reparations during visit. - Polidicks

Source 1:[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34401412[/url] Source 2: [url]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/30/jamaica-should-move-on-from-painful-legacy-of-slavery-says-cameron[/url] Source 3: [url]http://time.com/4057001/david-cameron-jamaica-reparations/[/url] [QUOTE]David Cameron has ruled out making reparations for Britain's role in the historic slave trade and urged Caribbean countries to "move on". The prime minister acknowledged that "these wounds run very deep" during his visit to Jamaica, where he faced calls to apologise from campaigners. He said Britain's role in wiping slavery "off the face of our planet" should be remembered. ...Mrs Simpson Miller said while she was "aware of the obvious sensitivities", Jamaica was "involved in a process under the auspices of the Caribbean Community [Caricom] to engage the UK on the matter". During Mr Cameron's speech, a small group of protesters with placards that read "reparations now" gathered outside parliament.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]In 1833, Britain emancipated its enslaved people and raised the equivalent of £17bn in compensation money to be paid to 46,000 of Britain's slave-owners for "loss of human property". University College London has compiled a database of those compensated. Among those listed is General Sir James Duff, who it is claimed is a first cousin six times removed of David Cameron. He was awarded compensation worth about £3m in today's terms.[/QUOTE] Not a fan of the British Conservatives but this is a bit silly...

I personally don't see any point in making people who were born over a hundred years after an event apologise for actions they had no part in.

It's good to apologize on behalf of your country, but paying money or taking blame for your ancestor's actions is stupid. Not my fault my great-great-great-great-great-great grandwhatevers decided to shoot natives with muskets just for the fun of it

Should tell them that he will do that if they agree that their children and children's children will be sent to jail and punished for any crimes that their parents commit, for generations into the future.

[QUOTE=helifreak;48801193]I personally don't see any point in making people who were born over a hundred years after an event apologise for actions they had no part in.[/QUOTE] It makes sense when you realise we are still very much benefiting from the slave trade and Jamaica is still fucked over by it's results. It's not like it was all over when it was outlawed and everyone found themselves on equal footing.

imo general investment and funding for services such as education, health, etc. should be made instead of handing out lump sums of cash to bring nations and people affected negatively by the trans-atlantic slave trade up to an equitable standard with the western world

While just doling out cash to people is a terrible, terrible idea, especially for people in lower economic segments (it usually just makes their lives worse because of no education, no understanding of what to do with the money), I do feel like there's somewhat of an argument for reparations. For lots of people, not even just those affected by the slave trade. I'd like to see them for ancestors of indentured servants, and for the ancestors of mill or factory workers who were essentially treated like the slaves of their time. The argument being, my ancestor worked themselves literally to death and was able to amass 0 wealth, and thus, no wealth accumulated in my family for that entire generation. That's a lot of time lost. It's a huge setback. Imagine if my forefather had worked himself into the ground, but actually got paid for it? It would have changed the course of my entire family's history. Dude there'd be like huge buildings with my name on them by now. Well, probably not, they might have just pissed it away, but yeah, it could have happened. It's not unreasonable to suggest that replacing a generations' worth of lost wealth could help a family drastically improve their situation. I do also understand the arguments against it that have been stated here, that we have nothing to do with it and nobody should be taking blame or gaining exception from something that they had no part in that took place hundreds of years ago, and I totally see where you're coming from. But I also see that it has absolutely effected where we are now, and so I completely understand why someone would want reparations even though it may seem that we are disconnected from the past. Also it's interesting that slave-owners received refunds for their slaves. I didn't know that. If that's not an argument supporting reparations, I couldn't find one. Because it's like, you compensated their family and restored their wealth from a lost business expense. They had a company that lost its' entire labor pool. Crazy shit happens in business, though, so I mean, that's just a part of the risk involved in doing business. But you can't compensate someone else's family who had entire generations or maybe even several generations' worth of wealth lost? It's kinda unreasonable to argue against it and tell people to "move on".

i agree with what J Paul is saying, which is that western colonialism and exploitation has economically and politically retarded entire nations, structurally, and left them vulnerable and from the beginning, and even if private reparations are a bad solution the sentiment behind them isn't wrong

[QUOTE=J Paul;48802160]While just doling out cash to people is a terrible, terrible idea, especially for people in lower economic segments (it usually just makes their lives worse because of no education, no understanding of what to do with the money), I do feel like there's somewhat of an argument for reparations. [B]For lots of people, not even just those affected by the slave trade. I'd like to see them for ancestors of indentured servants, and for the ancestors of mill or factory workers who were essentially treated like the slaves of their time.[/B] [/QUOTE] My family came from a long line of peasants in Austria and Scotland, it'd be good to get some reparations for the labor they performed for the wealth of their local lord.

They want money, but they're not getting it! :freakout: [editline]1st October 2015[/editline] I want some German cash for the forced labor my grandpa had to do!

[QUOTE=J Paul;48802160]While just doling out cash to people is a terrible, terrible idea, especially for people in lower economic segments (it usually just makes their lives worse because of no education, no understanding of what to do with the money), I do feel like there's somewhat of an argument for reparations. For lots of people, not even just those affected by the slave trade. I'd like to see them for ancestors of indentured servants, and for the ancestors of mill or factory workers who were essentially treated like the slaves of their time. The argument being, my ancestor worked themselves literally to death and was able to amass 0 wealth, and thus, no wealth accumulated in my family for that entire generation. That's a lot of time lost. It's a huge setback. Imagine if my forefather had worked himself into the ground, but actually got paid for it? It would have changed the course of my entire family's history. Dude there'd be like huge buildings with my name on them by now. Well, probably not, they might have just pissed it away, but yeah, it could have happened. It's not unreasonable to suggest that replacing a generations' worth of lost wealth could help a family drastically improve their situation. I do also understand the arguments against it that have been stated here, that we have nothing to do with it and nobody should be taking blame or gaining exception from something that they had no part in that took place hundreds of years ago, and I totally see where you're coming from. But I also see that it has absolutely effected where we are now, and so I completely understand why someone would want reparations even though it may seem that we are disconnected from the past. Also it's interesting that slave-owners received refunds for their slaves. I didn't know that. If that's not an argument supporting reparations, I couldn't find one. Because it's like, you compensated their family and restored their wealth from a lost business expense. They had a company that lost its' entire labor pool. Crazy shit happens in business, though, so I mean, that's just a part of the risk involved in doing business. But you can't compensate someone else's family who had entire generations or maybe even several generations' worth of wealth lost? It's kinda unreasonable to argue against it and tell people to "move on".[/QUOTE] Jamaicans have as much a right to demand reparations for being made victims of the slave trade, which ended almost 2 centuries ago, as France has to demand we pay reparations for invading their land and imprisoning their greatest ever leader on an island around the same time Every single British Prime Minister that was around when there was still an Empire is dead. All of the British slave traders are dead. All of the people responsible for compensating those slave traders are dead. The slave trade was an inevitable part of history that several nations took part in. If some long time descendants lost out, that's tough, sorry. Century old "what if" scenarios are not a basis for demanding apology money.

Hilarious the excuses people throw out nowadays for "Oi give us money!"

If you want reparations, should't you go after the African Warlords that sold slaves in the first place? What next, iberians start demanding reparation from muslins?

[QUOTE=Ragekipz;48802962]If you want reparations, should't you go after the African Warlords that sold slaves in the first place? What next, iberians start demanding reparation from muslins?[/QUOTE] [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_slave_trade[/url] Dunno. The Libyans and Turks should probably give reparations to white people thiugh.